Level 90 Boost, Heirlooms and Bonus Rolls, Dampening Change, Low Level BGs, DLC

'You don't understand. This is a sub game and everyone who pay the sub should be completely equal in everything. That means that you can't spend real money to skip content that others need to spend 1-2-3 weeks. I agree with you that leveling in wow is boring. If Blizzard also think this then they should remove it completely and give everyone the ability to start from level 90. But whatever is going to be done it needs to be EQUAL for everyone. I prefer the sub model because it gives equality, if blizzard sell levels then in my eyes they will not be any different from the f2p games, except that their sub will not be optional...'

Like I said before and in the past, I don't care at all about the free 90. But I enjoy leveling, if they made leveling difficult again and then gave people the option for a free 90 that would be sweet.

ALSO Blizzard, reward players for actually leveling with some end game reward, people who work harder to get to 90 and even level 100 from level 1 deserve a reward.

Originally Posted by Juggie

'You don't understand. This is a sub game and everyone who pay the sub should be completely equal in everything. That means that you can't spend real money to skip content that others need to spend 1-2-3 weeks. I agree with you that leveling in wow is boring. If Blizzard also think this then they should remove it completely and give everyone the ability to start from level 90. But whatever is going to be done it needs to be EQUAL for everyone. I prefer the sub model because it gives equality, if blizzard sell levels then in my eyes they will not be any different from the f2p games, except that their sub will not be optional...'

Why can't you spend real money to skip content? Everyone has that choice you do realize right?

In fact, what if I paid for you to purchase a level 90 would you do it?

I fucking hate myself for re-subbing for another 6 months. I guess the joke's on me now. I hate shit like this. Blizzard should have drawn the line at those transmog helmets, but they're even more greedy and desperate than I've ever expected. You know, people already knew this was going to happen many years ago, they were called fools and doomsday-sayers for such blasphemy. Guess they were right, weren't they? They called it.

This is pay to win. But everyone in WoW has different opinions on what Pay 2 Win actually means. Some consider it gear, some consider it to be achievement points, for others it means pet battles or even PvP, and others consider it to have as much level 90's as possible. Whatever. But that's not the point.

The point is, for example, Bob is rich and spends many hours a day on WoW. Bob can just buy his way to level 90. Skipping like 90% of the actual content. Meanwhile, John is a guy with a shitty income, and barely has enough money to pay for his subscription. He plays only a few hours a day, sometimes even less, and has no heirlooms. While Bob plays at least 5 hours every day.

John cannot buy a level 90, John must grind all low level content for weeks until he finally reaches level 100, meanwhile... Bob already has multiple level 90's and 100's with barely any effort.

See what I'm trying to say? This is pay to win. Besides, this is a pathetic band-aid solution to "fix" the so-called leveling (which is a joke by itself anyway). I don't even know why this has been implemented, cause you can just level your way to 90 in a matter of days, depending on how much time you spend on WoW.

As I said before, I do not support P2W crap like this. It's disgusting.

If you're defending Blizzard, then you're either a massive fanboy who agrees and loves just about anything that Blizzard does, and you must also be a proud member of the Blizzard Defense Force™... or you're just a blind fool.

/rantover

After watching Moveth have the first post on every news post for two weeks straight I'm wondering why Chaud isn't using his alt account to make the first post anymore.

- - - Updated - - -

Maybe they'll come out with an option to pay to skip raids and pvp. Paying to not play a game. It's the future.

yes start selling 90's so we get more retards that have no clue how to play.

Originally Posted by Sainur

I fucking hate myself for re-subbing for another 6 months. I guess the joke's on me now. I hate shit like this. Blizzard should have drawn the line at those transmog helmets, but they're even more greedy and desperate than I've ever expected. You know, people already knew this was going to happen many years ago, they were called fools and doomsday-sayers for such blasphemy. Guess they were right, weren't they? They called it.

This is pay to win. But everyone in WoW has different opinions on what Pay 2 Win actually means. Some consider it gear, some consider it to be achievement points, for others it means pet battles or even PvP, and others consider it to have as much level 90's as possible. Whatever. But that's not the point.

