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Cataclysm Currency Changes Formula
Originally Posted by Vaneras (Blue Tracker)
Here's some information on how each of the currencies will be converted in the next content patch. Keep in mind these values may change, and they can get a bit math heavy. Just know that our intent is to appropriately value each mark and provide a conversion we feel is fair.

The following items are immediately converted to gold:


  • Emblem of Heroism = 5.5 gold each
  • Emblem of Valor = 5.5 gold each
  • Emblem of Conquest = 5.5 gold each
  • Badge of Justice = 1.833 gold each

Your New Honor Points total will be the sum of the following amounts:


  • Old Honor * 0.024
  • Old Arena Points * 0.85
  • Battleground Mark of Honor * 2.976
  • Wintergrasp Mark of Honor * 19.08
  • Stone Keeper Shard * 1.6
  • Venture Coin * 3
  • Spirit Shard * 1

Your Justice Points total will be equal to (Emblems of Triumph + Emblems of Frost ) * 2.75

Again, the softcap for both Honor and Justice conversions is 4000 points. This means that if a character converts to above 4,000 points, it will not be possible for them to earn more until they fall below the 4,000 cap.

A hardcap will be implemented in a following patch before Cataclysm's release. At that time, any excess points above 4,000 will be converted as follows:


  • Honor points above 4,000 are converted to gold at a rate of 35 silver per point of Honor.
  • Justice points above 4,000 are converted to gold at a rate of 2 gold per point of Justice.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Cataclysm Currency Changes Formula started by Boubouille View original post
Comments 237 Comments
  1. Thoelle's Avatar
    Will we be able to use Honor and Justice points at launch of Cata ???
  1. DrgnDancer's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by martinkaca View Post
    Who wouldn't use a period(decimal point) to seperate it. And if they did use something else, why?
    Continental Europeans use commas to indicate a decimal point, and periods to separate every third number digit of a long number. So if something cost three thousand Euros and twenty three cents in, say, Germany the price tag would say 3.000,23 It's a bit confusing when you first land in Europe, but you get used to it quickly. Similarly, they find our system a bit confusing sometimes if they haven't seen it before.
  1. LolphDundgren's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Hemrus View Post
    hmm let me think:
    100 X Emblem = 550G
    550G x 3 = 1650 G

    100 Badges = 183.3 Gold

    mean a easy 1833.3 G when ur max on emblems
    NICE!
    Easy? Not for the time it takes running those countless hc runs...
  1. pbean's Avatar
    If you want to make gold with your Emblems of Triumph, rather than Justice Points, please note the following.

    For 20 Emblems of Heroism you can buy a one-coloured epic gem, for 10 Emblems of Heroism you can buy a two-coloured gem.

    Let's say a Scarlet Ruby or Majestic Zircon goes for about 100g on your server, it would value each emblem as 5g (100/20 = 5).

    On my server, the two-coloured gems are about 60-80g. That would value about 6-8g per gem.

    The "value" of each gem upon conversion is 5.5g, which is in between.

    So basically if on your server two-coloured gems go for more than 55g on the AH, buy them and sell them now. For one-coloured gems, they'd have to be 110g or more. Factor in the auction house cut (5%) and you'd have to auction them for 57g89s48c and 115g78s95c respectively.

    And better do it fast, because with this information public, and Cataclysm coming soon, prices may drop significantly.

    EDIT
    Oh lord, I posted this before I read all the comments, but WOW, are some of you guys retarded, or what?

    Why are you so surprised that Frost and Triumph convert into the same thing at the same rate? Come Cataclysm "Frost" will be the lower tier. Currently, Heroism, Valor and Conquest are the lower tiers, and to buy 1 Conquest you need 1 Triumph, for 1 Valor you need 1 Conquest, etc. Even for 1 Triumph you need 1 Frost. With the release of Cataclysm, Emblems of Frost will be no worth more than Emblems of Triumph, because all gear will be old and bad. So it makes sense.

