[Priest] State of Holy - 4.0.6

[Lysdexic]

I hadn't seen the change to Renew's mana cost when I made that build. My intention was to move my points from Divine Touch to SoL. However, I guess that buff to Renew will make it more accessible!

My main use on live atm is on tanks, where its mostly getting refreshed anyway.

[harky]

Desperate Prayer isn't inferior to Binding heal in all cases. It's a free cast whereas Binding Heal costs the same as a Flash Heal, it heals you for more than Binding Heal, and it's instant so it can be cast on the move, it's uninterruptible and immune to cast speed slowing effects.

I had it until I had a feel of the content. I was not using DP at all. After 4 raid nights finding no single time when I needed DP in 16 hours of play I removed it from my build. I was a big supporter of it in ICC/ToC/Ulduar, but it had its day. Damage in T11 is too predictable to need something like DP. Especially when Blessed Resil and Inner Sanctum would both be used in a large number of fights.

[Ultima]

Is there a working mouse over macro for Holy Word: Serenity?

[[-Spiritus-]]

Yes, but its kinda tricksy.

(1) Make sure both SelfCast options are off.
(2) Place Holy Word: Chastise on your hotbar.
(3) Mouse over said hotbar button and copy "/run print(GetMouseFocus():GetName())" in chat and press enter.
(4) Write down the result of the script (you'll see it in chat).
(5) Create a new macro called "HW" [or w/e] with the following script:

#showtooltip Holy Word: Chastise
/target hbtarget
/click INSERT_STEP3_RESULT_HERE
/targetlasttarget

(6) Open mouseover addon of your choice [healbot, vuhdo, clique, etc.] and type in "HW" [or w/e your named it] in the button you wish to bind it.
(7) Make sure your chosen button is not bound to anything else.

You now will be able to mouseover with Holy Word: Serenity. Basically, by doing this, you've bound the hotbar button instead of the spell to your selected key, which allows for the mouseover to be valid. The catch is, to cast Holy Word: Sanctuary with the same bind, you must first be moused over a valid healing target. To get around this, bind Holy Word: Chastise to another button and use that exclusively for HW: Sanc.

[Siri]

I'll be using this:
http://wowtal.com/#k=tYcVs8ol.a8t.priest.

basically just dropping the single point I had in state of mind and moving it to desperate prayer, saying desperate prayer isn't worth it is almost like saying health stones are useless for you.

[Antipathy]

/Agree with Lohe

I've seen a lot of people rip into desperate prayer. the logic for me is flawed; you actively ask for healthstones when raiding, so why is a single talent point for a practically free heal (which has been improved too) such an issue?

[Kelesti]

/Agree with Lohe

I've seen a lot of people rip into desperate prayer. the logic for me is flawed; you actively ask for healthstones when raiding, so why is a single talent point for a practically free heal (which has been improved too) such an issue?

It's not.

But, I'm curious if the new incarnation still scales with +Heal effects (Blessed Resilience, Guardian Spirit, Grace, or even Twin Disciplines).

[Kaysha]

I did some quick, rough calcs and figured that I'd be losing about 1k mana / sec if I kept spamming Heal (1850-ish mana, 2.1 sec cast, 3200-ish MP5). With the Holy Conc nerf, I'd lose around 300 MP5 overall, so my depletion would turn out to be 1,3k mana / sec for Heal. That's an increase in depletion rate of like 30% for that spell. Doing the same for Greater Heal spam would only see a 3% or so increase in depletion rate.

Now, I've since acquired Tyrande's Favorite Doll to replace my Witching Hourglass, which - when used to full - is equivalent to a solid 350 MP5, so I guess that's a compensation right there .

But the depletion rate also depends on other factors, of course. Haste increases it, more MP5 decreases it. And, the need for casting in the first place because every second you're not wasting mana, you're only gaining mana, not depleting it.

[Kalmah]

/Agree with Lohe

I've seen a lot of people rip into desperate prayer. the logic for me is flawed; you actively ask for healthstones when raiding, so why is a single talent point for a practically free heal (which has been improved too) such an issue?

In it's current state desperate prayers isn't worth it. Binding heal takes the same amount of time, is efficient and heals someone else too. Health stones don't trigger a GCD so it's not really the same.

The 4.0.6 Desperate prayers is much better though and will be worth the talent point imo.

[harky]

/Agree with Lohe

I've seen a lot of people rip into desperate prayer. the logic for me is flawed; you actively ask for healthstones when raiding, so why is a single talent point for a practically free heal (which has been improved too) such an issue?

It's not 'such an issue', it's simply that other talents are better now. If DP didn't consume a GCD then I'd agree that it was a vital talent again. As it stands it takes the same time to execute a Binding Heal. DP is 'free' only in that it costs no mana. The cost is in a sharp reduction of output. If you use that DP instead of BH it simply means that you, or another healer must then cover the target you would have otherwise used BH on. I wouldn't knock on someone for taking it, but I also wouldn't advise anyone to take it anymore either. It's purely optional. I find the other options better as I haven't found a use for it yet in T11. That includes hard modes.

[Siri]

Clearly when I wrote it it was in regards to 4.0.6, the talent isn't worth it on live.
Also, call me when you can cast binding heal while moving.