The point is, for example, Bob is rich and spends many hours a day on WoW. Bob can just buy his way to level 90. Skipping like 90% of the actual content. Meanwhile, John is a guy with a shitty income, and barely has enough money to pay for his subscription. He plays only a few hours a day, sometimes even less, and has no heirlooms. While Bob plays at least 5 hours every day.

John cannot buy a level 90, John must grind all low level content for weeks until he finally reaches level 100, meanwhile... Bob already has multiple level 90's and 100's with barely any effort.

See what I'm trying to say? This is pay to win. Besides, this is a pathetic band-aid solution to "fix" the so-called leveling (which is a joke by itself anyway). I don't even know why this has been implemented, cause you can just level your way to 90 in a matter of days, depending on how much time you spend on WoW.

As I said before, I do not support P2W crap like this. It's disgusting.

If you're defending Blizzard, then you're either a massive fanboy who agrees and loves just about anything that Blizzard does, and you must also be a proud member of the Blizzard Defense Force™... or you're just a blind fool.

/rantover

Leveling is only 10% of the game..
People fail to realize how many hours played they have at MAX level instead of while leveling, pretty sure time played on a max character means more than on a character thats gaining 2-3 levels per hour. Cmon now, all this "Rant" is crying over spilt milk that really has no purpose. So what people can buy a 90 or two if they feel like it, how does this affect you personally? Again, this game isnt about leveling and it hasn't been in a long time. It's getting to max level, then raiding/pvp/achievements/old raids, thats the focus of the current game. If you cant get aboard then get off this train, no one will miss you.

Originally Posted by Somebody

I plainly don't give a shit on this whole free level 90 deal. A lot of people I know at the beginning of MoP were bitching and moaning endlessly about having to level all 9 of their alts to level 90 as well and complaining about how its too much of Blizz to ask of the player to have to do that. Yet now people are coming out of the woodwork and complaining that this is going to turn the game into pay to win and enforce catering to the casual.

None of that even matters to me, all I know is that philosophy behind the development stands in good reasoning and I'm not going to let anyone else's opinion affect this.

Leveling from 1-90 is not 70% of the game, if at all, currently, its 10% of the game, when WoD comes out, it'll be 9% of the game. If you want to see numbers, please take a look at your /played time while at level max level and compare it to your times spent at each level while leveling and tell me that, even while added up, your time spent leveling is equal to or greater than your time spent at max level.

Here's an idea! Get rid of 1-90 content. That was simple right? I mean they're saying it's such a hassle for us to get where we want to be and play end game with our friends. Will they squeeze extra money out of our tits this way? Of course not. Imo keep it the way it is or remove the whole damn thing. People with money shouldn't get an advantage in the game. (Yes paying to skip weeks worth of content while the poor have to sludge through it is an advantage)

Originally Posted by Vishy

Leveling is only 10% of the game..

I meant leveling content. Instant 90 means you're skipping 90% of all the zones, quests, and leveling stuff. Etc.

Originally Posted by Vishy

People fail to realize how many hours played they have at MAX level instead of while leveling, pretty sure time played on a max character means more than on a character thats gaining 2-3 levels per hour. Cmon now, all this "Rant" is crying over spilt milk that really has no purpose. So what people can buy a 90 or two if they feel like it, how does this affect you personally? Again, this game isnt about leveling and it hasn't been in a long time. It's getting to max level, then raiding/pvp/achievements/old raids, thats the focus of the current game.

Crying? Hahahahahaha... oh my, that's funny.

No. I've got a right to voice my opinion just like everyone else, whether that be positive or negative. I'm just an extremely disappointed customer who paid for all the expansions + monthly sub, and yet Blizzard still manages to pull shit like this through while the "Shop" buttons that are in-game are just screaming at you to buy their stuff. Ah, the shop buttons. That's another matter that I shall not go into now.

Originally Posted by Vishy

If you cant get aboard then get off this train, no one will miss you.

How original. /clap

Originally Posted by rokkitan

Making Legendaries like heirlooms sound like a nice idea, but keep them level-restricted. I.e. Legendary cloak is 1-90 when WoD is released, Val'anyr, Hammer of Ancient Kings is 1-80 and Sulfuras, Hand of Ragnaros is 1-60, and so on.

