WoW Down to 9.6 Million Subscribers

Originally Posted by Chry

Personally, I don't have issues with rep grinds themselves, I understand they are part of the game and have always been part of the game... I do, however, have an issue with how they were dealt with in this expansion. Shoving copious amounts of dailies down the players' throats was a god-awful, lazy, non-innovative, and overall bad decision made by Blizzard as a whole, which is shown by the massive loss in subscription numbers.

Losing players who can't cope with Blizzard attempting to make the world necessary to progress is not a loss, it's a gain to the game and community as a whole

Originally Posted by Tommassive

I wonder what this all means. Financial numbers seem very strong. Be nice to see them make a statement about the drop off.

It was addressed on the actual call. The majority of the loss was attributed to China, while western markets were pretty much stable

Great this means after patch back to standard 10-11 millons ?¿?

Originally Posted by Sarthan

When was its Golden Age bud? In Vanilla? Because that is wrong we had less people playing. I doubt you even played from launch or Burning Crusade.


WoW Is dying!!!!!! OMFG Who cares I still find plenty of people to run my 25 man guild.

I believe WotLK was wows all time high for subs. If you are defining WoW "golden age" by number of subs, that is it. They wont ever be able to reproduce that level of excitement/anticipation as the Lich King brought into the game though.


However, I consider TBC to be WoW's "golden age" (from a raiders PoV). Karazhan, Vashj, KT, Illidan, KJ. So many awesome raids and lore figures.

Originally Posted by Raiju

If you never want to sell a game again and have everyone in appropriate countries get refunds by law, sure.

Also I'm not sure if anyone would believe you if you advertised it. That or false advertising, another thing you'd have legal issues with.

But please, go on about how your idea of expansions is both practiced and normal, and not DLC.

I saw you said they dropped the first quarter, it still means nothing. Getting sales when you release a game means NOTHING. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. Look at Diablo 3. Look at Bioware. Getting sales means nothing if that franchise is a dying shadow afterwards. WoW hasn't had that happen (yet, although I don't believe it will), but basing anything off immediate sales is a fanboy argument at best when it comes to subscription games.

He also stated that they hit 11 million in BC in response to someone saying they only had 6 million (and that 11 was the peak). Both are correct. He never said it was the HIGHEST, just that it peaked. Peaked. Because it was the peak then.

there would be no legal problems... this would be like you trying to argue something isnt a book if its only 50 pages long, an expansion is as its called an EXPANSION of the content within the game, dlc is an EXPANSION of the content within a game. an expansion can be small or big as can dlc its the same thing and all that matters is how much a company puts into it.

the only place i would get in trouble is if i tried to sell it in china since in china you cannot charge for more content thats why they get all the expansions for free.

also diablo 3 is not "dead" its a single player game and there are still lots of people playing it and it sold alot. im not sure what bioware has to do with any of this unless you're talking about mass effect 3? which was regarded as a pretty good game except for the ending.

and no he said that wow never had more than 11 million subs.

Originally Posted by Zergal

If you can only judge the worth of something based on numbers, i really wouldn't want to be in your shoes. What offers the better food for example, a 5 Star gastronomic restaurant or Mcdonalds? Obviously the gastronomic restaurant, but meanwhile everyone flocks at Mcdonalds to eat that garbage.

Same logic can apply to WoW, Vanilla and BC were meant for the real MMO fans, then WolTK came to cater to the "MMO-Fastfood" crowd. Yes it meant more subs, but much less quality.

I seem to remember a shitload of Wotlk hate on these forums and many others throughout the expansion. People whined consistently about Blizz rehashing old content, cutting corners and the raids being too easy PvE wise and PvP wise people just whined like bitches because of DKs. A few years later and they just remember one season and the Ulduar tier+ ICC before it had been around for ages and it's the best thing ever.

Originally Posted by Zergal

If you can only judge the worth of something based on numbers, i really wouldn't want to be in your shoes. What offers the better food for example, a 5 Star gastronomic restaurant or Mcdonalds? Obviously the gastronomic restaurant, but meanwhile everyone flocks at Mcdonalds to eat that garbage.

Same logic can apply to WoW, Vanilla and BC were meant for the real MMO fans, then WolTK came to cater to the "MMO-Fastfood" crowd. Yes it meant more subs, but much less quality.

Welcome to the world of subjectivity. It's what this thread can be summed up to. Both ways unfortunately.

Sorry NO refunds. Enjoy your stay. Get something to keep you entertained because you'll be here for a while.

Originally Posted by lazzy

I think Blizzard is lying about the real numbers

We already know they are not accurate "sub numbers" since many of the Asian countries are not paying on monthly basis.

Originally Posted by Zergal

If you can only judge the worth of something based on numbers, i'd really don't want to be in your shoes. What offers the better food for example, a 5 Star gastronomic restaurant or Mcdonalds? Obviously the gastronomic restaurant, but meanwhile everyone flocks at Mcdonalds to eat that garbage.

Same logic can apply to WoW, Vanilla and BC were meant for the real MMO fans, then WolTK came to cater to the "MMO-Fastfood" crowd. Yes it meant more subs, but much less quality.

I'm in complete disagreement that WotLK content was of "much less quality" than any previous expansions, simply because it was not. There is no point in arguing over the subject as it is a very opinion-related discussion. (Again, numbers are the only sets of data we can be consistent with when discussing this situation)

Also, apples to oranges much? People eat at McDonalds because it's cheaper and more widely available, not because it's more popular. WoW has sustained its subscription model every since day 1, and has been widely available since.

