War Mode Faction Balance Hotfix and Patch 8.1 Changes
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
Blizzard suspects many Alliance players had "rough experiences early on and opted out" of War Mode, and the increased rewards may bring people back in.

Is Ion for real? He thinks that increased rewards will bring alliance back into warmode, when the vast majority of alliance have forgotten that warmode even exists?

This kind of measure is too little too late. A few alliance may turn on warmode, find themselves getting facing repeated 10v1 situations and then turn it off again.

Some time ago we made a hotfix to War Mode which enforces all War Mode shards that have both Alliance and Horde in them to have a stricter, more even ratio. We’ve been monitoring the results and so far we’ve noticed a significant improvement in “fair and balanced” shards. So much so that it’s safe to say that if you are Alliance, and you see Horde in the outdoor world in War Mode, you are a relatively even horde to alliance ratio shard. There are some rare exceptions, such as when a raid of 40 players enter a zone. It may take a bit for the “shard manager” to compensate and balance the shard.

We do have some plans in store in Tides of Vengeance (Patch 8.1) to entice the underrepresented faction with greater rewards to increase participation and create more active Horde/Allianced mixed War Mode shards. The intent of those rewards is not to give the underrepresented faction some “compensation” for being outnumbered in a War Mode shard (since that really can’t happen anymore).

We're also looking forward to what you all think about the Incursions in War Mode for 8.1, since it brings Horde and Alliance to the same location which should create some pretty fun skirmishes.

Raid Testing Schedule - November 15th - 19th
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
On Thursday, November 15th and Friday, November 16th we will be conducting raid tests of the Battle of Dazar'alor. After testing has ended up Friday, we will open the first wing of Raid Finder.

BOTH FACTIONS:
Testing is open for both factions. However, for some bosses, raid members will temporarily re-live events as the opposite faction using a story flashback.

Thursday, November 15th

Stormwall Blockade - Heroic Battle of Dazar'alor
13:00 PST (16:00 EST, 22:00 CET)

Jaina - Heroic Battle of Dazar'alor
14:00 PST (17:00 EST, 23:00 CET)

Friday, November 16th

Opulence - Mythic Battle of Dazar'alor
13:00 PST (16:00 EST, 22:00 CET)

King Rastakhan - Mythic Battle of Dazar'alor
14:00 PST (17:00 EST, 23:00 CET)

Siege of Dazar'alor/Defense of Dazar'alor Raid Finder
16:00 PST (19:00 EST, 1:00 CET)

As always, this testing schedule is very fluid and subject to the realities of a test environment. We might have to change the time of a testing session, change the bosses being tested, or cancel a test entirely, due to bugs, server hardware issues, etc. Keep an eye on this forum for the latest information, and thank you in advance for testing and providing feedback.

Q: How do I get into the raid zone?

A: In Zuldazar, Boralus, Dalaran, Orgrimmar, or Stormwind, you may speak to Nexus-Lord Donjon Rade III in order to teleport into the raid zone while it is open for testing. (The option to teleport into a zone will not be available when the zone is not open for testing.)
This article was originally published in forum thread: War Mode Faction Balance Hotfix and Patch 8.1 Changes, Raid Testing - Nov 15th - 19th started by chaud View original post
Comments 100 Comments
  1. Omedon's Avatar
    Honestly most objections to War Mode that I encounter in discussions here or there are absolutely insurmountable within any reward structure they could/would implement. In these cases, it's not cowardice, it's pure respect for one's own time. It's a distance from the entire concept of having the uncontrollable variable of other players interfere with their scheduled play sessions, especially in the intentionally solo-attractive open world. They don't care, they won't care, they won't join, and War Mode will never be made "mandatory" enough for anyone holding this mindset to change their mind.
  1. cityguy193's Avatar
    Years of unbalanced racials led to one side gaining all the PVP players (and pretty much most of the PVE players too). Now that everyone is horde and racials are balanced, why would anyone switch back? There is absolutely no reason for an alliance player to turn on war mode for 10% more resources. The best PVP players can play alliance and just get stomped, because of being outnumbered everywhere.

    There are only 2 fixes:
    1) Make alliance racials undoubtly better, and profoundly so. Let the factions balance themselves out for a year and nerf it into balance when everything is even again.
    2) Make war mode a que. Right now horde just turns it on and forgets about it. Make it an opt in shard.
    **) Open up free faction transfers to alliance while picking one of the above options
    Nuclear option) Merge factions. Everyone can group up with each other. Let people pick their race, and pick between "green" and "purple" in a new expansion, idk

    At this point I doubt blizzard will own up to their mistake of ruining faction balance.
  1. Esper's Avatar
    I mean, I get what he's saying, but if the ratios are like we've experienced, there are either going to be shards where there are ONLY horde... or even if they are spreading them out more/better, Alliance will still be outnumbered 3 to 1.

