Blizzcon Dev Interview, Next Connected Realms, Blue Posts, Blue Tweets, DLC #416

Originally Posted by Kaleredar

Don't be fooled; spoiled brats whining about "flying ruining the game" is the entire reason their trying this little timesink experiment in the first place.


So you just need to fight whining with whining.



Icecrown Glacier and Storm Peaks REQUIRED flying to get around in, and they're both regarded as exceptional zones.

You could NEVER achieve what those two zones achieved by having players travel around on foot. The grand vistas of Ulduar, the carpet of zombies that seethed through Icecrown, the towering mountains... all of those things were possible because FLYING was taken into account while making them. Kun'lai would have benefited greatly by designing its northern reaches with flying in mind; having the entire area traversable by foot makes it feel decidedly smaller and less epic in scale because they had to MAKE it that way.


And if blizzard is designing zones that "don't ever require flying," then you really aren't going to see zones like Storm Peaks or Icecrown anymore.

i love flying but at the same time i also thinks it did infact ruin the game abit since it removes the majority of the challanges when questing like how it was during vanilla, like hole outland, just fly in do the quest and fly out and skipping 95% of the mobs since you dont have to fight them to reach ur objective.
MoP bin great that way and i for one dont mind waiting till 6.1 to be able to fly again, and i have 10 lvl 90 on my main server and loads of alts on other realms and still rather see the content from the ground up than from above :P

Originally Posted by Kaleredar

Appreciate it on your own time. That you force yourself to do something you hate isn't just cause to inflict a completely different play style onto people who might not care or have time for such things because you "want them to go just as slow as you want to go yourself"

I don't want anyone to do anything I want to do nor do I care tbh, I just enjoy slow leveling because I don't do alts and i only play with 1 char, so questing is still something fresh to me every xpac, and I actually enjoyed the beautiful scenery that pandaria is, and I don't think the questing and art content done by designers should go unnoticeable at rocket speed. I don't really care what other players feel, I'm enjoying the game as is.

Yrel is a new character in Warlords of Draenor, starting as a naive priestess in old Draenor. When the conflict kicks into gear she will need to become a hero over the course of the story, a new major Alliance heroine, and take a leadership role among the Alliance.

Translation: Go pay your respects to Velen, guys. No way he survives this expansion.

Originally Posted by lanceb

i love flying but at the same time i also thinks it did infact ruin the game abit since it removes the majority of the challanges when questing like how it was during vanilla, like hole outland, just fly in do the quest and fly out and skipping 95% of the mobs since you dont have to fight them to reach ur objective.
MoP bin great that way and i for one dont mind waiting till 6.1 to be able to fly again, and i have 10 lvl 90 on my main server and loads of alts on other realms and still rather see the content from the ground up than from above :P

so you dont like, how 60-70 leveling zone is done faster with flyier? jesus christ, a compelling reason to not give us flying at max level! you DO know flying wasnt available till 70 (68 for druids) when tBC was around, right? you DO know, that the reason whe can fly since 60 in outland, is because they are making leveling globally faster, right? like mounts at 20, fast at 40 etc?

and the quoted poster is correct, storm peaks was one of the most amazing zones ever (and unlike vashir, was a pleasure to quest in for most people), we will never see that kind of zone again, if they design everything like hellfire

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Originally Posted by Mandibleclaw

I don't want anyone to do anything I want to do nor do I care tbh, I just enjoy slow leveling because I don't do alts and i only play with 1 char, so questing is still something fresh to me every xpac, and I actually enjoyed the beautiful scenery that pandaria is, and I don't think the questing and art content done by designers should go unnoticeable at rocket speed. I don't really care what other players feel, I'm enjoying the game as is.

so again, whats the problem, if flying is restricted to max level?

Originally Posted by Treima6

Translation: Go pay your respects to Velen, guys. No way he survives this expansion.

who cares? our velen isnt coming with us, i could care less if bizaro velen dies

ahh still not Laughing skull EU connected anywhere :/ well, I guess, maybe other realms are more dead then.

Originally Posted by Immitis

who cares? our velen isnt coming with us, i could care less if bizaro velen dies

Which Velen did you think I was referring to? Somebody's gotta make room for this new draenei priestess to suddenly be a leading figure in the Alliance for future expansions. Guess who's the odd man out?

Hint: It ain't Varian.

Originally Posted by Treima6

Which Velen did you think I was referring to? Somebody's gotta make room for this new draenei priestess to suddenly be a leading figure in the Alliance for future expansions. Guess who's the odd man out?

Hint: It ain't Varian.

Genn? Mekkatorque? Velen? Muradin? Falstad? Moira?

