WoW Lost 300k Subscribers, Patch 4.3 this year, Blizzcon 2011 Tickets, Blue Posts

Originally Posted by phai

It isn't even worth the effort to say it.
Haven't we got used (and bored) to the recycling philosophy Blizzard shows since TBC?

I suppose...their pets are often indicative of looming expansions, though, so I'm not sure what to make of this.

not strange , this xpan has brought very little new things
most time went into rehashing the old world , after you leveled very shortly for 5levels and done the the basic gear thing all that is left is raids , doing really boring dailies or standing around in orgri looking exacly the same as allmost every other damn person of the same class
Wow is becomming to repentitive and for some reason feels a bit cheap now like little effort was really put into it , something i didn't feel with the previous xpans, nothing is happening it seems, ie like where the hell is deadwing ? just flying around buring random crap ?
pvp is imo in a pretty sad and unbalanced state , 4.1 just brought more rehashed content most of us have done plenty of times before and 4.2 just a small raid. The economy is going over the top , especially if you come in as a new player , there is no way in hell new players can affort some of the stuff they need like glyphs or even some basic green gear.
Blizz seems to be digging their own grave if they continue down this path , some good new mmo's are on the horizon and unless blizz start pumping out some quality again the decline will continue and probally increase speed with the new games comming.
Still like some aspects of the game but other than that this is an xpan that can't end soon enough imo so we can hopefully get some quality again.
I hope they will turn the tide with 4.3 but i'm not getting my hopes up unfortunally

Originally Posted by Tang

This is true. WoW is far from dead. I don't even think you can say it's dying. WoW is a middle aged game, past its prime and in decline, but with plenty of years left in it.

People are too quick to announce that something is "dead" when what they really mean is "it's no longer the hottest thing around."

No WoW isn't dead. WoW can survive with only 1 million players. The decline in numbers show that people are slowly getting fed up with the direction Blizzard is taking this game. Actually if Blizzard really wanted to they could grow this game even further beyond the 12 million mark. They are obviously not pushing for it and they rather just let this game slowly decline in numbers in favor of their next pet project Titan.

It's this attitude from Blizzard why people like me are posting on the forums. You like a game, you put time in it, you give feedback to Blizzard. However Blizzard obviously doesn't want to put more effort in the game. They could renew the graphic engine, make a PVP talent tree and balance PVP. Bring changes to the game mechanics so the game evolves even further. Rather than that Blizzard is abandoning ship, selling sparkling mounts to every fool it can before the ship sinks.

It's the lack of innovation, the lack of doing something with player feedback, and the increase of Blizzard just trollin their own player base.

The lack of proper respect for the comunity is what makes people happy to see that people are finally not taking this crap anymore and leaving.

Everything created has an end. But mmo's have long lives. Lets take the original mmo "Everquest" EQ started in 1999, at the height, in 2003, it had 450.000 subscribers. EQ has 17 expansions and a new expansion on the horizon, currently 14 servers strong. EQ is 12 years old and its still standing. I would wager that WoW will live longer and stronger than EQ.

~1 million sups times 15 bucks = ouchy

Originally Posted by mikisulu

I would wager that WoW will live longer and stronger than EQ.

Perhaps, but EQ1 is still No#1 on my best-of-all-times MMO List

About 900k people quit in over a year.

Hmm, i guess a great amount of those players were new players, many other could have started at WotLK, but still in 900k players a really HUGE about of players would be old players.

Even if Blizzard says that they are gaining a lot of new players from the new trial system, it's not the same. A solid group of 5 hard core players do much more the job for Blizz than 10 random players who play 3 months per year, because this is not only about the money. The money goes to Blizzard but the quality of the game goes to us.


Here comes the consequences...
If the game losses the players who spend more time and expect more from the game in order to gain those who don't care much more than getting epics and buying mounts... then there comes the real huge problem, since the game is slowly turning into a really casual game on it's 90%, just the other 10% is still hard core, the Hard Modes of raids, and not even all of them...


So, as some people said below, is not 900k people who were complaining cos they didn't have what they wanted.

I am seeing alot of "WoW is dieing/dead" comments.

