Patch 8.2 - Blizzard Responds to Experience Eliminated Aura, New Shirts, DLC #683

Blizzard, I would gladly put in the effort to level from 1-120, if you would be so kind to put in the effort to make it a fun experience. But it seems the Blizzard policy now is to remove all fun and just make it a timeconsuming grind.

As one who actually loves levelling in every new expansion, it's actually one of the best experiences with every new expansion for me personally. Yeah, most of my gameplay is in the end-game content, but experience the zones and quests for the first time is something I have always enjoyed a bunch in this game. But still I have to admit that Blizzard have made a complete mess out of levelling in the game.

People start on alts because they get bored with the end-game content or bored with their class. New players without any character will get a character boost included when purchasing the game and playing from 1 to 120 doesn't really give them much at all in terms of preparing them for end-game or learning their class. They get all this experience from doing 110-120 and doing low level dungeons doesn't provide you with anything in terms of challenge or skill requirement.

I did enjoy levelling alts in the past, with a full set of heirloom gear you could blast through the levels and content like it was nothing. You gained levels in such a rapid phase that it was entertaining enough by itself to get my alts towards max level. Sure the phasing felt awkward, you couldn't really follow story progressions through zones because you outlevelled the content in the zone long before finishing the zones storylines etc.. But at least you felt you could reach max level in a timely fashion.


After the revamp they did so many things right, but they completely borked the phasing. Things feel better balanced, even with heirloom gear. You can actually do zones and follow the storylines without outlevelling the content etc.. But my time getting from 1-120 is taking like 10x longer. The content is just not that solid or that entertaining that I'm nowhere close to be willing to spend such a tedious amount of time and effort going from 1-120. The value proportion of the heirlooms feels nerfed to the ground as compared to before etc..

So even though things feel better balanced a long the way from 1-120, the journey itself has just become far too long and tedious as compared to before. And one can't shake the feeling that this was made on purpose just to add value to the levelling boosts making players much more likely to purchase a boost instead of going through the tedious process of levelling themselves from the beginning.


What is the real purpose of making this so time consuming? The older content is the worst the game has to offer. Why force new players through all of this for hours before they reach current content? Why force existing players to play through all of this just go get a new character and class up to the current content? Heirlooms exists for making levelling alts a breeze for existing players that decides to invest in heirlooms and decide to put it on their alts. I see no reason why it should take such a huge amount of time going from 1-120 on a alt with full heirloom gear as it's entire purpose is to provide existing players with a much more efficient way of levelling alts..

Sure the previous levelling experience had it's flaws, but at least with RAF and/or heirloom gear you could actually make levelling go by in no time if wanted. Now everyone is just forced through a endless grind that barley anyone really enjoys.

Couldn't you make a group with XP on, then turn XP off and maybe the system is stupid and doesn't realize?

Plundering old raids? Oh, are they going to reverse their terrible decision of personal loot while running previous expansion stuff even when alone? No? Didn't think so.

Originally Posted by RamGuy

As one who actually loves levelling in every new expansion, it's actually one of the best experiences with every new expansion for me personally. Yeah, most of my gameplay is in the end-game content, but experience the zones and quests for the first time is something I have always enjoyed a bunch in this game. But still I have to admit that Blizzard have made a complete mess out of levelling in the game.

People start on alts because they get bored with the end-game content or bored with their class. New players without any character will get a character boost included when purchasing the game and playing from 1 to 120 doesn't really give them much at all in terms of preparing them for end-game or learning their class. They get all this experience from doing 110-120 and doing low level dungeons doesn't provide you with anything in terms of challenge or skill requirement.

I did enjoy levelling alts in the past, with a full set of heirloom gear you could blast through the levels and content like it was nothing. You gained levels in such a rapid phase that it was entertaining enough by itself to get my alts towards max level. Sure the phasing felt awkward, you couldn't really follow story progressions through zones because you outlevelled the content in the zone long before finishing the zones storylines etc.. But at least you felt you could reach max level in a timely fashion.