    And what about buying all this Emblem of Frost gear before Cataclysm comes out? Your Emblem of Frost gear will be replaced with level 83 green quest gear. That's right! If you're going to buy more items with your Emblems of Frost right now for non-aesthetic reasons and not for progression, you're just wasting money. Buy Primordial Saronites to sell them to those fools who still want to craft items, or stockpile them so you'll have some Justice Points when Cataclysm comes.

    Then those people who say Justice Points are only there for the transition to Cataclysm? Ha-ha! Surely, you jest? 300 Emblems for a Tier 10 helm? It's harder to believe that they punched in random numbers there. Also, this post right here states very clearly, that there indeed will be two tiers of points. Now Hero points were just renamed to Justice points.

    And finally, no, you won't be able to buy omg uber epics at level 85 with your current stockpiling. You would need 1455 Emblems of Frost and/or Triumph to reach the cap. Furthermore a reasonable amount of 300 emblems (I have about 650 on my character) gives 825 JP, which isn't that much. With a cap of 4000, it stands to reason you'd need about 2000 points for 1 item (so you could stockpile enough for 2 items). So 825 "helps you" but won't "get you an item". And even if it does, it probably will be just 1 "lower tier" item. Furthermore, think about these 2 things:

    - At level 80 you could buy a crafted item level 200 shield. Also there was an item level 200 shield available from Emblems of Heroism. So you were able to buy "an epic" right at level 80 too!
    - You can queue for random dungeons from level 70-80 and get 2 Emblems of Triumph for finishing it. With the cheapest item being 25 Emblems (not even counting the 19 emblem Conquest items), it'd take you 12 days to get an item level 245 epic, right when you ding 80!
    - I won't even mention the current item level 264 epics which you can buy right now upon getting to 80.

    So all in all, why the hell are you not thinking about this clearly?

    Then again, in the end we're all just assuming and guessing. We'll have to see and keep an eye on future announcements.
  1. MonsieuRoberts's Avatar
    I'm sure the money people will make off of this will be put towards Flying, be it their first flight skill purchase, or the 310% speed.

    This won't influence the economy, I'm sure of it.
  1. Sammonoske's Avatar
    Well, I am not spending anything now. Time to save up a ton of badges for a ton of gold when this is implemented.
  1. davep's Avatar
    The cap is 4000, they probably will just raise the cap and increase the prices of the items every tier.
  1. kikovsk's Avatar
    The Emblem to Justice Point conversion is wrong.
    Please note that the correct math is (EoT + EoF) * 2.75, and not EoT * 2.75 + EoF * 2.75. They are different if you round the results before adding.

    Example:
    EoT: 11
    EoF: 21

    The calculator says these will convert to 87 JP when the correct number is 88:
    (11 + 21) * 2.75 = 32 * 2.75 = 88
  1. Vehemence's Avatar
    HOLY SHIT - OVER 9000 GOLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yeah!
  1. mmoccdcfc5f8d6's Avatar
    Im happy about the fact that Venture Coins give so much honor. I have a metric fuckton of those lying aorund.

    And they're not hard to get either :P
  1. crsh1976's Avatar
    I'm ok with not getting a crapload of lv80 epics from current emblems when this goes live, but I'm sort of worried about the rate at which we will earn justice points at lv85 if one piece costs, say, 2k points (I picked a random number here).

    We all know Blizzard got tired of getting told the game is too easy and that they're giving away free epics to every scrub, and purples are supposed to be epic again as we'll likely spend a lot more time in blues before getting greater gear, but let's hope this isn't a complete 180-degree turn because there are no words to describe the cataclysmic tear fest that's going to happen (not to mention the unwanted comeback of elistist "I'm better than you because my gear is purple" crap).

    I'm far from being convinced they can turn the game around like this, seeing the numerous examples we've seen of them caving in and making things easier.
  1. pbean's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by crsh1976 View Post
    I'm ok with not getting a crapload of lv80 epics from current emblems when this goes live, but I'm sort of worried about the rate at which we will earn justice points at lv85 if one piece costs, say, 2k points (I picked a random number here).