They are legendaries for a reason. You have them at current content and if same expansion normally last into the next few patches (i.e Val'anyr still used in ICC) due to the procs or equip bonuses. Having Val'anyr's bubble from 1-80 would be overpowered and walk over current heirlooms. Think about battlegrounds. I don't even do pvp, but just an example.

Yes the cloak Legendary and Val'anyr were not just your "drop chance" loot. Yes you can argue with Val, but still had todo a quest chain and not just loot the items. You had to do a quest chain lasting a good month or 2 (depending on drop chances) for the cloak and when rewarded with it, it was earned. It also offered something each patch during the progression, Sha Gem > Socket > Meta etc. This was a good "experiment" and did reward the people who took effort in. Now that content is "easier" then before as people "pug" with Flexi (pretty much its role) to get the new Garrosh looms, where as before you didnt make a casual sunday pug to get the glaives. Doing the cloak quest rewarded you. Having the Garrosh looms are a reward as you are killing the currently last boss in the game. There will not be a reward for using them at the current content as this is the last patch so using them next expansion will be the reward. I do agree with the cloak however, but due to the rewards each completion of the chain during each patch was reward enough I think.

TLDR - Use legendaries at current content. Be grateful with their OP'ness at current. Not Blizzard's fault you get them 2 expansions later. They are legendary for a reason.

Originally Posted by UnifiedDivide

Your analogy is flawed.
First of all, Bob plays for long enough that he would have been more likely to level his toons. He'd also have put effort into getting his level 100s.

If John can barely afford his subscription, why is he playing? He is obviously struggling for money if he can only just manage £9/$15 once a month. He could put that money to much better use. He shouldn't even be looking at the store if he can barely keep his subscription going. If anything, he's getting his money's worth from going from 1-90/100 and would feel accomplished because he did everything.

These two guys are also likely never even going to hear about each other. Neither one affects the other. It's not P2W.
There is also the fact that less people than you imagine will even buy a level 90. Altoholics generally prefer to level, such as myself. I've been leveling since Vanilla, I'm not gonna stop now lol Even if I am pretty sick of doing the same shit over and over.

I do agree though, leveling should be improved so that people actually want to do it rather than skip it. But I can also see people like me with many alts that would hate to go through the same old shit again. You have to remember that this wasn't really aimed at people that already play to start with, it was for new/returning players so that they could play with their friends or just get to current content.

Or am I just a fanboy? Or perhaps the blind fool?

Yeah you are sick of doing the same shit over and over - but you done it and fair play to you. Now someone can come along and completely devalue all the effort you have put in simply because he has more money than sense. Stop defending the indefensible - this shit has no place in a pay to play MMO. Every one in the world of warcraft should be equal and outside factors should not influence those inside the game.

Originally Posted by Sainur

For example, Bob is rich and spends many hours a day on WoW. Bob can just buy his way to level 90. Skipping like 90% of the actual content. Meanwhile, John is a guy with a shitty income, and barely has enough money to pay for his subscription. He plays only a few hours a day, sometimes even less, and has no heirlooms. While Bob plays at least 5 hours every day.

John cannot buy a level 90, John must grind all low level content for weeks until he finally reaches level 100, meanwhile... Bob already has multiple level 90's and 100's with barely any effort.

See what I'm trying to say? This is pay to win.

This is not an example of pay to win lol. Its not Blizzard's fault John doesnt have as much money as Bob. What if John was as rich as Bob? Wouldnt he spend as much money?

This is what happened to me. I started in Oct 06. I think I was about 16/17. I was at College. Now im 25 and have a paying job. Before if I wanted to play on another server, I would have to start a whole new character because I didnt have X amount to blow on a server transfer. Now I xfer/faction change multiple chars at once. I think ive spent almost £3k on character services. So technically I was John, but now im Bob?

Theory = DENIED

Originally Posted by Dalwin

yes start selling 90's so we get more retards that have no clue how to play.

I think you are greatly overestimating how much people l2p at below max level. With Heirlooms, players can put three buttons on their bar and zoom through all the previous expansions content without any problems. You can three man most dungeons, and the only real chance of a wipe is when a hunter/lock pet bugs out and pulls half the dungeon (LBRS, UBRS and Dire Maul come to mind if you drop down).

