Earnings Call - WoW Classic: Biggest Quarterly Increase in Subs in History

Originally Posted by KaPe

There is no official data about number of subs. None. Even the "triple" part always comes back to the same source, which - again - is not an official one.

But then again, people were so eager to see WoW being dead, that they were willing to agree with statistics that would require 50% of playerbase to use Weak Auras in order to be true. Half of playerbase using addons - and a very specific one, that's generally linked to higher end raiding. Yep, totally a realistic scenario.

As a professional stock investor, I don’t care about the conjecture and noise.

The triple number I’m referencing directly comes from inside atvi and has been leaked via several sources.

And Blizz themselves just told atvi that wow classic gave them the biggest subs they’ve EVER had in a single quarter. All time. That’s more than tbc, Wotlk, and any other point gained in a single stroke.

This isn’t just random guessing, these numbers come from inside the company and we’ve known this for months since wow classic was such a resounding success

Let's spend a little more time and effort in WoW classic. Let's fix bugs and broken game mechanics.

Got to love these people.

At first it was "WoW Classic will never work! No one wants to play that!"
Then it was "Fine! We are getting it and its a huge mistake.. 2 weeks everyone will quit!"
After that it was "Alright, people are trying it. A month or two tops and its dead!"
Seems like we are now at "It is just ONE QUARTER! Lets see if it lasts 2!"

Where do we go from here? Arguing if its a year, two, three? Outlasts human civilization or not? I get it some people might not like Classic. Others might not like retail. But I get the impression neither of them are going anywhere anytime soon.

Originally Posted by justandulas

The triple number I’m referencing directly comes from inside atvi and has been leaked via several sources.

When did Superdata, a Nielsen company -- the same company widely criticized for inaccuracies in its TV ratings brand -- become "an inside source directly within Acti"? And can you please qualify "several sources" while you're at it?

This isn’t just random guessing, these numbers come from inside the company and we’ve known this for months since wow classic was such a resounding success

I'll give you the last bit (because it's obvious, not necessarily because the source was correct) but just for the record: Superdata's "research" is, in essence, a very professional, completely unverified guess. Different places repeating the same information doesn't make the source any more authentic.

We do not have any information to qualify the "tripled" claim since we do not know where subs were prior to Classic's release nor do we know where they are now. Even with this official announcement from Blizzard, Superdata's claim is impossible to verify without actual numbers.

Finally, I saved this for last:

As a professional stock investor, I don’t care about the conjecture and noise.

...the irony here is palpable. Good job, dude. It takes effort to be this wrong on the internet.

Originally Posted by KaPe

And here I thought that "easy" only happens on Retail. Which also has nothing to do with Classic population anyway. Unless there are millions people who refuse to subscribe until Phase X is live, the initial sub spike is long over.

yea thats why they opened up lot more servers and 80% of servers are still "layered"... what about the 3-4 servers they started with and that in phase 2 they wouldnt need layers because people would see how bad classic is? After 2+ months, after so many new servers, and servers are still with layers... so maybe, i say...maybe... the sub spike is not over???

Do not confuse classic wow with a retail expansions thats worth 1 or maybe 2 months of playing... classic will stay strong and will continue grow as time goes...

Originally Posted by papajohn4

Do not confuse classic wow with a retail expansions thats worth 1 or maybe 2 months of playing... classic will stay strong and will continue grow as time goes...

Uh, dude, the fact that most realms are no longer layered is indicative that your latter statement is completely incorrect. And a few popular Classic realms with disproportionate player density is not "proof" that Classic is "growing." If anything, it's proof most people would rather stubbornly sit in a login queue than move to another server. (Even if it's free to do so.) At the moment, there are plenty of servers to handle Classic's total population on a single layer and if you dig enough you'll actually find some people on less populated servers asking Blizzard for the ability to pay to get off their current server (because it's already dead).

Also, if Blizzard had opened more server initially, the dead server issue would be even worse than it is now. That's why they were cautious about opening too many servers post-launch in ths first place.

Originally Posted by Potatowizard

Let's spend a little more time and effort in WoW classic. Let's fix bugs and broken game mechanics.

They actually spend 15 years fixing bugs and broken game mechanics, the result is called retail WoW.

Originally Posted by Docturphil

I mean it's definitely a crutch for retail at the very least at this point. BfA sub numbers were quite abysmal from the supposed leaked sub numbers.

"Supposed" what ones? you mean the ones that said 60% of players use weak auras then turned out to just be a random guesstimate number of EU players?

Originally Posted by otaXephon

But hey, why let inconvenient things like facts get in the way of your smug hatred of retail?

Untangle your panties there, friend. I said "supposed". The fact is that Classic brought the highest quarterly subscription increase in WoW history. BfA certainly didn't do that. Shadowlands won't either. The only thing that might break that record will be Classic BC or Classic WotLK.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by otaXephon

if you dig enough you'll actually find some people on less populated servers asking Blizzard for the ability to pay to get off their current server (because it's already dead).

Now you're just making stuff up.

Originally Posted by Docturphil

Untangle your panties there, friend. I said "supposed". The fact is that Classic brought the highest quarterly subscription increase in WoW history. BfA certainly didn't do that. Shadowlands won't either. The only thing that might break that record will be Classic BC or Classic WotLK.

Shadowlands is still in its hype phase so it's a bit early to say it won't be a hit. And further, I'm not even going to disagree with you about Legacy TBC and WotLK because I support both of these ideas. What I don't agree with are the Classic fans who are so fucking obsessed with the idea of their version of the game "defeating" retail that they deride anybody with even the slightest bit of optimism for retail. Both games support one another and Blizzard fully intends the relationship of the two games to be symbiotic rather than adversarial. Whether you agree with that is up to you, but if Blizzard gave even the smallest iota of a fuck about how much "better" Classic is doing than retail, we would've heard a lot more about it than we did at BlizzCon this year.

