Polygon Interview with Paul Kubit
Polygon recently interviewed Paul Kubit to find out more about Torghast, Tower of the Damned.


  • Torghast offers players materials to create legendary weapons, capped weekly so that you don't have an infinite grind.
  • At launch, players can only equip a single Legendary at a time. You'll be able to make more if you play more though.
  • No plans for a Torghast leaderboard at this time, but they could always do one in the future.


Torghast Torments Feedback
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker)
We agree that one of the best things about Torghast is that you can play at your own pace, without feeling rushed. We certainly don’t want to make Torghast into a fast-paced, timed game mode. We have instead added Torments, which are designed to provide some additional texture for players at high levels, and to solve a problem that arises when extremely difficult content meets our often cooldown-based class design.

Here’s what Torments should do.

Imagine a perfectly-efficient Torghast group. They are willing to do whatever it takes to climb the tower. At the highest difficulty they can manage, that means waiting for all cooldowns on every pull – unless there’s some reason not to do so. This is our problem: that’s not fun to play, but it’s the right way to play if you want to win.

Torments should apply just enough pressure that this group can still kill every single creature on the floor (which takes a while, since these enemies have lots of HP), while still being careful, using crowd control, taking a few seconds to rest or strategize between pulls, and even then, maybe sometimes waiting just a little longer for a cooldown before engaging. If that is the most efficient way to play Torghast, then we’ve hit our mark exactly. If that perfectly efficient group has to skip big portions of a floor because Torment debuffs are getting too out of hand, we have a problem.

Here’s what Torments shouldn’t do.

  • Make Torghast into a fast-paced, time-constrained feature that feels too similar to existing timed features like Mythic Keystone Dugeons, Horrific Visions, or Island Expeditions.
  • Prevent you from taking a break when you need one.
  • Intimidate casual players from playing Torghast altogether.

How can testers help us tune it?

Playtest Torghast, and let us know how it feels. We appreciate all feedback, and the most valuable feedback for this feature will come from experience in Torghast, rather than discussions about time-based difficulty that aren’t informed by in-game experience.
If something feels bad, let us know why.

  • Did you feel rushed when you didn’t want to? Was that pressure because of actual game difficulty, or was it simply the presence of the Torment itself?
  • Were you unable to defeat a level because of Torments, even though you were playing at a normal pace?
  • Did you want to take a break mid-run but felt like you couldn’t?
  • Do you feel like Torments are appropriate, but should be introduced at a higher level than they currently are (12)?
  • Alternately, did a particular Torment feel underwhelming? Do you still feel like you can wait 10 minutes between every single pull without threat of being overwhelmed?

There are several different Torments in the current Alpha. Some affect spawning and environment, and others affect your character directly. Some increase over time, and others remain at a fixed difficulty.

  • How do they feel in comparison to one another?
  • Does a particular Torment feel more punishing or unfun than the others?

We’ve seen some emotional response to this change, which we take to mean that you care about Torghast being fun. We do too.

Please keep up the productive discussions, and we’ll keep listening.

Shadowlands Paladin Class Changes
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker)
Word of Glory was buffed recently on alpha, in particular for Holy.

Some people have seen, but, a few things not clear on Blessing of the Seasons from tooltips alone: the party is only in one Season at a time (whichever you’ve cast most recently). So you are not simply pressing a button every 15 seconds to maintain 4 buffs. You can let each season last anywhere from 15-60s. Assuming you have a favored buff based on role/context, that you want to keep for 60s, it’s more like 4 presses every 2 minutes, but you might vary that based on planning ahead to have certain buffs at certain times.

Ashen Hallow was pretty recently iterated upon, and its tuning might be pretty far off. Increasing value or reducing cooldown could both be options there, although increasing value might be preferable because the visual is so enormous. Also, a long cooldown is better contrast to the other Paladin options.

Seraphim + Inquisition is uncomfortable, we agree. Candidly, one reason it’s hard to address is that there’s probably a split among people thinking one or the other would be cooler to keep. Open problem for now.

Shield of the Righteous: This is an example (with respect to Ret and Holy) of something there hasn’t been much of in the past two expansions or so. A button mainly intended for another spec, that is given to the class while leveling, that you don’t have a strictly clear max-level use for. You certainly can use it, and one can imagine situations where you would. But if you don’t, or don’t put it on your bar, that’s fine. Our current thinking is that instead of taking it away when you choose your specialization, we can just … not. We are discussing the UI that lights up buttons you don’t have on your bar, for cases like this.
This article was originally published in forum thread: Torghast Polygon Interview, Torghast Torments Feedback, Shadowlands Paladin Changes started by Lumy View original post
Comments 50 Comments
  1. Ragedaug's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by ONCHEhap View Post
    exactly the issue here.

    the average player will copy whatever they saw their favourite streamer do or whatever some guy said on reddit and talk shit to anyone who goes against it as if they commited a cardinal sin,either pushing people away from that form of content or making them feel forced to also play that way
    Most average players don't watch streamers, much less mimic them. I would suspect very few if any streamers are going to wait for BL/Hero for each pull. Also, so what if folks want to take 5-10 minutes between each pull. So what?

    I would also suspect the timer is going to end up keeping many average players out, so it's kinda a moot point anyway.

    Personally, I like to deliberate and strategize for a tough pull. If you put a timer on it, you can't do that. It's just go, go, go!

    Imagine you are doing heroic or mythic raid and there's a growing debuff, so the longer you stop to go over strategy for the next pull, the tougher the next pull would be until it becomes mathematically unfeasible.