I have been playing WoW when it was a very young and still quite buggy product with an uncertain future ahead. But it had life, alot of it and thus when I say WoW is dead I am not referring to the number of subscribers. The number of subscribers do not breathe life into a game, in fact the more you have the more automated, homogenized, machinized and streamlined it gets. It's the nature of the things, you cannot run a hive without that. But it feels dead and this is a motivation killer for me, it has died somewhere in the heat of the troubles of WotLK.
Thus I strongly disagree with the notion that losing subscribers is a bad thing. I am pretty sure that WoW's financial model isn't based around profitable at 11+ millions subscribers only. Two things will happen: WoW will lose subscribers to potential competitors no matter the quality of their products and there will be some real competition, something you just couldn't reduce to copy&paste-able features but really something which offers alternatives. This will in the end mean that Blizzard's WoW developers have to re-learn the creative thinking process in terms. If they cannot do that and prefer to leave that to the upcoming MMO of Blizzard then it will dwindle in numbers and settle at a point where the game becomes manageable in terms of community demands and quality however without the star qualities it had at release but probably closer to the MMO standards it previously set.

Originally Posted by planetchips

I didn't bring up the news, you did, I simply replied to your inconsistency. Your first post was just insulting people and making yourself sound superior because you don't play a game anymore. I HAVE deviated from my point, but only because I thought you were an arrogant ass, now I realize that you're simply a fool.



"Yes i am arrogant and now to your point"
"now to your point"
"Yes i am arrogant"
/facepalm



Behavioral Science. I don't think you know the definition of journalism and media. Journalism is the practice of investigation and reporting events. Media(under communication) is the storage, dissemination, and broadcast of information. You can learn more at your local community college. While you're there, I advise you take a Critical Thinking and Logic class.

This is so sad i can't believe i am reading it. Journalism is indeed a practice of investigation and reporting events. But every University that has journalism as a programme to study also has doctors, professors, lectors and other ranks whos scientific work is all about studiyng journalism and its phenomenon and then pass on their learnings to new students who either becomes journalists or professors within the field, or even both. Media and communications are a different field and it's called exactly that. And it has the same as the above. They are closley related, and both are crossing over the borders but they are 2 different fields. Media is also what you wrote it was but also so much more than that.

I know very well the the definition of media and journalism and your reply only shows me that you hardly know anything about it. Because you are trying to indicate that I am wrong. You can google words and then say "hey this is it he is wrong", it's out of my hands what you think or not. If that is how you want to categorize journalism and media you only show how narrow minded you are. By drifting back and forth between what you think only shows that you are incapable to participate in this discussion and therefor i see no point in continuing.

You can write a reply, i will read it, but i wont reply to it.
Take your best shot

Originally Posted by Xilurm

That means you hate it. WoW IS what it has become and its not changing back. It will move forward. Nostalgia is meant to be what it is......Nostalgia.

If you dont like it dont play it simple as that.

The game doesn't have to be what it's become. It's completely unoptimized, the current raiding tiers are totally uninspired. The Devs were seriously on heroin when they decided to reverse all the positive changes they made during Lich King in favor of a more exclusive raid environment. You know what exclusivity means? Not everyone can do it. It breeds contempt and locks people into playing with other people that may not want to play with or may not even like. It creates cliques within large guilds where those closest to the officers are rewarded for being pets and those that aren't willing to kiss ass long enough get nothing, and that's completely ignoring the fact that until 4.2 T11 normal modes were completely overtuned. It's called a normal mode for a reason. If a large percentage of normal players are unable to clear normal modes, clearly they are higher than normal difficulty. Save the heroic difficulty for the heroic modes. Let the heroic mode players go directly into the next heroic mode tiers, let the heroic mode gear be higher ilvl than the new normal mode tier, that way normal mode guilds still have reasons to go back and clear old heroic mode content, but don't make a game system in which normal players aren't compensated adequately for a reasonable investment of time.

And you're right, 1/2 way through 4.0 I knew Cataclysm was a bomb and quit playing til 4.1. During 4.1 T11 raids still weren't puggable even with Zandalari gear, and with 4.2, a new tier of gear, and lots of raiders with open IDs for Tier 11 content, it's actually finally in line with where it should've been all along, but guess what? For alot of people that's too little too late, and they won't be coming back. I spoke with my wallet, because that's the only thing Blizzard listens to anymore, and they made changes that directly effected my gameplay because of it.

I am new to this forum but I have to admit that I could not resist handing my own six pence on this matter especially considering that I have been playing WoW since it's inception.

