Patch 6.2 - Demon Models, Flying Feedback, Blue Posts, Vanilla Servers, DLC #490

Vanilla is very basic. Compared to 6.x, 1.x is unplayable. So many annoyances. You do get bored. But, its worth checking out for the nostalgia.

Auberdine <3



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I agree that WoW has lost a lot of the social aspect, and that is reflected in the dwindling subs. But, vanilla was a pain in the arse. I remember quitting in the 30's for about 6 months. It was that frustrating to level. Also we were all dumb noobs equipping the wrong stuff and not caring. I suppose that's the thing, the world was 'new', and nothing that Blizzard can do will bring that 'newness' back.

You're only young once.

Originally Posted by mmonym

How long is Blizz going to keep playing this self-flattering game of claiming to know the future by saying people will try vanilla, immediately scream about how they prefer the current Garrison Prison With Free Epics so much more, and log out? Private vanilla and BC servers are not only thriving, they're growing - and that's despite the fact that nearly all of them are unstable, have broken or incorrectly scripted quests and NPC actions, have numerous ugly custom hacks to boost XP gain, provide gear for money, etc. There's obviously a sustained demand for such servers, and Blizz's fear that acknowledging vanilla and BC will undermine their current efforts is what's stopping them. I'd gladly pay $15/month for a correctly scripted BC or vanilla PvE server.

There are a very few stable, decently scripted private servers which give XP according to vanilla rules, and those are gems. One was launched just a few months ago, and launch day was jammed with people in every starting zone. Even now, that private server has over 5k people playing every weekend. Yes, the retail product has far more overall, but I doubt any individual server has 5k on any day of the week.

Warlords of Draenor has some good things going for it, and I still play and raid. But subscriptions (according to MMO Champion) are at their lowest point since vanilla. The game has been on a downward trend since Cata, and the usual rationalizations about games having a limited life-cycle may be comforting to the current devs, but not true. Play the vanilla game right now now, private server bugs notwithstanding, and it's still far more addictive than anything in WoD. Quests are hard, gold is hard, mana must be spent wisely, DPS must watch threat, pulls have to be considered even when soloing - get two or three mobs unintentionally and you may die, while in the current game any class can easily solo multiple mobs while questing. Vanilla dungeons require communication and CC, and because there's no cross-server or automated match-making, people on a server must get to know one another, know who's good to group with, and work to get better. It's far more social than today's exile in your own private instance, with no reason to come out - simply a better, more involving game.

Originally Posted by Violent

Is there anyone else who reads these "feedback" posts from "Muffinus" and gets pissed off?

Not me. I often get more annoyed simply by the arrogance and entitlement of some of the players who always expect an answer to everything, to wit-- Blizzard has been a little too open with information and it's simply made people feel like they own a right to the facts, which, until it's publicly released, they do not. Now there are a lot of things Blizzard does I will not support, let alone defend, but player feedback is something they've become so good at it's a travesty to some players when they aren't being fed straight answers. More or less a victim of it's own merit.

Originally Posted by Violent

I mean, is it just me, or are these people (the Blues who respond to feedback) just basically telling players to "fuck off", in a few better words?

While I doubt that's actually their intent, it would not surprise me, I read even some of the juvenile things people here say and it's like... I'd rather not even read it. In fact I've read your post and deduced it was one of thew few decent enough not to ignore. Mostly because I think as a game developer myself I can only dare to dream of having this many people shouting at me. To be honest I'm not sure I'd be ready to take on a playerbase like Blizzards, because woooow.

Imagine if Ubisoft's PR staff was suddenly replacing Blizzards, you'd be begging Blizzard's PR to come back, it's not their fault they are actually so giving of information it's actually become it's own problem.

And lest we forget, only a decade ago pre-release game exposition sans some screenshots, blurb and maybe a trailer was all you'd get. You should be thankful Blizzard are this forthcoming with information, rather than demanding more.

Originally Posted by Violent

It seems the blues get angry when players are asking questions and what not..

The sheer magnitudes of the same question that they've already answered being broached would definitely annoy me, and keep in mind some of these are simply PR people, not the ones who work on the game and have pride in their work, and can immediately tell you why or why not a decision was made.

Originally Posted by Violent

The one (muffinus) literally says: "I don't make all of the decisions." .. NO SHIT SHERLOCK... Does he really think some players think that?
I dunno, could be just me, but the Blues seem like they're getting pissy with players.

I think you're severely underestimating how presumptous and borderline mentally-challenged some people in WoW's userbase are.

That said, I've already explained it's very possible that the Blues would get pissy with the behaviour and interaction some players are giving, especially when most feedback is devoid of reason other than "I DONT LIKE IT".

Like, if you're a PR you want to be able to tell the developers why it may be an idea to consider, players whining that it's something "they don't like" is a fairly flacid argument, and what kind of excuse is it, like can you imagine the conversation.
PR: "We've received some reports players don't like X."
Dev: "I see, what is it that troubles players about X? Perhaps some sort of compromise can be made if legitimate reason is given."
PR: "I'm afraid the only reasoning is 'Well sir, we don't like it.'"

Now don't get me wrong, there are certainly some decent reasons why flying omission in Draenor hasn't been liked, especially when you reach max level, but I think the goods outweigh the bads in that situation, if you got flying at Level 100, you'd just save treasure hunting until then when you could cheat, either by monsters being too easy or flying trivializing the otherwise pretty challenging route towards the thing.

Then it's a 'Can I get flying Early since I've already levelled my one character to 100?'

And that's a downwards spiral into bad habits, those bad habits being catering to players simply because they whine, see Cataclysm Syndrome.

There's no pleasing players, and the sort of loud obnoxious players who sought instant gratification Blizzard once pandered to are being overlooked a lot more unless they can provide reasons, that these whiners have to provide reasons now infuriates them because it force them to admit that either:
A.) They're a spoilt brat and want this because it'll make the game better for them but screw anyone who may be dis-serviced by their whining being answered because they pay 15 US dollars a month (et al, just like everyone else) and wouldn't unsubscribe no matter how much they threaten they will to get what they want.
B.) They are a mindless zombie and don't know what they want so are just rolling with Party A because Party A panders to people with absolutely no ambition of their own.

Good on them I say for sticking to their guns, as a developer making a decision - especially one which some may call a "game changer" - isn't easy. I know this to only a very small degree myself, as I've mentioned I am a non-profit developer myself-- and Blizzard being bold is something that will never fail to impress me, especially when their bolder changes usually end up positively effecting the gameplay experience.

Losing 3 million subscribers does not necessarily mean the game has dropped in quality, it means it has dropped in quantity, and the majority of those will be back when the patch comes out, and they know they will.

If there was ever anything redeemable about the current state of the WoW playerbase it's that it has become so predictable.

progression servers - "not enough interest to offset the cost" dude... are you kidding? The game has gotten progressively worse since tbc. You would have those seeking nostalgia AND those who never got to experience it. Bored folk such as myself too who have been done w/ WoD for almost 2 months now.

and the cost... UMMM you guys make like FIFTY MILLION A MONTH. The costs of opening another server or two... seriously.... SMH

The DLC universe has an odd calendar!