Basically anyone in the Alliance who ISN'T Varian, Jaina, or to some extent Tyrande.

Originally Posted by Xilurm

Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment

Those will still exist. Just not at day one on the new continent.

So they know that some players won't join at the start because of "no-flying".

This just proves further that they won't give in to whiners.

They always make dumbass decisions at the start of the expansions and become all stubborn and tell us to suck it up and write blogs telling us to l2play and when they see the sub numbers floating away they do a 180 and start saying in interviews that they regret it and that it was a bad decision. This will be no different.

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Originally Posted by Kazlofski

So happy that they stand on their own tbh and don't give in.

Giving in always resulted in worse possibilities than what they could have been.
I see the bigger picture that they are trying to do and I fully support it, sounds way more interesting.

Yeah they stand on their own. That's why heroics are super hard and we have to do a million dailies every day.

The Emerald Dream comment disappoints me greatly and shows a lack of creativity, you could very much say the same thing for every expansion:

Outland is a nice idea and the team has talked about making it into an expansion many times. Building an entire expansion worth of zones around a demon invaded hellscape theme would get very boring, so Outland would be better used as raid, dungeon, or a subzone, not an entire expansion.

Northrend is a nice idea and the team has talked about making it into an expansion many times. Building an entire expansion worth of zones around a frozen wasteland theme would get very boring, so Northrend would be better used as raid, dungeon, or a subzone, not an entire expansion.

A Cataclysm is a nice idea and the team has talked about making it into an expansion many times. Building an entire expansion worth of zones around a fire and lava theme would get very boring, so the Cataclysm would be better used as raid, dungeon, or a subzone, not an entire expansion.

Pandaria is a nice idea and the team has talked about making it into an expansion many times. Building an entire expansion worth of zones around a green lush forest theme would get very boring, so Pandaria would be better used as raid, dungeon, or a subzone, not an entire expansion.

I mean seriously, just as Northrend had multiple unique snowy zones, The ED could have multiple green forest zones. Ideas I have come up with:
>Your classic green forest, swathed in glimmering mist
>A jungle with geothermal activity - hot springs and volcanoes.
>Fields of trippy, dream twisted landscape like this: http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__...eralddream.jpg
> A heavily Nightmare corrupted area
> A Worgen infested scrubland
> Mountain forests
> A Mountain Giant as an entire zone.
> A charred glade which has been burnt out by the locals in an attempt to curb the Nightmare's corruption.
>A rushing river network.
>A lush archipalgo.

They could do anything they wanted, it's literally a land made of dreams - how much creative freedom can you want?

Originally Posted by Darksora110

You and me both. Blizzard can make it a raid or a subzone. Dungeon would be too small. Give it as much as possible but not too much. Get it just right.

A combination of Molten Front and Firelands ..... that would be a good solution for Emerald Dream. The "Molten Front" styled like Isle of Thunder/Timless Isle where we can hunt rars maybe world bosses and do some quests and/or unlock some subzones. And in this "Molten Front" part is the entrance to the Emerald Dream raid.

Originally Posted by Kaleredar

Don't be fooled; spoiled brats whining about "flying ruining the game" is the entire reason their trying this little timesink experiment in the first place.


So you just need to fight whining with whining.



Icecrown Glacier and Storm Peaks REQUIRED flying to get around in, and they're both regarded as exceptional zones.

You could NEVER achieve what those two zones achieved by having players travel around on foot. The grand vistas of Ulduar, the carpet of zombies that seethed through Icecrown, the towering mountains... all of those things were possible because FLYING was taken into account while making them. Kun'lai would have benefited greatly by designing its northern reaches with flying in mind; having the entire area traversable by foot makes it feel decidedly smaller and less epic in scale because they had to MAKE it that way.


And if blizzard is designing zones that "don't ever require flying," then you really aren't going to see zones like Storm Peaks or Icecrown anymore.

I agree with the first part of your post. Its the 'flying ruins the game' crowd that spoils everything.

However, I think blizz will take a a different approach with some WoD zones. Why? not just to artificially slow leveling, but also to gate some additional content exclusive to flying which will already be in the game. For example, we could have some quest hubs in Spires of Arak (Arakkoa settlements atop trees/hills similar to Skettis in TBC) which are there at launch, but will be accessible after 6.1. There are 2 advantages to this:
1. A greater sense of immersion/mystery
2. 'New' content for the 6.1 patch, allowing devs to focus on other things for that patch or fix bugs in these quests themselves early.

Well, I will will be sorely disappointed if there are no additional areas in WoD zones accessible only after unlocking flight in old Draenor.