I think that Blizzard made a marvellous game in the begining. I enjoyed exploring the world, doing quests and looking forward to get my mount, at that time, at level 40 - it was awsome.

I eventually levelled up and started raiding, eventually moving ahead to 40 men raids with one of the best guilds on the server. The comittment was intensive - too intensive to be considered sustainable to a person who has a job and has to wake up every morning to sustain his family - not to mention his social life - but was it challenging..yes was it enjoyable ...yes - it was NEW - It was a new experience for me and my friends which later joined in the fun.

Which brings me to the first error Blizzard did ? Why did Blizzard do away with 40 men raids - they were awsome ..why ? Couldnt they have left them and introduced the 20 men and the 10 men along with the 40 men ?

When 40 men raids were abolished, many dedicated players left because some guilds could not sustain all the raiders - crossborder friendships built since inception were lost.

BC was introduced - and compared to its predeseccor it felt artificial although the blood elves were awsome, my personal opnion ofc.

But ever since then I turned casual for a couple of years eventually being pulled back to hard core raiding by some friends of mine. Which raiding eventually stopped with WotLK and have been casual ever since.

In my humble opinion the game has been losing its momentun not due to petty issues like loot and stuff, but due to lack of ingenuity in game design, lack of imagination and new ideas, new concept dungeons. New Terrain (FL looks like previous areas except for the colour change). Raiding can easily be made more challenging - not by just having two modes (normal and Heroic) but also by making it more time challenging like having a gigantic dungeon which takes two weeks to clear - making your way to the first section in the first then moving to the end conquests in the second - a dungeon expedition of sorts. This is just an idea ofc. Instead of making bosses harder or having people farm their way to an area doing the same thing all over again day in day out - you can create something similar to what I am putting forward. Epics can remain available as they are - but don't give them just for grinding - offer a challenge.

Well there are a hundred and one things I can mention which have dragged this game to this stage but many of them have been already mentioned but I would like to re-indicate some of them:

The Graphics : water is awsome but the world seems dead compared to many of the new MMORPGs coming out - no ambient movement whatsoever makes the game comic-like. You can't leave the graphics as they are - I noted genuine attempts to have graphics boosted but I am sorry Blizzard, it has not been enouph, although the water is awsome.

The Avatars: need to be upgraded especially the ones which have been with us since the begining. Infact I must state - this is a must especially when one notices some NPCs which are just plain awsome ...why shouldnt players aspire to have his avatar on the same level graphically?

Recyling Bosses: Stop doing this - it is making the game extensively boring - Ragnaros was Ragnaros in Molten Core - having him back in FL is silly - you can say that to the new kids who play the game now - but not to the old timers who are not willing to give up on the game just yet - for us, who work and thus give value to our money which we spend, that's a no-go.

Stop instancing the Game - its making everyone losing the feeling of the an open ended world for which WoW was highly acclaimed for in the begining.

I think if WoW stops innovating itself, it shall die much faster then Blizzard expects - and with the forthcoming MMORPGs such as SWOTR and GUILD WARS 2 and many others coming out - this will certainly not help.

UNLESS....there is a WoW 2 heading our way and we don't know it !!!!

Originally Posted by The Moonkin

Forget two. They're going 3 or 4. Plus atleast 2 dungeons.

Seriously though, I think that Blizzard will pull their weight in this patch, and for the 300k sub lost, in Q3, we have - WoW Brazil, Chinese Cata, 4.2 Resubs, so I think they game will stalemate there.

4.2 has already been out for a while, i think the people who were going to resub already did... so that is a legit net loss of 300k

Originally Posted by goltnum9

Noone can see that the world is on economic crisis? People are not buying as before, and this will affect the society of the online gamers. People will stop buying subscriptions when they can't afford to take some water(2 and 3 euro in some European Countries) and something to eat(a walk to the market or a take away food will easily steal you 10euro) to eat. So that sums a 12-13 euro.
Make a guess then if wow is the factor here

I said it multiple times already.

But ... surprise ... this is a gaming forum, so people tend to look only through their very narrow minded gaming glasses.


Some kids really think that the nerving of a class (in their view) or the design of a raid or dungeon would influence the game by dropping 3 or 6 % in a quarter.

If CATA REALLY was bad, the game would have lost 50% of its player base already.