    We all know Blizzard got tired of getting told the game is too easy and that they're giving away free epics to every scrub, and purples are supposed to be epic again as we'll likely spend a lot more time in blues before getting greater gear, but let's hope this isn't a complete 180-degree turn because there are no words to describe the cataclysmic tear fest that's going to happen (not to mention the unwanted comeback of elistist "I'm better than you because my gear is purple" crap).

    I'm far from being convinced they can turn the game around like this, seeing the numerous examples we've seen of them caving in and making things easier.
    An epic now costs anywhere between 25 and 95 emblems, let's take a high number, 50, as average. I would reckon (but this is just a guess), that 1500-2000 points would give 1 piece of epic gear at 85. 2000/50 = 40 points per boss kill would be reasonable. I expect about 25-50 points per boss kill (perhaps 25 for "normal" bosses and 50 points for the last boss, in heroics, or 25 per boss and just 25 extra for finishing it, etc).

    But who knows, maybe they plan on mobs giving points too (say 1 point per mob, with 100 mobs per dungeon, i.e. 100 extra points per dungeon).

    I am fairly sure that the rate of earning points will be really close to the current rate of earning Emblems (as an Emblem/Points per boss rate, not and Emblem/Points per hour rate, because content will be harder at the start of course).
  1. mmoc12fd2e0285's Avatar
    So, by the calculator i get around 10000 new honor points, but the cap is 4k. Can anyone tell me, if im correct:
    that means im getting 4000 new honor points + 6000*0.35= around 2k gold.

    and what will you be able to buy with those 4k new honor points?
  1. mmocd12cd7479a's Avatar
    1121g79s60c for my old BoJ? Deal!
  1. mmoc5011fe1361's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by pbean View Post
    I am fairly sure that the rate of earning points will be really close to the current rate of earning Emblems (as an Emblem/Points per boss rate, not and Emblem/Points per hour rate, because content will be harder at the start of course).
    One of the nice things with this new system is that there's a possibility to award extra points for harder bosses, make the system more fine-grained than the current one emblem per boss if they so desire. Those numbers can also be adjusted when new heroics are released.
  1. snowcrash512's Avatar
    What I would like to know is how does the conversion look with prices on the PTR.

    IE if say a t9 chest piece costs 50 badges now is it the direct equivalent of justice points to buy the same thing on the PTR?
  1. mmocef71e99c15's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Thoelle View Post
    Will we be able to use Honor and Justice points at launch of Cata ???
    Yes you will be able to buy the lowest level of "emblem gear", just like you could buy lowest level PvP gear when WotLK dropped with honor points you saved up in TBC if you were honor capped when LK shipped.

    However (again - just like with honor gear when WotLK dropped), the new gear will be much more expensive, meaning your precious Frost emblems WILL translate to helping you buy gear in Cata, but will not be sufficient for very much. This was the case as well when the new WotLK PvP gear was way more expensive (while using the same points system as before) than anything you had been able to buy back in TBC.

    For example, let's say you have 1000 Justice Points when Cata is about to ship. This might allow you to buy some Icecrown gear (264). Or you can save your Justice Points for when you hit 85. But the new "heroics" gear in Cata is going to cost say 2000 each, so your precious savings from Frost/Triumph badges will have lost much of it's value.

    Heroics in Cata are going to drop more than the current 1 emblem per boss. My guess is that bosses in heroics are going to drop 5 Justice Points each. My reason for making this guess is that they chose to let Triumph/Frost badges convert at a rate of 2.75. When a new expansion hits, all values tend to be roughly doubled - the amount of gold, the cost of honor gear, the stats on your items and so on. Everything gets doubled, pretty much. Tbhis is obviously speculation on my behalf (that heroics bosses will drop 5 Justice Points each).

    Also, just like when WotLK shipped, there will be Valor Points which gives you the finest raid gear and which you cannot get from doing heroics. In WotLK these dropped from 25-man raids. In Cata, becuase they are equalizing 10-man and 25-man raiding, Valor Points will drop from both 10-mans and 25-mans.

