Trial of Valor Adjustments - December 20

Originally Posted by Arcanines

Rolf I know damn well that they splitrun, I'm not a retard, but it STILL DOESN'T explain fuck all. If you killed Xavius yesterday, as in rank 2600something I wont look up at 8AM. I won't even tell you Gz, you killed it with an avg Ilvl of 885+ nothing impressive at all. Heck we finished EN 2 months ago in 10 days. With an avg Ilvl of 875.5.

That's a whole 10 Ilvl, you know how much that means? You can 5 heal every single fight in the tier including Cenarius if you're really bad at this game. So my post actually means something. Did I type 860, yes but that's a mistake that has now been cleared. Killing an end boss with the same Ilvl that it drops isn't impressive. That also means being 7/7, doesn't mean fuck all without knowing the ranking, as the skill level is SO LOW in those guilds.

Class stacking / exploiting / grinding 24/7 is also not really impressive.
I'm happy many people have been able to get through EN.
Top guilds will be top guilds and less skilled guilds will be less skilled.

Originally Posted by Mifuyne

Class stacking / exploiting / grinding 24/7 is also not really impressive.
I'm happy many people have been able to get through EN.
Top guilds will be top guilds and less skilled guilds will be less skilled.

Good thing no one really class stacked EN and there was no exploits, was farming a factor yes, BUT AGAIN in this context of the post you quote they are IRRELEVANT. It doesn't change my original point of half of these guilds wouldn't even be able to clear EN Mythic if gear wasn't such a joke to get. That you're 885 by the time you get to Cenarius/Xavius. This also explains why people hit these ''brick walls'' thats called Odyn. IMO other than his bugs, hes not even hard.

But they'll be stuck since they clearly arent meant to be doing end game mythics while it's still somewhat hard. They'll need nerfs which is fucking sad. Mythic is supposed to be hard. The only time I'll say Mythic is overtuned, is if the mechanic is just flat out impossible to do. Like lets say Odyns blast still 1 shots you from full HP or takes you down to 5%. Then yes I'll agree it needs a nerf.

Originally Posted by Arcanines

Good thing no one really class stacked EN and there was no exploits, was farming a factor yes, BUT AGAIN in this context of the post you quote they are IRRELEVANT. It doesn't change my original point of half of these guilds wouldn't even be able to clear EN Mythic if gear wasn't such a joke to get. That you're 885 by the time you get to Cenarius/Xavius. This also explains why people hit these ''brick walls'' thats called Odyn. IMO other than his bugs, hes not even hard.

But they'll be stuck since they clearly arent meant to be doing end game mythics while it's still somewhat hard. They'll need nerfs which is fucking sad. Mythic is supposed to be hard. The only time I'll say Mythic is overtuned, is if the mechanic is just flat out impossible to do. Like lets say Odyns blast still 1 shots you from full HP or takes you down to 5%. Then yes I'll agree it needs a nerf.

EN seemed to be quite disappointing for top guilds. I'm still unsure wether this was due to the titanforge mechanic or not.
Would've liked to progress in ToV without the nerfs but it'll still be quite a challenge (Helya).
We've only killed Odyn M last night so guess we're one of the hundred scrub guilds :P.
Nerfs are always tossed in when several dozen of top guilds kill stuff.

Considering the Titanforge mechanic, ilvl/gear won't be a problem at all, it'll just be bashing your head into the boss as much as you can and pray for RNGesus for lucky streaks.

Originally Posted by Arcanines

and FYI half of these doesn't even Mythic spam, or grind AP. So they don't have 895, they are mostly all at 885'ish with this many weeks of caches and killing farm.

Not even sure what to say to this...

Originally Posted by Mifuyne

EN seemed to be quite disappointing for top guilds. I'm still unsure wether this was due to the titanforge mechanic or not.
Would've liked to progress in ToV without the nerfs but it'll still be quite a challenge (Helya).
We've only killed Odyn M last night so guess we're one of the hundred scrub guilds :P.
Nerfs are always tossed in when several dozen of top guilds kill stuff.

Considering the Titanforge mechanic, ilvl/gear won't be a problem at all, it'll just be bashing your head into the boss as much as you can and pray for RNGesus for lucky streaks.