6% - 9% drop after EVERYBODY tried and came back last year is peanuts in retention drops.


Just look at all those WOW killers duds we had to endure during the last 6 years. They dried up with 80% drops after the same period. And don't call the BS of Rift either (closing 30% of their servers and still a huge drops in players activity expressed in multiple double digit drops).

No you are right of course: the 3% drops is a natural cause coming from an economic problematic era (China still has 9% growth while we are on the brink of a recession). Same goes for shifting markets. Going free to play has got MORE influence on the paid subs market than ANY content patch Blizzard could launch ...

Nintendo 3DS is a catastroph compared to the IPAd: shifting markets/economy had much more influence than any design Blizzard could put in into a 7 year old game.

I wrote here my opinion near the time when cata got released here, probably was too harsh. People got bored of doing the same raid concepts, getting the same kind of gear (tiers), having the same goals. Like for example if you want to get full epic (a goal), you want full tier 9, etc. Once you get that, it is losing it's value and it won't become a goal again or at least it will fade. The same goes with progress, PVE is about gear and progress, not really about story. Secondly, they require a high amount of time for no real goal. There are those lost subscribers. What probably lured the gamers to play wow was the networking game, playing with other people, then getting epics, having a goal. One expansion can end that feeling for most of the players and probably wow had it's peak in wrath. Now they really need to come up with something amazing in order to get the lost subscribers because this is the playerbase, there are no other gamers.

Originally Posted by Blooddeity

No WoW isn't dead. WoW can survive with only 1 million players. The decline in numbers show that people are slowly getting fed up with the direction Blizzard is taking this game.

Oh, look! Someone who apparently knows the exact reason why each and every one of those 900k people left the game!
Wait. No he doesn't. He's assuming. Because he's an ass.

I guess those 300k are all shamans.

That 300k are priests. They couldn't find any spirit cloth in Firelands so they ventured to a dungeon in another game.

Originally Posted by iliketohealsometimes

Oh, look! Someone who apparently knows the exact reason why each and every one of those 900k people left the game!
Wait. No he doesn't. He's assuming. Because he's an ass.

It's impossible to know why they left the game. Suffice it to say they were there before and gone now, so clearly the game doesn't have the value to them that it did prior to Cataclysm.

Originally Posted by Kaeleena

The game doesn't have to be what it's become. It's completely unoptimized, the current raiding tiers are totally uninspired. The Devs were seriously on heroin when they decided to reverse all the positive changes they made during Lich King in favor of a more exclusive raid environment. You know what exclusivity means? Not everyone can do it. It breeds contempt and locks people into playing with other people that may not want to play with or may not even like. It creates cliques within large guilds where those closest to the officers are rewarded for being pets and those that aren't willing to kiss ass long enough get nothing, and that's completely ignoring the fact that until 4.2 T11 normal modes were completely overtuned. It's called a normal mode for a reason. If a large percentage of normal players are unable to clear normal modes, clearly they are higher than normal difficulty. Save the heroic difficulty for the heroic modes. Let the heroic mode players go directly into the next heroic mode tiers, let the heroic mode gear be higher ilvl than the new normal mode tier, that way normal mode guilds still have reasons to go back and clear old heroic mode content, but don't make a game system in which normal players aren't compensated adequately for a reasonable investment of time.

And you're right, 1/2 way through 4.0 I knew Cataclysm was a bomb and quit playing til 4.1. During 4.1 T11 raids still weren't puggable even with Zandalari gear, and with 4.2, a new tier of gear, and lots of raiders with open IDs for Tier 11 content, it's actually finally in line with where it should've been all along, but guess what? For alot of people that's too little too late, and they won't be coming back. I spoke with my wallet, because that's the only thing Blizzard listens to anymore, and they made changes that directly effected my gameplay because of it.

Positive changes? People were all bashing Lich King because it was "too" easy and now they are praising it while they are bashing Cata. Believe me when i tell its gonna be the exact same thing with the next expansion. I can't help but think people are leaving wow because they dont know what they want anymore.

Not surprised at a second loss of subscribers, Blizz did push out 4.2 before the end of Q2 in hope of limiting the hemorrhage, but we're close to 1m subs lost in the 6 months following the release of a new expansion. I don't think WoW is dying, but no matter how you want to spin it, this confirms there's something wrong with this expansion.

300k druids, rejuv one button spam doesn't work anymore