Players learn to play at max level. Getting to 90 in a game where max level is 100 does nothing but save that person about 2-3 weeks of leveling.

Personally, I have been on the fence for a while now about the possibility of re-starting WoW when Warlords of Draenor comes out, having not played for well over a year.

If this Pay-for-level-90 option ends up going ahead, it will be the final nail in the coffin for me, confirming I never take it up again and seek out 'greener pastures' elsewhere. Blizzard will have started down the extremely slippery slope of 'pay-to-win'. It may be 'only' Pay for 90 now, eventually it may very well end up being 'Pay for Level 100' or "Level 1-100 heirlooms with 20% experience boost, "only" $19.95" (They have already shown that they are not against selling exp boost potions, something common in a lot of other pay-to-win games)

So, according to the official infographic*:

670,000 PvP instances/day versus 900,000 PvE instances/day done by WoW players.

* http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/123...bers-1-28-2014

So much for PvP being minor, and that is even despite with far less XP/hour from it at most levels, high imbalances at most levels, etc.

Why do I say "at most levels" rather than repeating the usual mantra that only max level matters?

Here is something not shown in the infographic but as important:

Around 40% to 50% of characters online at a time are under maximum level.

-------------------------------------------

That can easily be proven:

Go to any realm, most conveniently a low to medium population realm: Type /who, then do a search entering:

"warrior" 1-89

followed by

"warrior" 90

and likewise for other classes. If there are 50 results seen, the number found reached its cap, not giving an actual figure.

But if both figures are under 50, as often so on a low or medium population realm, then the data is meaningful.

Compare the results then:

-------------------------------------------

What gets seen: There are around as many people playing at a time under max level as at max level.

Presently, leveling is near half the game to the total average of the playerbase.

Not very long after they reach max level, get every ability for their class, have done raids one to a few times through on LFR, and so on, many players simply consider themselves done and quit or else level an alt on another class (if any desired not already done yet), rather than Blizzard's ideal of running again the same already-seen content on other difficulties.

Once WoD's level boosts hit live, and 90 levels of PvE content drop off the to-do list for many players, to be replaced by 10, Blizzard really better hope PvP keeps up playtime. Sure, someone could artificially choose to still level manually, but it'd be harder to really do if knowing that all those hours could be substituted for by merely a few bucks without the slightest ban risk in the process.

Originally Posted by Batsunz

Personally, I have been on the fence for a while now about the possibility of re-starting WoW when Warlords of Draenor comes out, having not played for well over a year.

If this Pay-for-level-90 option ends up going ahead, it will be the final nail in the coffin for me, confirming I never take it up again and seek out 'greener pastures' elsewhere. Blizzard will have started down the extremely slippery slope of 'pay-to-win'. It may be 'only' Pay for 90 now, eventually it may very well end up being 'Pay for Level 100' or "Level 1-100 heirlooms with 20% experience boost, "only" $19.95" (They have already shown that they are not against selling exp boost potions, something common in a lot of other pay-to-win games)

Why not just leave WoW if (keyword being 'IF') those things happen rather than now?

It's not "Pay to win" if all you're doing is skipping outdated content.

Good to see I spend my money on an expansion which was involved around rehashed zones and a "new leveling experience" and now it will be obsolete...

Well, I'm kinda happy that professions should be even faster to level now xD

Clap! Clap! Clap! Way to go blizzard. So not only do you allow people to puchase level boosts from 1 to 90 but you totally screw over people who have already made an effort to level a toon. Leveling professions is a joke and its very sad that they would think that they could justify the cost of making people who pay to boost a lvl 1 to 90 x ammount and then charge people who want to boost from lvl 60,70,80 etc.. to 90 the same ammount and think they are making it worth our while by throwing in a leveled profession. I'm sorry that is a horrible model for the consumer. Take your instant lvl 90 boost cost and divide it by 90 and charge users per level. So I only need 5 or 10 more levels to go and I dont want to grind them out I can pay per level. Having to pay the same cost as a 1 to 90 boost is horrible. Please fix this!!