Titanforge is a problem, getting BIS loot from dungeons and getting BIS 885 gear from a mythic 7 isn't rewarding at all, it's just plain stupid. I shouldn't spamgrind mythics to get 890 to do ToV.

Originally Posted by Bullarkie

Not even sure what to say to this...

Well you can start by admitting it's the truth. I really don't hope you think the 2600 something 7/7 guilds spam mythics for AP and 895 gear. Because they dont, and they sure as fuck doesn't have 895, and more towards 885 at this point. But because I'm nice, I'll now take a guild that killed Xavius in the last 3 days and give you their log for avg Ilvl to prove my point.

http://www.wowprogress.com/guild/eu/...st/Solar+Flare THEY KILLED Xavius 1 day ago, and here is their log, avg Ilvl of 883, AND THERE MY POINT GOT PROVEN.

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/XxTQwVcBp9zgnNr1 Notice avg Ilvl of 883. Yea, don't talk out your ass ^^

Originally Posted by Rylalai

Especially in M+ where you can basically get to iL 895 without ever entering a raid..

thats like saying you can hit 895 with worldquests. Theoretically yes, but practically no, not even close.

Raids and one mythic +12 a week is by far the best way to get gear. Ive run over 600 mythic +, and raid mythic up to Ilgynoth once a week. Most of my gear comes from the raid or the bonus weekly chest

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Originally Posted by Arcanines

Rolf I know damn well that they splitrun, I'm not a retard, but it STILL DOESN'T explain fuck all. If you killed Xavius yesterday, as in rank 2600something I wont look up at 8AM. I won't even tell you Gz, you killed it with an avg Ilvl of 885+ nothing impressive at all. Heck we finished EN 2 months ago in 10 days. With an avg Ilvl of 875.5.

That's a whole 10 Ilvl, you know how much that means? You can 5 heal every single fight in the tier including Cenarius if you're really bad at this game. So my post actually means something. Did I type 860, yes but that's a mistake that has now been cleared. Killing an end boss with the same Ilvl that it drops isn't impressive. That also means being 7/7, doesn't mean fuck all without knowing the ranking, as the skill level is SO LOW in those guilds.

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Because top guilds matter in this context, since his context is talking about Mythic as a whole. Where over 2500 guilds has cleared it, and FYI half of these doesn't even Mythic spam, or grind AP. So they don't have 895, they are mostly all at 885'ish with this many weeks of caches and killing farm. In the top end, ofc they grind, but thats out of this context.

Seems like you think anyone really cares what you think because you killed xavius.

they dont, im sorry

Your opinion matters equally as much as someone farming LFR . Having invested your life into Wow make your opinion on TOV nerfs more valid. This change either was / wasnt directed at you, but "normal" people are definitely happy with it.

Originally Posted by Weikorr

thats like saying you can hit 895 with worldquests. Theoretically yes, but practically no, not even close.

Raids and one mythic +12 a week is by far the best way to get gear. Ive run over 600 mythic +, and raid mythic up to Ilgynoth once a week. Most of my gear comes from the raid or the bonus weekly chest

I do the same (well not as many M+ as you) and most of my gear is from Kara and M+. I have 5 pieces from EN, 2 from ToV and the rest is kara/M+ since most of the items that drop in EN have really bad secondary stats.

Originally Posted by Weikorr

thats like saying you can hit 895 with worldquests. Theoretically yes, but practically no, not even close.

Raids and one mythic +12 a week is by far the best way to get gear. Ive run over 600 mythic +, and raid mythic up to Ilgynoth once a week. Most of my gear comes from the raid or the bonus weekly chest

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Seems like you think anyone really cares what you think because you killed xavius.

they dont, im sorry

Your opinion matters equally as much as someone farming LFR . Having invested your life into Wow make your opinion on TOV nerfs more valid. This change either was / wasnt directed at you, but "normal" people are definitely happy with it.

Please tell me you're joking just to piss me off, because you're doing that rather well making a clown out of yourself. I can with 100% confidence tell you LFR raiders has 0 to say about nerfs. If you HONESTLY THINK, an LFR raider as something to say about things needing a nerf, then I'm sorry, but you're out of your own mind. They don't balance mythic around LFR raiders who cant break 200k DPS if i gave them a 880 toon with level 54 weapon. Just stop yourself.