Slightly Offtopic, I never liked storm peaks that much so how good zones were is subjective; Icecrown still had that dark atmosphere so it was better to me; and personally i find traversing mountains on foot (Kun-Lai/Howling Fjord) more epic in terms of the questing experience than flying over tons of mountains just because.

Reading bliz's arguments against flying is basically like talking to a kid.

You can't have x because because you just can't. rofl

Originally Posted by Kaleredar

Don't be fooled; spoiled brats whining about "flying ruining the game" is the entire reason their trying this little timesink experiment in the first place.


So you just need to fight whining with whining.



Icecrown Glacier and Storm Peaks REQUIRED flying to get around in, and they're both regarded as exceptional zones.

You could NEVER achieve what those two zones achieved by having players travel around on foot. The grand vistas of Ulduar, the carpet of zombies that seethed through Icecrown, the towering mountains... all of those things were possible because FLYING was taken into account while making them. Kun'lai would have benefited greatly by designing its northern reaches with flying in mind; having the entire area traversable by foot makes it feel decidedly smaller and less epic in scale because they had to MAKE it that way.


And if blizzard is designing zones that "don't ever require flying," then you really aren't going to see zones like Storm Peaks or Icecrown anymore.

Almost entirely disagree. Icecrown was a dreadful waste of a zone. The only good part was the Argent Tournament. Only reason I, and a lot of other people, went to the zone (apart from the Icecrown Citadel). Stupid waste of space. "...the carpet of zombies" posed literally NO threat. They just stood there, and really made the Scourge look like the most useless threat.

Storm Peaks was a pretty average zone. All I remember was 1 quest chain and Ulduar. Was pretty meh. I don't know why you are supporting these zones, whenever I hear people talk about amazing Northrend zones, I always hear Grizzly Hills, which had nothing to do with flying, and was an amazing zone. Personally, the sense of wonder walking on my mount through the Howling Fjord and Scholazar Basin was one of the most immersive experiences I have had in WoW. I am going through Howling Fjord again now on my Hunter, with flying... and it is definitely not the same. Nowhere NEAR as exciting. Now, yes, this is partially attributed to the fact I have done it before. However, I can tell you, the flying aspect does also help diminish the immersion.

Outlands also had places such as Nagrand, a massive favourite throughout the player base. It had a lot of ground content, but also a bit of content restricted to flying, same with Terrokar Forest and Shadowmoon Valley. This is how I think zones should be, and how I believe they will make Draenor. Do you think, just because flying is restricted to 6.1, that flying-compulsory content won't exist? Really? Blizzard is not that dry.

Plus, don't forget we still have that island that ended up becoming Netherstorm, which will become available once/after flying is available. Who says that wont encapsulate your little flying fantasy zones like Storm Peaks and Icecrown?

Originally Posted by ttak82

I agree with the first part of your post. Its the 'flying ruins the game' crowd that spoils everything.

However, I think blizz will take a a different approach with some WoD zones. Why? not just to artificially slow leveling, but also to gate some additional content exclusive to flying which will already be in the game. For example, we could have some quest hubs in Spires of Arak (Arakkoa settlements atop trees/hills similar to Skettis in TBC) which are there at launch, but will be accessible after 6.1. There are 2 advantages to this:
1. A greater sense of immersion/mystery
2. 'New' content for the 6.1 patch, allowing devs to focus on other things for that patch or fix bugs in these quests themselves early.

Well, I will will be sorely disappointed if there are no additional areas in WoD zones accessible only after unlocking flight in old Draenor.

Slightly Offtopic, I never liked storm peaks that much so how good zones were is subjective; Icecrown still had that dark atmosphere so it was better to me; and personally i find traversing mountains on foot (Kun-Lai/Howling Fjord) more epic in terms of the questing experience than flying over tons of mountains just because.

This is what I wanted to say pretty much, well done. The Spires of Arak will have TONNES of flying-restricted content, that is bound to make 6.1 more exciting. Definitely a zone I am excited to explore. I am sure it will feel like a completely different experience before and after 6.1. People who are whining about their decision aren't seeing the possibilities. They just want to rush to 100 and raid. Whilst the end-game is where a lot of the main content is focused, the leveling experience in every new expansion also bring a lot of good content too, that people skip and miss out on, and then complain that Blizzard did not make enough content.

The blue posts perfectly explained everything, yet people still find ways to complain.

Flying makes quests trivial.
Flying makes quests trivial.
Flying makes quests trivial.

Quests will be a big part of max level experience in WoD. What is so difficult to understand?

I sincerely don't understand whats the big deal about not being able to fly for a while after the xpack launch.