After the revamp they did so many things right, but they completely borked the phasing. Things feel better balanced, even with heirloom gear. You can actually do zones and follow the storylines without outlevelling the content etc.. But my time getting from 1-120 is taking like 10x longer. The content is just not that solid or that entertaining that I'm nowhere close to be willing to spend such a tedious amount of time and effort going from 1-120. The value proportion of the heirlooms feels nerfed to the ground as compared to before etc..

So even though things feel better balanced a long the way from 1-120, the journey itself has just become far too long and tedious as compared to before. And one can't shake the feeling that this was made on purpose just to add value to the levelling boosts making players much more likely to purchase a boost instead of going through the tedious process of levelling themselves from the beginning.


What is the real purpose of making this so time consuming? The older content is the worst the game has to offer. Why force new players through all of this for hours before they reach current content? Why force existing players to play through all of this just go get a new character and class up to the current content? Heirlooms exists for making levelling alts a breeze for existing players that decides to invest in heirlooms and decide to put it on their alts. I see no reason why it should take such a huge amount of time going from 1-120 on a alt with full heirloom gear as it's entire purpose is to provide existing players with a much more efficient way of levelling alts..

Sure the previous levelling experience had it's flaws, but at least with RAF and/or heirloom gear you could actually make levelling go by in no time if wanted. Now everyone is just forced through a endless grind that barley anyone really enjoys.

Saying that everyone starts an alt because the endgame is boring or their classes are boring is a lie. I've met many players who starts alts because they just want that feeling of starting fresh and get rewarded for every little step, which won't happen anymore after you reach the endgame and you get most stuff done.

They just love the "ding! ding! ding! ding! ding!" from leveling + the fact that everything that drops after you reach the level cap is a massive upgrade.

good job blizzard, that's totaly acceptable.
I dont know why someone would cry about it

How are people on such an uproar for this. If it's actually fun to boost chars to 120 with twinks then you'd do it even with the xp reduction, you could do it 20 times more now before hitting max! Clearly it's the rewards that people want without doing what you would normally have to do for it.

These kinds of fixes are always claimed to be "blizzard stopping fun". You just hate a loophole being taken away. No one was boosting with twinks until it became the fastest way to level, hence the "fun" was in the reward more than anything else. It's like pining for the follower quests with thousands of gold as a reward. The hypocrisy of acting offended for a fix that clearly fixed something unintended i don't understand. If you really think gearing a character in the last expansion should carry over to faster leveling for all your other characters in current expansion you clearly have a very differing opinion on how the game should work than any developer of any mmo.

I'm not going to claim this is about 'muh boosts,' because 120 boosts won't exist until 9.0 preorders if current trends hold true. This is all about metrics. They want you playing longer so they're doing everything they can to put the brakes on and slow you down.

The other side of the problem is they're punishing people for their fuck-up. Going from 110 to 120, with scaling taking into account, is a notable depower, especially if you're wearing three Legiondaries and three pieces of Azerite armor. That's on Blizz for goofing up with the progression curve in the 110-120 gear reset, but instead of fixing it they're punishing people for something that hurt precisely nobody (really, who cares if four people leveled 110-120 by letting a 110 DH twink farm Islands for them? It's not like you have some watershed eureka moment where everything falls into place and turns you into a god-tier mage in that level bracket if you aren't making the effort to learn the class regardless).

Originally Posted by martinboy

Blizzard, I would gladly put in the effort to level from 1-120, if you would be so kind to put in the effort to make it a fun experience. But it seems the Blizzard policy now is to remove all fun and just make it a timeconsuming grind.

How is it fun to sit in an instance and let someone run around and kill everything for you? Quit being lazy.

Originally Posted by maulgryve

How is it fun to sit in an instance and let someone run around and kill everything for you? Quit being lazy.

yeah people are in uproar about nothing. This is just the blizz hate train starting again for something barely many people do.

Originally Posted by RobertMugabe

People have only done this for lvl110+ and 120 boosts don't exist yet... not at least for half a year.

btw. remember when everyone was hating so much on Blizzard that leveling has become so trivial and how there's no challenge, no interaction in the open world? Many people even started to demand vanilla servers...

