Raid Finder Loot Exploit Suspensions, Paragon Apology

Originally Posted by Goliad

Does their cheating affect you? Why can't people play this game for their own amusement? Who cares how many guilds exploited, they will get their punishment and it will affect you exactly 0%. All these people saying glad they got suspended or glad they got their comeuppance are just being silly. 99% of the people who play wow do not care, will not care, heck most do not even know who paragon is, nor do they care. It's a game, have fun playing your game. If your game is made better by other people's misery, then you need a new game.

Of course it doesn't affect anyone's gameplay.

A lot of things happen in this world that don't affect others, but that doesn't make them less wrong/right and it doesn't mean we can't have opinions about it.

So people get punished for Blizzards mistake in not finding this bug.....

Originally Posted by Glarious

why does an apology from paragon deserve to be a main topic on mmo champion? what do we care, they messed up and they kept doing it ok we got it. but does this "apology" really deserve to be on the main page of mmo-champion?? i mean seriously theres other threads for this, why not post it in each of them instead of posting it on the front page.. this isnt news about any game, just the players behind it... Why isnt my rogue ever on the main page huh?

Because I don't care about your Rogue, but I care about Paragon and a lot of players I have talked to about the exploit in the game expressed a large disappointment in one of the most famed guilds sinking to this level.

World first kills is the only real form of sport and competition in this game, you'll have to deal with it just like I have to deal with popular soccer matches interrupting my usual radio programs.

How about not cheating in the first place, and living up to your guild name? par·a·gon [ párrə gòn ] 1.example of excellence: somebody or something that is the very best example of something2.large unflawed diamond: a perfect diamond that weighs at least 100 carats3.large perfectly spherical pearl: an extremely large pearl that is a perfect sphereSynonyms: model, shining example, epitome, archetype, quintessence, paradigm, exemplar, ideal

Originally Posted by rdj

This post from Hermanni on the Paragon forums pretty much sums up why an apology was useless and why Paragon are no better than the rest:

Not really, we have no business in what other people do with their characters. Hes only right for trolling you if you think you are better than him

Also, post like this on mmo-champion is the reason we call it wow-champion.

So, how many in main DREAM Paragon are banned for tomorrows HC race start?

Okay I apologize but I'm confused about the logistics of these "personalized" LFR runs. Does that mean that they all have 25 alts to run each char through on? Can someone explain it to me?

These people got what they deserve and their "apology" means jack shit.

While unfortunate, the apologize issues is far more responsible and dignified than what we get from our esteemed politicians, business men, celebrities and other bastions of society.Paragon admitted wrong-doing outright, apologized for it responsibly and did fill anyone with that bull of "we're only sorry if you were offended by what we did".I'm not impressed by what they did, but the apology was appropriate and rightly spoken. And imagine, gamers issuing more sincere and meaningful apologies than most of the crooked politicians, rapists and thieves.

Doublepost. Disregard this!

lol they apologize after they actually get banned, before that they were just saying "it was accidental blah blah"

pure bullshit.. i got 8 days while others got 3 while others got nothing

so they take a week off.
they log in and still have more loot than anyone.

strip em i say.
then let em gear up like everyone else is supposed to.
take the loot, give em a week off and take it from anyone that was in there doing that as well.

they're "leet".. they will get over it.

omg guys paragon cheated, in a game, filled with pixels, omg, omg, omg, omg, and omg!!!!!

Originally Posted by Sarac

Not really, we have no business in what other people do with their characters. Hes only right for trolling you if you think you are better than him

He wasn't trolling me, he was trolling the people in the forum who were saying their gear had been taken away. This was before the suspensions were handed out and before Blizzard started stripping them of the gear they obtained through the exploit. It just show the arrogance these players have and they could care less they cheated, thus, the apology doesn't mean shit, just trying to save their asses.

Originally Posted by ganush

It was about trinkets and tier only. Trinkets have never worked the better ilvl is better so there were definitely some trinket upgrades or situational trinkets to be had. As for tier, some of the 4pc tank bonuses would likely come in handy for progression and having full t13 even at ilvl 384 would allow them to seamlessly switch from t12 to t13 without that period of time running 2x 2 set bonuses. They likely wouldn't use 4 set 384 over 4 set 391, but when they get a couple of heroic t13 pieces, switching the last two 391's to 384's and getting your 4 pc will likely be a dps increase.

The tier sets for this patch are quite powerful, and they nerfed some of the previous tier pieces to ensure that people wouldn't hold out upgrading. As an elemental shaman, my 2pc was nerfed from incredibly powerful to almost useless, and the 4PC is only a minor dps increase (although it was fun being able to jump around and move 95% of dps time as a caster).

Originally Posted by snuffglops

"The fact that others were using it as well is no justification for doing it ourselves."

I just cannot agree with that. I could have gotten away with that statement. ALL of my friends in this game could have gotten away with that statement. But Paragon is probably the best PvE guild in the world. They're going to do virtually everything they can to keep it that way. When they see that other people are taking advantage of a bug that could give them a decent enough edge to get a world first, they're going to take it. And so, if I were leading Paragon, that would have been my reply to Blizzard. "We do everything we can to remain the most competitive PvE guild in the world. If other people are taking advantage of a bug that Blizzard should have gotten fixed on PTR, then we're going to do the same thing."

It kind of reminds of people taking steroids in Major League Baseball. By the time the era was at an end, you had so many players saying that they were doing it just because so many other people were as well, and they didn't want to lose their edge in the game.

So, you're saying that since other people cheat in a game, others should cheat as well to stay competative? That's just terrible. Just because those MLB players were never caught, doesn't make it less deplorable. I have zero respect for those who knowingly cheat the system. Yeah, got it, the top guilds who exploited and then banned probably still would've been on top even if they didn't cheat. But, they did. It creates a disgusting and unhealthy competition environment when all you do is look for ways around the system. Do it right and earn it. By Paragon taking full responsibility and accepting punishment shows maturity from them. They don't blame anyone else, and the shouldn't.

One of my first Sergeants told me when I joined the Army: "If you can look at yourself in the mirror, tell yourself you gave it your all and you did it with integrity, then no one can hold you back. If you can't then, you need to man up and do it right."

To everyone being surprised that Paragon abused this exploit have you forgotten their T11 HM Atramedes kill where they had everyone go into that little hallway to avoid the sonar discs.

omg guys paragon cheated!