    Let's assume for a moment that a shard can contain up to 200 players at a time. Right now, that's probably 50 Alliance and 150 Horde. Either they are going to have to cap the number of Horde on a shard to match the number of Alliance in which case there will be some shards without any or it's just going to be the same as it is right now.
  1. Tonus's Avatar
    I mean, it seems like people just don't care about war mode. Why keep trying to make people do something they don't want to do by giving larger and larger rewards for it?

    Reminds me of the heyday of LFR back in MoP.
  1. Alcsaar's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Esper View Post
    I mean, I get what he's saying, but if the ratios are like we've experienced, there are either going to be shards where there are ONLY horde... or even if they are spreading them out more/better, Alliance will still be outnumbered 3 to 1.

    Let's assume for a moment that a shard can contain up to 200 players at a time. Right now, that's probably 50 Alliance and 150 Horde. Either they are going to have to cap the number of Horde on a shard to match the number of Alliance in which case there will be some shards without any or it's just going to be the same as it is right now.
    That is exactly what they're doing....

    If a shard accepts 200 people and there are only 50 alliance in warmode, its only going to allow roughly 50 horde on that shard.

    I'm not at all a fan for increasing rewards for alliance just because they're too pansy to turn on warmode. Sharding is there to make sure ratios are balanced, so any complaining at this point is just that, complaining.
  1. Tonus's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Esper View Post
    I mean, I get what he's saying, but if the ratios are like we've experienced, there are either going to be shards where there are ONLY horde... or even if they are spreading them out more/better, Alliance will still be outnumbered 3 to 1.

    Let's assume for a moment that a shard can contain up to 200 players at a time. Right now, that's probably 50 Alliance and 150 Horde. Either they are going to have to cap the number of Horde on a shard to match the number of Alliance in which case there will be some shards without any or it's just going to be the same as it is right now.
    I think that's exactly what he's saying... sounds like some shards are 100% horde and the rest are 50/50 alliance/horde.
  1. Dastreus's Avatar
    No, the problem with warmode is even less "oh there's an imbalance" and more, every time I turn on warmode there's a group of 5-10 horde stomping alliance and no groups over 4 form to stop it, so we still get stomped.
  1. Tonus's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by cityguy193 View Post
    Years of unbalanced racials led to one side gaining all the PVP players (and pretty much most of the PVE players too). Now that everyone is horde and racials are balanced, why would anyone switch back? There is absolutely no reason for an alliance player to turn on war mode for 10% more resources. The best PVP players can play alliance and just get stomped, because of being outnumbered everywhere.

    There are only 2 fixes:
    1) Make alliance racials undoubtly better, and profoundly so. Let the factions balance themselves out for a year and nerf it into balance when everything is even again.
    2) Make war mode a que. Right now horde just turns it on and forgets about it. Make it an opt in shard.
    **) Open up free faction transfers to alliance while picking one of the above options
    Nuclear option) Merge factions. Everyone can group up with each other. Let people pick their race, and pick between "green" and "purple" in a new expansion, idk

    At this point I doubt blizzard will own up to their mistake of ruining faction balance.
    The problem is that "balance" is not an equilibrium state. Gradually, everyone will gravitate to one side or the other. Their only option is to keep putting their thumb on the scale every time they see it tilting, and that's lame.

    Just get rid of factions.
  1. cityguy193's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Alcsaar View Post
    That is exactly what they're doing....

    If a shard accepts 200 people and there are only 50 alliance in warmode, its only going to allow roughly 50 horde on that shard.

    I'm not at all a fan for increasing rewards for alliance just because they're too pansy to turn on warmode. Sharding is there to make sure ratios are balanced, so any complaining at this point is just that, complaining.
    Would you rather play on alliance then? Or are you too pansy to play on anything except the overpopulated faction

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tonus View Post
    The problem is that "balance" is not an equilibrium state. Gradually, everyone will gravitate to one side or the other. Their only option is to keep putting their thumb on the scale every time they see it tilting, and that's lame.

    Just get rid of factions.
    It was equal for many years in the game. The problem stemmed from the horde racials when mythics were released and it took years to finally nerf them.
    This is a recent problem. Removing factions would honestly make everyone happy at this point. Maybe let people choose their faction
  1. Casperite's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by cityguy193 View Post
    Would you rather play on alliance then? Or are you too pansy to play on anything except the overpopulated faction

    - - - Updated - - -



    It was equal for many years in the game. The problem stemmed from the horde racials when mythics were released and it took years to finally nerf them.
    This is a recent problem. Removing factions would honestly make everyone happy at this point. Maybe let people choose their faction
    You can choose your faction now. And how lame it would be if they removed factions, it's the core of the game. If you dont like it I find it odd you picked up WoW in the first place.
  1. DonSerrot's Avatar
    IMHO, the very fact that there is a reward aside from the honor you get from killing someone is the problem in and of itself. As a Horde player I feel like I HAVE to have War Mode on because otherwise I'm squandering the free 10% bonus I get for being on the dominant faction. I don't have to worry about potential lost time when there isn't an enemy to act as a hindrance. If there was no bonus then I honestly wouldn't have War Mode on at all, and I know there are a lot of people who feel the same way. Remove the bonus and it'll naturally even out with just the people who actually do want to engage in world PVP. It was an interesting idea on paper that just doesn't seem to work in practice.
  1. Tonus's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by cityguy193 View Post
    Would you rather play on alliance then? Or are you too pansy to play on anything except the overpopulated faction