So Blizzard listened and made leveling decent again at the end of Legion and now you and others are calling them out for how they're trying to sell more boosts? Srsly?
How tf do you even come to the conclusion: fixing obvious exploit of the scalling tech that made certain dungeons soloable within 5mins => blizzard being greedy?

If Blizzard was all about the money in this regard then they could've just sold xp potions, which would've been more profitable and would increase playtime than straight up boosts, no?

Increasing the health of the creatures in the open world is not the same as making it more challenging. It takes longer, but it isn't more challenging.
Another problem is that you lose power as you level, which shouldn't be a thing in a MMO.
Lastly; the 110+ leveling experience was vastly different between classes when BfA was released. If it's going to be challenging, it should be challenging for all classes/specs and not just a select few.

Originally Posted by Qnubi

Couldn't you make a group with XP on, then turn XP off and maybe the system is stupid and doesn't realize?

then it gets fixed a week afterwards. Whats this stupid comment?

Originally Posted by Cthulhu fhtagn

How are people on such an uproar for this. If it's actually fun to boost chars to 120 with twinks then you'd do it even with the xp reduction, you could do it 20 times more now before hitting max! Clearly it's the rewards that people want without doing what you would normally have to do for it.

These kinds of fixes are always claimed to be "blizzard stopping fun". You just hate a loophole being taken away. No one was boosting with twinks until it became the fastest way to level, hence the "fun" was in the reward more than anything else. It's like pining for the follower quests with thousands of gold as a reward. The hypocrisy of acting offended for a fix that clearly fixed something unintended i don't understand. If you really think gearing a character in the last expansion should carry over to faster leveling for all your other characters in current expansion you clearly have a very differing opinion on how the game should work than any developer of any mmo.

How is that even a question for you. Doing things efficient in itself is fun, doing something fast is fun. Do you also question why people have fun doing big dps? The faster/better/higher something you do is, the more fun you can usually extract from it. Activities themselves are often mediocre, but the speed and efficiency you have in it, is where you can extract fun from. Playing basketball is fun, being better at it, is more fun. If I could flip a switch that would magically improve my shooting % from 50% to 70% I would have more fun, why wouldn't I. The same applies literally everywhere, games, work, music. The better and more efficient you are the better you feel about yourself and the more fun you can have.

I don't really get the outroar. How can anybody, that has been boosted by a level 110 to level 120 think, that it was an intended feature? It already screams of finding a broken loophole in the leveling process.

Ofcourse they would proberly fix this at some point! Just enjoy the easy leveling you got from it and go back to playing the game as was intended. If that is not fun, then don't force yourself playing WoW.

....Saying, that it does not hurt anybody, is like saying that being able to buy a full set of mythic gear at tier launch, is not devaluing the reward of doing mythic content.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by bloodykiller86

yeah people are in uproar about nothing. This is just the blizz hate train starting again for something barely many people do.

We are proberly just experiencing a loud minority. Some people found an easy way to reach max lvl in the most demanding leveling bracket and used it to stack up on characters. Now that Blizzard have tried to turn them back to the intended leveling method, they lose their shit because their little "cheat" was taken away from them.

Originally Posted by Trbn

but yet you are provided with shortcuts every patch where you get catch up mechanics
and soon you will recieve pathfinder part 2

That's worlds apart from having another player get you levels.

Originally Posted by Qnubi

How is that even a question for you. Doing things efficient in itself is fun, doing something fast is fun. Do you also question why people have fun doing big dps? The faster/better/higher something you do is, the more fun you can usually extract from it. Activities themselves are often mediocre, but the speed and efficiency you have in it, is where you can extract fun from. Playing basketball is fun, being better at it, is more fun. If I could flip a switch that would magically improve my shooting % from 50% to 70% I would have more fun, why wouldn't I. The same applies literally everywhere, games, work, music. The better and more efficient you are the better you feel about yourself and the more fun you can have.

Doesnt matter. The fact is that, scaling was never meant to create twinks . its a loophole. People are mad that you actually have to play the game now its ridiculous. Same people begging for WoW classic too smh

Originally Posted by skycaptain

the real issue is leveling 1-120, not 110-120. Leveling is a mess rn

Nothing is going on from 1-120, all the action that this fix (sort of) is addressing is what is taking place from 110-120. Nice try though!!