    To sum up:

    This will happen when Cata ships:

    Justice Points can buy you your first epics in Cata.
    You can save up Justice Points (JP) from Wrath of The Lich King, but the conversion rate is kind of bad and thus your measly WotLK JPs will not suffice for much.
    You will get Justice Points from running heroics in Cata. This will be a much more powerful way to get those points.

    Valor points buys you the really hawt gear in Cata.
    Raid bosses (10-man and 25-man) will drop Valor Points.
    You will get a few Valor Points from doing the daily Random Heroic, just like you get a few Frost badges today.

    Then, after patch 4.1 when a new raid tier is released, all your then Valor Points will be converted into Justice Points and you will sit on a lot of Justice Points, and zero Valor Points. That conversion will then happen over and over when a new raid tier (or expansion) hits. No justice points 8or emblems) will ever be deleted, however, due to them inflating the numbers at every expansion, they value will be less and less of points hard earned long ago.

    ---------- Post added 2010-09-15 at 10:15 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Narshe View Post
    Likely that Valor points will drop in both heroics and the first teir of raiding, just like Wotlk with Heroism emblems.
    That comparison is misleading.

    This is how they've stated it will be/was:

    In WotLK:
    Heroism emblems drops from heroics and 10-man raids.
    Valor emblems drops from 25-man raids.

    In Cata:
    Heroism points (later renamed to Justice Points) drops from heroics.
    Valor points drop from raids. This will include both 10-man and 25-man.

    The reason they changed the name from Heroism to Justice for the low level points is probably that "heroic" is supposed to mean hard when it comes to raids - something that evolved along the way of WotLK. When WotLK shipped, there wasn't anything such as heroic raids - "heroic" then only meant "heroic 5-mans", which means it then made sense to have Heroism emblems drop from "Heroics". Now, they need a more neutral word becuase "heroic" can mean several things. They chose "Justice".
  1. Calaba's Avatar
    Ok, here's the maths:
    1 epic gem = 10000 honor = 240 new honor.
    240 honor x 35 silver for the trade-in = 84g.
    Conclusion: Going over the honor cap is ok, you won't lose much when they give you the gold.
    For arena points, it's a good deal- you're getting 85 new honor points for every 100 arena points, instead of handing them in for 2000 old honor, or 48 honor points. That's double what you'll get if you trade them in now.
    Stonekeepers shards are converted for wintergrasp commendation amounts, so you don't lose anything there.
    And be happy to be getting anything from venture company coins and spirit shards at all

    So, if you're going WAY over the honor cap, you're fine there, and need to do nothing at all, just watch the cash roll in. Unless, of course, they reset honor points. In which case, SELL SELL SELL!!!

    Meanwhile, if you've got a few emblems of triumph, or emblems of frost kicking around, SELL NOW. The amount you'll get for going over the cap SIMPLY WON'T BE WORTH IT, and the price of saronites and epic gems is going to plummet when these changes go live. Prices are going down, and the gear you can get from them right now will be no better than lvl 80 greens, so cash in soon. Unless, of course, you still need gear from them. It also won't be worth it to grind out 5-mans to hit the cap. You'll be better off AoE grinding regular mobs for gold. (Unless you're going for achievements or something.) The reason? Crafted lvl85 gear, bought off the AH. These new points simply won't get you anything better.

    Of course, this is all based on various assumptions, including server economies, and PTR stuff being subject to change.
  1. Duticyaa's Avatar
    So, I'm the only one who's going to trade in all my Emblem of whatever now and get myself about 8-10g pr. emblem from gems, instead of waiting for them to convert into 5.5g pr emblem?
  1. Mendol's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Duticyaa View Post
    So, I'm the only one who's going to trade in all my Emblem of whatever now and get myself about 8-10g pr. emblem from gems, instead of waiting for them to convert into 5.5g pr emblem?
    I'm guessing everybody is going to be doing this.

    Yay cheap gems...which might be useful for leveling JC from 450-475 or so at the beginning of Cata if the prices are 'right' compared to the new 'green' quality gems.

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