Now you're just making stuff up.

...you do realize paid server transfers were a thing back in Vanilla, right?

Originally Posted by FelPlague

"Supposed" what ones? you mean the ones that said 60% of players use weak auras then turned out to just be a random guesstimate number of EU players?

Wasn't it "only" 50%? That's far more realistic - after all Weak Auras is one of the most basic addons, something that pretty much every casual installs shortly after capping...

Well, no, not really. I remember those "leaks". People happily agreeing with those insane numbers, while at the same time saying that only 1% people raid mythic... which is pretty much the only place where auras are "needed". *Maybe* if it was DBM (and even then, there's BigWigs), those numbers would be somewhat closer to reality, but still, nowhere near 50%. Half of the playerbase probably doesn't use addons at all, nevermind complex tools like WA.

Sure, the population numbers could have been accurate (we'll never know), but the logic was terrible.

Originally Posted by KaPe

Wasn't it "only" 50%? That's far more realistic - after all Weak Auras is one of the most basic addons, something that pretty much every casual installs shortly after capping...

Well, no, not really. I remember those "leaks". People happily agreeing with those insane numbers, while at the same time saying that only 1% people raid mythic... which is pretty much the only place where auras are "needed". *Maybe* if it was DBM (and even then, there's BigWigs), those numbers would be somewhat closer to reality, but still, nowhere near 50%. Half of the playerbase probably doesn't use addons at all, nevermind complex tools like WA.

Sure, the population numbers could have been accurate (we'll never know), but the logic was terrible.

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH WEAK AURAS ONE OF THE MOST BASIC ADDONS!?
yeah no, it has a high download rate, but idk if you know, but most people dont know how to download addons, and dont ever download addons.

Originally Posted by CptEgo

They actually spend 15 years fixing bugs and broken game mechanics, the result is called retail WoW.

Which is clearly an incredibly popular game. In fact it's so popular, they re-created a 15 year old version of it.

People pay monthly for it. It's boosting their revenue. Issues should be corrected in a timely fashion and not given this back shelf / secondary thought mentality.

Originally Posted by otaXephon

Classic wasn't mentioned because it isn't important. That's not a hot take, it's reality. It achieved its goal of retaining existing players and likely attracted a number of returning players who will end up playing retail once they grow tired of Classic. Players expect OSRS levels of backpedalling from Blizzard but that was never its intended purpose. Classic+ definitely isn't happening and if TBC and WotLK is a possibility they're still waiting for populations to stabilize before announcing it. (BlizzCon 2020 would be the natural timeframe for such an announcement.)

Show me where on the dolly classic touched you.

Originally Posted by Gref

Even if that is so, so what? It is a fact blizzard got huge amounts of money, from classic. Period. THis is a fact. People left is completely irrelevant. Even 1 month of subscription is a huge boost. And that money is ultimately going to retail development. There is nothing to develop in classic. All is there. Recycle. But you gotta pump money into retail. You guys instead of shitting on classic, be grateful for it. There are people liking it, and willing to pay for it that ultimately goes to retail. Some of these people are going to play retail as well, boosting retail population too.

the arrogance, ignorance of retail is beyond my comprehension. I play retail mainly. Got to 55 in classic. And I am damn grateful to all those people playing classic. to keep the budget.

Retail has been losing subs left and right. THis is again a fact. Until when Blizzard can keep up producing expansion if their subs are continuously decreasing.
Suck it up and be grateful there are people playing classic and hope it does not die. It is a clear success for blizzard and for retail players. Actually you should go and play classic if you want to help your retail community.

this is the first sensible comment i have seen on these forums in a long time ... thanks for saying it

Originally Posted by krouger

this is the first sensible comment i have seen on these forums in a long time ... thanks for saying it

Except the post is disingenuous. There is no guarantee the money from Classic subs will go to retail, as it is just as likely to go to a new or existing IP other than WoW, as well as just a bonus in someone’s pocketbook.
Also, Retail could bleed subs out and be low enough the justification to make new xpacs ceases to exist even though Classic could still be around.

Originally Posted by Eapoe

Except the post is disingenuous. There is no guarantee the money from Classic subs will go to retail, as it is just as likely to go to a new or existing IP other than WoW, as well as just a bonus in someone’s pocketbook.
Also, Retail could bleed subs out and be low enough the justification to make new xpacs ceases to exist even though Classic could still be around.

Dude was spot on til he started going into "retail's been bleeding subs left and right." Retail has been doing that since retail was what we now call Classic. Players love to think the current expansion is the worst ever and that whatever (un)popular feature the general consensus disagrees with is the reason. Yet, somehow WoW persists despite its best efforts.

The reason for this is pretty simple yet it's largely ignored because it doesn't make for scintillating headlines like, "the LFR has RUINED the game" followed by a 1,200 word blog post essay capstoned by using that omnipresent subscriber level graph from eons ago to support their argument. That reason: New player generation. Forums only ever seem to give a shit about the exit polls and never even stop to consider the very real possibility for every disgruntled manchild who vows to make Blizzard rue the day they introduced transmog, there's a handful of new players experiencing WoW for the first time. (Ironically, many players refuse to even acknowledge they, too, were new players at one point.) Classic, in this regard, not only represents a player retention mechanism for retail as it helps stem the endemic "subscription bleed" WoW has always suffered but also presents a great bridge for players who weren't interested in retail before (or haven't played since the Harlem shake was still trending) to try it out for themselves. (Despite the harsh admonishment you see for retail by some Classic purists here.) It's a win-win for Blizzard and when you look it from that angle almost... makes you wonder why they didn't do it sooner.