Even worse, Mythic nerfs, like I'm sorry to break it to you, but you're perhaps just not good enough to do Mythic ToV. Did I find Odyn boring as f? Yes I sure did, but I'd say it's perfectly tuned. Guarm is a retard check can people look at their debuffs. We've wiped 0 times on guarm to DPS being bad at doing DPS, or healers doing good HPS. It's always been X player is retarded and can't run to their mark.

Good to see the nerfs. Heroic Odyn should not be harder than Mythic Mythendra

Originally Posted by Weikorr

Your opinion matters equally as much as someone farming LFR . Having invested your life into Wow make your opinion on TOV nerfs more valid. This change either was / wasnt directed at you, but "normal" people are definitely happy with it.

Then my opinion about football matters as much as lionel messi ? Come on, you are embarassing yourself...

Originally Posted by Arcanines

Please tell me you're joking just to piss me off, because you're doing that rather well making a clown out of yourself. I can with 100% confidence tell you LFR raiders has 0 to say about nerfs. If you HONESTLY THINK, an LFR raider as something to say about things needing a nerf, then I'm sorry, but you're out of your own mind. They don't balance mythic around LFR raiders who cant break 200k DPS if i gave them a 880 toon with level 54 weapon. Just stop yourself.

Even worse, Mythic nerfs, like I'm sorry to break it to you, but you're perhaps just not good enough to do Mythic ToV. Did I find Odyn boring as f? Yes I sure did, but I'd say it's perfectly tuned. Guarm is a retard check can people look at their debuffs. We've wiped 0 times on guarm to DPS being bad at doing DPS, or healers doing good HPS. It's always been X player is retarded and can't run to their mark.

Did it ever occur to you that ToV was released far too early for the majority progressing on EN at that time? That with the Nighthold being released mid January no one is going to give two fucks about Odyn? It's ok for the super hardcore because they are able to farm copious amounts out of raid hours for their legendaries/extra gear etc, for the rest of us on progress there is literally no respite, constant progress since EN opened, through ToV and will continue with the NH. How does anyone seriously think that these raiders have the time to farm or do anything else when they are spending the majority of their game time raiding? They don't and these players are quitting in droves.

An encounter should not be 10-13mins avg of add killing, I don't care what you say. The fact that you basically admitted that Odyn is boring, before saying it's perfectly tuned means you literally don't have a clue. I guarantee that if every raider had the time to put aside as much as the top 100, we'd be needing a top 1000.

Originally Posted by Khorneflake

Did it ever occur to you that ToV was released far too early for the majority progressing on EN at that time? That with the Nighthold being released mid January no one is going to give two fucks about Odyn? It's ok for the super hardcore because they are able to farm copious amounts out of raid hours for their legendaries/extra gear etc, for the rest of us on progress there is literally no respite, constant progress since EN opened, through ToV and will continue with the NH. How does anyone seriously think that these raiders have the time to farm or do anything else when they are spending the majority of their game time raiding? They don't and these players are quitting in droves.

An encounter should not be 10-13mins avg of add killing, I don't care what you say. The fact that you basically admitted that Odyn is boring, before saying it's perfectly tuned means you literally don't have a clue. I guarantee that if every raider had the time to put aside as much as the top 100, we'd be needing a top 1000.

Good thing you don't do Mythic then, because you're clearly clueless. First a fight can be boring and tuned correctly, I found several fights over the years boring, but did they have the correct tuning? Yes the sure had, great job fam.

Examples of MY PERSONAL OPINION OF BORING BOSSES BUT STILL GOOD FIGHTS AS A WHOLE
Examples since you're 100% going to want them due to you being wrong in the argument. I find Ursoc to he boring. Why? It's a fucking tank and spank, we 3 shotted it on progression when it was still ''hard'' we didn't need vantus rune. We actually laughed at how easy it was. Nythendra, sure as hell isn't fun. You stand still, you get rot, stand still unless melee run out last sec. If ranged, stand still and move after it explodes.

Killrog, swap to adds zerg boss, nothing interesting still tuned correctly. Tyrant, same as killrog just it actually has Edict which can kill you.
As you can hopefully agree or anyone can if they EVER DID MYTHIC HFC, these fights weren't undertuned easy, nor where they too hard, they punished you for fucking up. But I still found them boring.