    - - - Updated - - -



    It was equal for many years in the game. The problem stemmed from the horde racials when mythics were released and it took years to finally nerf them.
    This is a recent problem. Removing factions would honestly make everyone happy at this point. Maybe let people choose their faction
    Define "many years"... in the US, faction balance was a distant memory by Cata. Sure, in Classic wow people didn't care, but as people got better and the game matured, faction balance died a swift and decisive death. Sure there were some servers that were 100% horde and some were 100% ally, but that's not balance.
  1. olioster's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Omedon View Post
    Honestly most objections to War Mode that I encounter in discussions here or there are absolutely insurmountable within any reward structure they could/would implement. In these cases, it's not cowardice, it's pure respect for one's own time. It's a distance from the entire concept of having the uncontrollable variable of other players interfere with their scheduled play sessions, especially in the intentionally solo-attractive open world. They don't care, they won't care, they won't join, and War Mode will never be made "mandatory" enough for anyone holding this mindset to change their mind.
    Absolutely correct. No amount of increased rewards is going to get me to turn on War Mode. I refuse to have my play time interrupted by other players in ways I can't control.
  1. Alcsaar's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by cityguy193 View Post
    Would you rather play on alliance then? Or are you too pansy to play on anything except the overpopulated faction

    - - - Updated - - -



    It was equal for many years in the game. The problem stemmed from the horde racials when mythics were released and it took years to finally nerf them.
    This is a recent problem. Removing factions would honestly make everyone happy at this point. Maybe let people choose their faction
    Been playing Horde for like 6 years now. I'm not going to faction swap just because people on alliance are pussies. In fact your reply really meant nothing at all, there was nothing of value in your statement...
  1. Blur4stuff's Avatar
    Raids is why I stopped using war mode. To me, fun world pvp is random encounters in small numbers. It's unpredictable and exciting.

    What I kept running into, however, was raid groups numbering 20-40. And no, my idea of a good time isn't scraping together another huge raid to fight them. If that's what I cared about then I'd queue for a pvp instance.
  1. cityguy193's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonus View Post
    Define "many years"... in the US, faction balance was a distant memory by Cata. Sure, in Classic wow people didn't care, but as people got better and the game matured, faction balance died a swift and decisive death. Sure there were some servers that were 100% horde and some were 100% ally, but that's not balance.
    Server specific yes, there was always one-sidedness
    But this is the first time that as a whole, the entire game has a faction imbalance. Take a look at PVE and PVP rankings, all the best players switched to horde, a lot because they had to. Alliance guilds struggle to recruit players cause the population keeps shrinking, so guilds are disbanding, which leads to a positive feedback.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Alcsaar View Post
    Been playing Horde for like 6 years now. I'm not going to faction swap just because people on alliance are pussies. In fact your reply really meant nothing at all, there was nothing of value in your statement...
    I see that you do not understand anything that I wrote.

    Enjoy being a pussy afterall.
  1. Alcsaar's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by cityguy193 View Post
    Server specific yes, there was always one-sidedness
    But this is the first time that as a whole, the entire game has a faction imbalance. Take a look at PVE and PVP rankings, all the best players switched to horde, a lot because they had to. Alliance guilds struggle to recruit players cause the population keeps shrinking, so guilds are disbanding, which leads to a positive feedback.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I see that you do not understand anything that I wrote.

    Enjoy being a pussy afterall.
    How ironic coming from an alliance player.

    Blizzard has stated over and over that faction imbalances in warmode have been mostly resolved via sharding. You don't need extra rewards just because alliance are pussies.
  1. Easo's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Alcsaar View Post
    How ironic coming from an alliance player.

    Blizzard has stated over and over that faction imbalances in warmode have been mostly resolved via sharding. You don't need extra rewards just because alliance are pussies.
    Oh pray tell, internet tough guy, why am I pussy because I dislike PvP or getting ganked due to 10v1? This is a game, Mr. Serious, nothing more. You do not have to prove anything to anyone.
  1. Alopex Major's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by cityguy193 View Post
    At this point I doubt blizzard will own up to their mistake of ruining faction balance.
    Yeah don't forget the years of "good-natured teasing" by the devs at BlizzCon which included telling Alliance players that they should die.

    No, the lack of interest in Alliance story or characters is embedded deep and goes years back. This won't change anything, and no, they won't admit their hand in it.
  1. Lagmonster's Avatar
    No amount of rewards will ever get me to turn on war mode

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