I think it will make the world a lot more interesting to explore & get around in.

In my opinion its a terrific idea and I'm totally looking forward to it

So many elements of the game have been streamlined for the sake of "convenience". I can't help but applaud them actually trying to move back in the other direction for one of the core pieces of WoW.

Originally Posted by Lagiacrus

Almost entirely disagree. Icecrown was a dreadful waste of a zone. The only good part was the Argent Tournament. Only reason I, and a lot of other people, went to the zone (apart from the Icecrown Citadel). Stupid waste of space. "...the carpet of zombies" posed literally NO threat. They just stood there, and really made the Scourge look like the most useless threat.

It was literally carpeted with elites in some areas. The entire place was rife with scourge. The massive battlements, tiered buildings; nothing they've made sense has come close to that level of building up the final bad guy.

Storm Peaks was a pretty average zone. All I remember was 1 quest chain and Ulduar. Was pretty meh.

You can't beat Storm Peak's scenery or Ambiance. It was an exceptional zone. And I spent three months straight sitting in it waiting for the Time Lost proto drake, and I STILL think it's a great zone.

I certainly wouldn't have felt that way flying in circles around Shadowmoon or Nagrand. I started to hate shadowmoon valley flying across it to do the Netherwing quests.

I don't know why you are supporting these zones,

Look at the poll on the forum for "best max level zone;" it's BY and FAR Icecrown, with many people saying Storm Peaks would have been their choice had it been listed.

whenever I hear people talk about amazing Northrend zones, I always hear Grizzly Hills, which had nothing to do with flying, and was an amazing zone.

Sure, Grizzly Hills was great.

And you know what? Grizzly hills isn't somehow "ruined" by seeing it from the air. Flying through the trees and along the cliffs makes it all the more breathtaking.

Personally, the sense of wonder walking on my mount through the Howling Fjord and Scholazar Basin was one of the most immersive experiences I have had in WoW. I am going through Howling Fjord again now on my Hunter, with flying... and it is definitely not the same. Nowhere NEAR as exciting. Now, yes, this is partially attributed to the fact I have done it before. However, I can tell you, the flying aspect does also help diminish the immersion.

Howling Fjord was incredibly difficult to get around in without flying.

As for Sholazar, you were pretty much expected to get flying halfway through the zone. And again, NEITHER howling fjord or Sholazar are "ruined" by flying.

You know what zones are ACTUALLY ruined when you get to fly in them? The ones that were never DESIGNED for flying, because they aren't actually impressive from the air. Like Townlong Steppes, or most of Dread Wastes. They're flat and boring both on the ground and by air.

Outlands also had places such as Nagrand, a massive favourite throughout the player base. It had a lot of ground content, but also a bit of content restricted to flying, same with Terrokar Forest and Shadowmoon Valley. This is how I think zones should be, and how I believe they will make Draenor.

Nagrand was a pretty bad zone, not going to lie. It was full of Ogres (oh gee that's new.) Questing was a dreadful experience; the entire zone was VERY flat and it was dominated by the quest chain of "kill 20 of this animal, NOW go kill 20 of this animal, AND NOW go kill 20 of THIS animal" and other fairly inconsequential quests.

Terrokar was okay, but frankly, it fell flat of being anything "alien." Wolves, spiders, moths. Gee, Alien to the extreme, right?

Frankly, most of Outland was pretty weak.

Do you think, just because flying is restricted to 6.1, that flying-compulsory content won't exist? Really? Blizzard is not that dry.

So it just sits there for an entire patch cycle? How fun.

Plus, don't forget we still have that island that ended up becoming Netherstorm, which will become available once/after flying is available. Who says that wont encapsulate your little flying fantasy zones like Storm Peaks and Icecrown?

Because they said that that area wont have flying.

Whilst the end-game is where a lot of the main content is focused, the leveling experience in every new expansion also bring a lot of good content too, that people skip and miss out on,

Frankly, that's their choice if they want to level that way.

"Yrel is a new character in Warlords of Draenor, starting as a naive priestess in old Draenor. When the conflict kicks into gear she will need to become a hero over the course of the story, a new major Alliance heroine, and take a leadership role among the Alliance."

Yeah - Jaina's period is so pent up at the moment you KNOW is going to explode into raid boss proportions. Replacement incoming..

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I also reckon that along with No flying, you should HAVE to finish all the zone quests before you level up and leave the zone.

Originally Posted by balir

I also reckon that along with No flying, you should HAVE to finish all the zone quests before you level up and leave the zone.

Yes, because that'll be so entertaining when leveling alts.