Originally Posted by Qnubi

How is that even a question for you. Doing things efficient in itself is fun, doing something fast is fun. Do you also question why people have fun doing big dps? The faster/better/higher something you do is, the more fun you can usually extract from it. Activities themselves are often mediocre, but the speed and efficiency you have in it, is where you can extract fun from. Playing basketball is fun, being better at it, is more fun. If I could flip a switch that would magically improve my shooting % from 50% to 70% I would have more fun, why wouldn't I. The same applies literally everywhere, games, work, music. The better and more efficient you are the better you feel about yourself and the more fun you can have.

But there's 0 skill involved in this. It is last expansion gear helping you more than it should in the next. If you play worse with a twink but still get rewarded more than an average geared character with xp on it clearly need's a fix. Your basketball metaphor falls apart cause even that clearly has rules that people follow. Magical switch here is a twink and in basketball i'd guess performance enhancing drugs.

In games work and music it is the same. If everyone had an easy way to do something the ceiling goes up. If 8 hours of work can be done in 1 hour by everyone, you are going to be expected to do work worth of 64 old hours next day. So either they nerf the exp gained from twink runs or they up the exp gained from everywhere else until the time spent is equal, that's just how it goes. Cause there is no skill involved in these runs (by this i mean a really bad twink farm beats really fast questing) there is no point in the runs giving more exp.

Originally Posted by Qnubi

How is that even a question for you. Doing things efficient in itself is fun, doing something fast is fun. Do you also question why people have fun doing big dps? The faster/better/higher something you do is, the more fun you can usually extract from it. Activities themselves are often mediocre, but the speed and efficiency you have in it, is where you can extract fun from. Playing basketball is fun, being better at it, is more fun. If I could flip a switch that would magically improve my shooting % from 50% to 70% I would have more fun, why wouldn't I. The same applies literally everywhere, games, work, music. The better and more efficient you are the better you feel about yourself and the more fun you can have.

I currently have zero problem being efficient enough to level from 110 to 120 through content without the nonsense that has been allowed to take place. This not fun, and what is going on has been actually breaking the rules. Though this "Fix" really does nothing to address the underlining problem that was produce here and the kick by Blizzards own making. That said, Fun, should in no way be equated with people who knowingly choose to cut corners. If one simply can't level 10 levels in a game the right way, then they literally have zero reasons playing that game. What has been taking place shows how extremely lazy some people can and will be.

Originally Posted by Cthulhu fhtagn

But there's 0 skill involved in this. It is last expansion gear helping you more than it should in the next. If you play worse with a twink but still get rewarded more than an average geared character with xp on it clearly need's a fix. Your basketball metaphor falls apart cause even that clearly has rules that people follow. Magical switch here is a twink and in basketball i'd guess performance enhancing drugs.

In games work and music it is the same. If everyone had an easy way to do something the ceiling goes up. If 8 hours of work can be done in 1 hour by everyone, you are going to be expected to do work worth of 64 old hours next day. So either they nerf the exp gained from twink runs or they up the exp gained from everywhere else until the time spent is equal, that's just how it goes. Cause there is no skill involved in these runs (by this i mean a really bad twink farm beats really fast questing) there is no point in the runs giving more exp.

You focused on irrelevant points of my post. I am talking about why people have fun, I explained to you why it's FUN to do things fast and you try to discuss about workload and rules, the absolute opposite of what is considered fun. A lot of the time fun is just random unconventional behavior with unintended results in a non competitive environment. You also don't see losers laugh/smile in a competitive game, that means there are 2 major ways of having fun in activities:

1.: You are good/efficient at it, you are "winning" and therefor can extract fun from it.
2.: Your performance is irrelevant but it's unconventional, new and exciting or unintended.

Point 1 is exactly why people cheat in games, it's more fun to win.
Point 2 is exactly why people try to game the system, it's fun to do stuff that is not intended. And also the famous honeymoon phase, it's new therefor fun.