Originally Posted by vokey

I seem to remember a shitload of Wotlk hate on these forums and many others throughout the expansion. People whined consistently about Blizz rehashing old content, cutting corners and the raids being too easy PvE wise and PvP wise people just whined like bitches because of DKs. A few years later and they just remember one season and the Ulduar tier+ ICC before it had been around for ages and it's the best thing ever.

The only difference is that Blizzard is now LOSING subscribers, not GAINING.

Originally Posted by phyx

Did they announce over 10mil without including Chinas MoP returning players?

'Cause if those players were counted in, this is a bigger loss than i thought.

Yes, the previous number was pre China launch IIRC. That means that they would have gained more before losing. IMH, it's not a good number. I would hazard a guess that we did not see such a drop off this early after the release of previous expansions, if there was any drop off at all.

Originally Posted by Eliandal

It was addressed on the actual call. The majority of the loss was attributed to China, while western markets were pretty much stable

Ofc western markets were "stable" over Xmas and new year with BLizz offering 50% off MOP in middle of December. We all know these are not the current numbers. And we also know China dont have Xmas.

Originally Posted by Zergal

If you can only judge the worth of something based on numbers, i really wouldn't want to be in your shoes. What offers the better food for example, a 5 Star gastronomic restaurant or Mcdonalds? Obviously the gastronomic restaurant, but meanwhile everyone flocks at Mcdonalds to eat that garbage.

Same logic can apply to WoW, Vanilla and BC were meant for the real MMO fans, then WolTK came to cater to the "MMO-Fastfood" crowd. Yes it meant more subs, but much less quality.

Edit : looking at your armory, i guess you actually fit in the "fast food gaming" crowd so i guess that explains a lot.

no.... vanilla wow was meant to cater to the "mcdonalds crowd" or do you not remember all the everquest players who if you told yhem you played wow would tease you for playing the easy game.

Originally Posted by Chry

I'm in complete disagreement that WotLK content was of "much less quality" than any previous expansions, simply because it was not. There is no point in arguing over the subject as it is a very opinion-related discussion. (Again, numbers are the only sets of data we can be consistent with when discussing this situation)

Also, apples to oranges much? People eat at McDonalds because it's cheaper and more widely available, not because it's more popular. WoW has sustained its subscription model every since day 1, and has been widely available since.



The only difference is that Blizzard is now LOSING subscribers, not GAINING.

It doesn't matter if sub numbers is the only data we have. It is still not directly tied to quality.

I've played wow since release and I've really loved the game for a long time. I've left recently since my server is absolutely dead and I know of at least 10 people on that server who have left for the exact same reason. I would come back in a heartbeat if blizz decided to merge servers, I would transfer but at this point I would want to transfer alts as well and it's just too much money to justify transferring all of them.

Originally Posted by Aquamonkey

It doesn't matter if sub numbers is the only data we have. It is still not directly tied to quality.

exactly in my opinion best goes like this

Mists

Vanilla

Wrath

Cata

TBC

Originally Posted by Immitis

there would be no legal problems... this would be like you trying to argue something isnt a book if its only 50 pages long, an expansion is as its called an EXPANSION of the content within the game, dlc is an EXPANSION of the content within a game. an expansion can be small or big as can dlc its the same thing and all that matters is how much a company puts into it.

the only place i would get in trouble is if i tried to sell it in china since in china you cannot charge for more content thats why they get all the expansions for free.

also diablo 3 is not "dead" its a single player game and there are still lots of people playing it and it sold alot. im not sure what bioware has to do with any of this unless you're talking about mass effect 3? which was regarded as a pretty good game except for the ending.

and no he said that wow never had more than 11 million subs.

I get it, you can't be arsed reading responses to your comments that refute your arguments. I'll end with this:

If you advertise something without a disclaimer and it's not in the game - it's false advertising and customers are entitled to a refund. In some countries, such as my own, customers are entitled to a refund for up to 60 days regardless. If your expansion is so pathetic I am done in an hour I will be refunding it immediately, as will almost everyone else who bought it. Then your reputation is gone and your one-hit wonder has left you with a broken career.

But PLEASE, defend your DLC-expansions.

Bioware's last straw is DA:3, many won't even buy it after the failures of DA:2, ME3, and SWTOR. If that game fails too they have lost pretty much everything.

500 is a huge amount of players, considering it's only after 2 months of the release of the expansion.

Originally Posted by Aquamonkey

It doesn't matter if sub numbers is the only data we have. It is still not directly tied to quality.

Not directly, but indirectly. Financial issues aside, the only thing that would make someone quit this game is a loss of enjoyment. One can assume that the loss in enjoyment came from what the game has to offer, which in the end correlates subscription numbers with quality.

Originally Posted by Spekkiothebrave

I've played wow since release and I've really loved the game for a long time. I've left recently since my server is absolutely dead and I know of at least 10 people on that server who have left for the exact same reason. I would come back in a heartbeat if blizz decided to merge servers, I would transfer but at this point I would want to transfer alts as well and it's just too much money to justify transferring all of them.

This is one of the real issues of WOW. And BLizzard is ignoring this. Game has gone from 12 mills down to 9.6 now... and with same number of servers. CRZ do not solve the issues. The only way to solve them is to merge servers and create strong communities again.

Weird all my friends have subbed back, but my friends aren't an indicator of everything else.

It makes sense, people are growing up and out of the game. They just can't devote the time anymore, and players are changing anyway. I like the expansion, I think it's up there neck and neck with Wrath clawing at BC's floor.