Was HoV released to early?
No it wasn't, blizzard even said IT'S A FILLER RAID UNTIL NIGHTHOLD, meaning it's meant as content for people who has cleared EN *cough* Mythic guilds 7/7 *cough* So it was fine, had EN not been a joke of a raid, then yes I'd say HoV was fine. But when you have 2800 guilds (just checked) who has done Xavius Mythic, I think its about time. We also have over 12000 guilds with Nythendra down, many of these 1/7 guilds PUGGED PEOPLE but wowprogress still tracks as 10 are from the guild. I'd like to think after 3 months if blizzard has raids lined up for the entire Xpack so we dont get a new SoO/HFC; then NH is comming out at the correct timing. 3 months is more than enough to clear the content you wanted.

Why does Odyn suck?
Phase 1 is redundant on Mythic, phase 1 was meant to show you the mechanics that'll come into play in phase 2 so that you dont get overwhelmed. We know the mechanics, we don't need phase one. In total I think we've had 3 wipes on P1 over our 120 pulls in total. Why did we wipe? We used several hours and came to the end of the raid where players get sloppy.

Is HoV overtuned?
No, it's punishing just as it should be, I'm sorry you're a baddie, but you can fix that on your own.

Originally Posted by Arcanines

Good thing you don't do Mythic then, because you're clearly clueless. First a fight can be boring and tuned correctly, I found several fights over the years boring, but did they have the correct tuning? Yes the sure had, great job fam.

Examples of MY PERSONAL OPINION OF BORING BOSSES BUT STILL GOOD FIGHTS AS A WHOLE
Examples since you're 100% going to want them due to you being wrong in the argument. I find Ursoc to he boring. Why? It's a fucking tank and spank, we 3 shotted it on progression when it was still ''hard'' we didn't need vantus rune. We actually laughed at how easy it was. Nythendra, sure as hell isn't fun. You stand still, you get rot, stand still unless melee run out last sec. If ranged, stand still and move after it explodes.

Killrog, swap to adds zerg boss, nothing interesting still tuned correctly. Tyrant, same as killrog just it actually has Edict which can kill you.
As you can hopefully agree or anyone can if they EVER DID MYTHIC HFC, these fights weren't undertuned easy, nor where they too hard, they punished you for fucking up. But I still found them boring.

Was HoV released to early?
No it wasn't, blizzard even said IT'S A FILLER RAID UNTIL NIGHTHOLD, meaning it's meant as content for people who has cleared EN *cough* Mythic guilds 7/7 *cough* So it was fine, had EN not been a joke of a raid, then yes I'd say HoV was fine. But when you have 2800 guilds (just checked) who has done Xavius Mythic, I think its about time. We also have over 12000 guilds with Nythendra down, many of these 1/7 guilds PUGGED PEOPLE but wowprogress still tracks as 10 are from the guild. I'd like to think after 3 months if blizzard has raids lined up for the entire Xpack so we dont get a new SoO/HFC; then NH is comming out at the correct timing. 3 months is more than enough to clear the content you wanted.

Why does Odyn suck?
Phase 1 is redundant on Mythic, phase 1 was meant to show you the mechanics that'll come into play in phase 2 so that you dont get overwhelmed. We know the mechanics, we don't need phase one. In total I think we've had 3 wipes on P1 over our 120 pulls in total. Why did we wipe? We used several hours and came to the end of the raid where players get sloppy.

Is HoV overtuned?
No, it's punishing just as it should be, I'm sorry you're a baddie, but you can fix that on your own.

Wow never seen someone so worked up over a game before. Is this guy complaining that casuals can do what he does now? He ain't even cleared mythic ToV and goes on like he is a devine gaming entity lol

Originally Posted by imunreal

Wow never seen someone so worked up over a game before. Is this guy complaining that casuals can do what he does now? He ain't even cleared mythic ToV and goes on like he is a devine gaming entity lol

Unfortunately there are many many people like the one you quoted in WoW.. They think that are the be all and end all because they can do this mode of raiding and they think they know everything and they expect everyone else to kiss their feet because of it.. But in reality they are more than likely some basement dweller no lifer who never goes outside..