    If they are worried about people not pushing floors for speed, Blizz can install a leaderboard so we can see the top times for clears. That's an extremely simple way to make sure people aren't going to do what any sane person would already not do...wait on long cooldowns before every pull.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Dracullus View Post
    So if someone would figure out that most efficient way to get legos is to clear room->wait with your cooldowns, every guide on sites like wowhead or icy veins would recomend that.
    It will never be more efficient to do nothing between long cooldowns. This is a giant strawman. How can it be more efficient to wait for your long cooldown, instead of killing stuff while waiting, then when your cooldown it ready, you have far less to kill?

    Ion and you guys are fighting windmills to create boogeymen that don't exist.
  1. Stickiler's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Ragedaug View Post
    It will never be more efficient to do nothing between long cooldowns. This is a giant strawman. How can it be more efficient to wait for your long cooldown, instead of killing stuff while waiting, then when your cooldown it ready, you have far less to kill?

    Ion and you guys are fighting windmills to create boogeymen that don't exist.
    Your assumption is that the given person/group CAN kill stuff. The WoW team isn't worried about people doing this on every floor. They're worried that when players hit the limits of their skill/gear, instead of saying "Let's end this run, go and get more gear/try different tactics", players will instead just wait for all their cooldowns for each pack, and slowly grind their way higher up.

    Players are well known for doing every silly, stupid strategy they can to try and get ahead once they've hit their limits.
  1. cateran100's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Rilas13 View Post
    I like the idea of Torments actually, I have seen a few streamers going through it this week. I understand people's trepidation with this system that was suppose to have no time limit, I get it. But we aren't looking at the devs trying to make speed runs.

    This is a softcap way to keep peoples runs in Torgast from hitting extremes in power balance that would probably favor some classes over others down the line. Shaman's are already kinda broken in Torgast right now. If they were allowed to use Lust on every pack that class specifically may dominate the tower's 1% runs. Leading to community backlash over some classes not being able to climb as far as a result.

    Aside from the potential balancing nightmare, ill also just say what everyone else has said: Waiting for CD's all day isn't that fun. I did it in vanila trying to kill mobs on my own. You can do it with enough time and prep, but I don't think it's healthy for the game imo.

    That being said I haven't tried it yet so like most of you we will just have to wait and see how it actually feels when we can finally get our hands on it.
    I wish there would nbe some way for others to use heroism/bloodlust/time warp....apart from mages, hunters, shamans...ohh, wait Drums of Fury...

    Not to mention, on paper sounds awesome to wait 10 minutes between each pack, but in real no sane person gonna do that..Why? Because it is extremely boring and time consuming (takes around an hour to clean 6 packs....Let`s say only 6 packs/floor....You need to clean 6 floor to reach a checkpoint but they going to be harder and harder so overall 6 floor is 6-7 hours....)
  1. chaoticcrono's Avatar
    blizzturd still hasnt learned to let people have fun without trying to manipulate how they play.
  1. Ragedaug's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Stickiler View Post
    Your assumption is that the given person/group CAN kill stuff. The WoW team isn't worried about people doing this on every floor. They're worried that when players hit the limits of their skill/gear, instead of saying "Let's end this run, go and get more gear/try different tactics", players will instead just wait for all their cooldowns for each pack, and slowly grind their way higher up.

    Players are well known for doing every silly, stupid strategy they can to try and get ahead once they've hit their limits.
    So if they can't kill stuff, then it shouldn't matter. Even if they wait for their cooldowns, it won't help them get past the next floor. I'm not sure what you are worried is going to happen here. Even with the cooldowns they are still going to hit a limit, and it will likely be the next floor after the first floor they needed to wait on their cooldowns for every pull.

    "Oh noes! these guys killed stuff slower than me, they can't be allowed to do that!! Either kill it as fast as me, or don't play!"

    Finding ways to kill stuff that's kicking your rear is the fun of it for some people. They don't only want to do content they can zerg.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by cateran100 View Post
    Not to mention, on paper sounds awesome to wait 10 minutes between each pack, but in real no sane person gonna do that..Why? Because it is extremely boring and time consuming (takes around an hour to clean 6 packs....Let`s say only 6 packs/floor....You need to clean 6 floor to reach a checkpoint but they going to be harder and harder so overall 6 floor is 6-7 hours....)
    This is the reality of it. Waiting for every cooldown is the least efficient, most time consuming, and most boring way to do it...yet Blizzard throwing timers in because they think that's how their players want to play their game.
  1. Kallisto's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by chaoticcrono View Post
    blizzturd still hasnt learned to let people have fun without trying to manipulate how they play.
    NO game in the history of ever has been made without manipulating how people play.
  1. SNES-1990's Avatar
    Another daily Torghast interview.

    Torghast Torghast Torghast.
  1. Biggles Worth's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by trapmaster View Post
    I'm sorry but is this an another "Island Expeditions" 1.5 version or something cuz i can tell it's pretty lazy copy and pasta and a quick slap it with "death theme+horror" or something. I was expecting something really different.. am i wrong?
    These reward you with legendaries, for what ever that's worth. But functionality, it's different.
  1. Erous's Avatar
    Typical Blizz: "Here's our new feature. It shouldn't do this, that, or this other thing." New feature releases. Players: "Why is this behaving like this, that and the other thing."
  1. trapmaster's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles Worth View Post
    These reward you with legendaries, for what ever that's worth. But functionality, it's different.
    Supposely those legendaries given disappointment result when crafted then it's kinda of waste of time isn't it?

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