Originally Posted by grexly75

Unfortunately there are many many people like the one you quoted in WoW.. They think that are the be all and end all because they can do this mode of raiding and they think they know everything and they expect everyone else to kiss their feet because of it.. But in reality they are more than likely some basement dweller no lifer who never goes outside..

He's a very angry little boy by the looks of his posts

Originally Posted by MyndZero

Why would they nerf it... the difficulty was awesome. Bloody hell blizzard.

To fit the item level of items in the raid.

Originally Posted by imunreal

Wow never seen someone so worked up over a game before. Is this guy complaining that casuals can do what he does now? He ain't even cleared mythic ToV and goes on like he is a devine gaming entity lol

Rofl, My guild and I clear Mythic, I'm not complaning over people are clearing the content I did while it was still somewhat relevant. What I'm mad over is people demanding nerfs because a boss is hard. I raid mythic for the challenge. Mythic raiding and roleplaying is the only reason I'm even playing this game. I don't do PvP, I dont hunt achieves or mounts or whatever you want. I play for those 2 things.

I get mad when I see a HC raider thats just not good enough to do mythic, or heck some LFR/Normal raider, demanding that Mythic gets nerfed. It's meant to be hard, not be easy.

Originally Posted by grexly75

Unfortunately there are many many people like the one you quoted in WoW.. They think that are the be all and end all because they can do this mode of raiding and they think they know everything and they expect everyone else to kiss their feet because of it.. But in reality they are more than likely some basement dweller no lifer who never goes outside..

Yea it is kind of sad really. Maybe he is just your typical shy guy and vents on forums to make himself feel like the big lad. You know, your basic internet troll

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Originally Posted by Arcanines

Rofl, My guild and I clear Mythic, I'm not complaning over people are clearing the content I did while it was still somewhat relevant. What I'm mad over is people demanding nerfs because a boss is hard. I raid mythic for the challenge. Mythic raiding and roleplaying is the only reason I'm even playing this game. I don't do PvP, I dont hunt achieves or mounts or whatever you want. I play for those 2 things.

I get mad when I see a HC raider thats just not good enough to do mythic, or heck some LFR/Normal raider, demanding that Mythic gets nerfed. It's meant to be hard, not be easy.

You ain't cleared ToV mythic. You are not as good as you think. Such a shame to see this from an EU player

Originally Posted by imunreal

Yea it is kind of sad really. Maybe he is just your typical shy guy and vents on forums to make himself feel like the big lad. You know, your basic internet troll

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You ain't cleared ToV mythic. You are not as good as you think. Such a shame to see this from an EU player

I fail to see your point? What I can sure is still valid, what does me being 2/3 Mythic in top 400'ish progressing Helya have to do? Please tell me, you're just being a troll at this point. I did the entire mythic EN and did and still raid Mythic ToV just not over xmas break. We WILL progress Helya after newyears and such even if we know we won kill her before NH. Why? I said I enjoy the challenge and everyone in the guild does.

Also saying I'm a troll, all my points are pretty much true if you look into them. But if you wan't to call me a retard, PM me and I'll send you my Btag shit my personal info if you think you need to personally attack me.

Originally Posted by Arcanines

I fail to see your point? What I can sure is still valid, what does me being 2/3 Mythic in top 400'ish progressing Helya have to do? Please tell me, you're just being a troll at this point. I did the entire mythic EN and did and still raid Mythic ToV just not over xmas break. We WILL progress Helya after newyears and such even if we know we won kill her before NH. Why? I said I enjoy the challenge and everyone in the guild does.

Also saying I'm a troll, all my points are pretty much true if you look into them. But if you wan't to call me a retard, PM me and I'll send you my Btag shit my personal info if you think you need to personally attack me.

Read my previous point. You rant and rave like you are the god of gaming, when you ain't even cleared ToV. There is a challenge, and there is you not able to do it. If you are as good as you think you are would you not have cleared it by now? Come on, like 50 guilds have done it already, why don't you? You have already quoted me on this. Read it again please, as I do hate repeating myself.

I never called you a retard either lol? It's funny how you see your opinion as fact as well lol

EDIT: hold on. Did you literally do the Internet equivalent of "let's take this outside and sort it like men" with your btag comment?!? LOL please stop, I need to breath