[harky]

Call me when you actually need to cast it while moving. The only time I can think where I'd actually cast DP on live is if I was moving, about to die and no one else had deficit health. Otherwise I'd cast PW:S, Renew, or CoH depending on my needs. 30% of your health is a decent heal. Around 40k for me in raids. In this case it would replace Renew, but only Renew and only if moving and only if I was afraid I was going to die and only if no one else was near me. Again, I dropped the talent after ~16 hours of raiding with it and not having cast it once. There is not enough movement and not enough sudden risk of dying to need DP. Be it a heal for 20k, or a heal for 40k, it will still get limited use. It's going back into my PVP spec as I'd removed it from that as well, but it isn't something I need for PVE. I'll most likely be taking Rapid Renewal for my last filler point in the spec.

[gotpriest]

Really though Harky?

You'd rather take Rapid Renewal, a talent that merely reduces a global cooldown on a spell that has diminished in use greatly since Wrath over a 40k, 2 minute CD, no mana cost heal? Even as a Raider, I can think of plenty of times where the proverbial feces hit the aerial convection device requiring many an innovative combination of heals - and in those cases, DP is indispensable. I find it being used on every CD even in live, because it's free healing. I'd hazard that I use it more than renew, that stays only on the tank and an occasional melee.

Here's why I find DP to be a fantastic heal now and in the coming patch: It keeps me from clicking my own lightwell, leaving it for others.

My 4.0.6 PVE: Healing Spec: http://wowtal.com/#k=tYcVs3gI.adl.priest.
My 4.0.6 PVP: Healing Spec: http://wowtal.com/#k=v1waWpWl.adl.priest. (I just can't get myself to take Divine Touch atm, it's terrible healing for 2 points)

I wouldn't begrudge anyone that didn't take it on live in 4.0.3, but to not take it in 4.0.6 with the free floating talent points we'll have sounds almost stubborn

Edit: One thing I failed to mention is that we have yet to see the full culmination of Chakra changes. With the duration being lengthened to 1 minute, but still on 30s CD, I can't possibly see Blizzard ignoring the obvious uselessness of State of Mind. Depending on the changes that come, we will be far more restricted, and I can clearly see losing DP.

[harky]

You seem to have some strange ideas about Renew. That may be why you're also not taking talents like Divine Touch, which is +10% healing to all Renew casts. Renew on live is our most efficient normal single target heal (only Serenity beats it). No, that isn't a typo. Efficient. My GCD is currently back up to 1.24 seconds. This means for every cast of Renew I will gain .24 seconds of time. I cast Renew 15-20 times on an average fight. With the changes in 4.0.6 I will most likely cast it quite a bit more as its efficiency will be even higher. I'd think somewhere in the 25-30 range on longer fights. This would give me room for several more casts. More importantly it would allow me to get back to casting other spells following a Renew.

You may be finding uses for DP, even on live. I won't argue that it's useful if you are casting it. I was unable to find times when it was a good spell to cast. I've mentioned it a few times, but I had 0 casts of DP in 4 full nights raiding before dropping it. My argument is not that it isn't a decent heal, or that a free heal is bad. My argument is that there are better heals and the mana savings are canceled out by the GCD being wasted on a sub-par heal.

[Siri]

They're not even the same kind of spells, renew won't save your ass, neither will CoH because they heal for very little (ok, renew heals for a decent amount but it takes a long time to gain that effect and as thus, won't save you)

If you want to AoE heal, there are more effective tools at your disposal than renew.

[harky]

Yes, there are. Thus why I don't use it when AoE healing. Not sure I understand the relevance.

My go to spell for saving my own ass when moving is PW:S by the way. Not Renew. When moving you are doing so not because you're at low health and will die, but because you will die regardless of health by standing where you were. I use Renew as a stabilizing heal. Thus it only being thrown out 15'ish times in a fight. Quite a bit more on Nef and Chim though, I must admit.

I thought I'd need DP when raiding as well, until I'd started work on hardmodes and realized it just wasn't needed. All I'm doing for 4.0.6 is moving the 1 point from BR to RR and 2 from SoM to SoL. Like I said, if you enjoy DP then by all means. My argument is against it being required. It's optional, not bad.

[Siri]

I don't think it's required, I simply believe it to be better than the alternatives. Healthstones aren't required either, a lot of the time I don't even end up using them, but they're still a better save than a shield is and will continue to be so even after the shield buff.

I may re-evalute this opinion when/if I see someone making good use out of divine touch.

[NoHealsForYou]

I still don't understand why people are planning out Talent Spec changes for 4.0.6 which involve the removal of SoM when it is HIGHLY unlikely blizz will leave the talent in it's current state. I'm not really deciding on anything until I see the final patch notes and I expect SoM to be changed into something that we'd at least consider taking.

About DP, it's currently useless on live but in 4.0.6, I'd probably take it. a 35-40k, free, instant cast heal on a 2min CD? Why not. Sometimes RNG just screws you over, it's another tool to have and generally, I always loved the fact that my priest had more tools for any situation than most other healing specs. I enjoy the flexibility I have.

On another note, I'm fully expecting to see PoH's healing nerfed at some point with perhaps CoH and/or ProM slightly buffed to compensate. Aoe fights where a priest on raid healing uses almost exclusively one spell (+PoH glyph + EoL ticks) is a little bland. Yeah, ProM and CoH have uses in current content (Normal mode at least, I'm not up to heroic modes yet) but their healing is still somewhat underwhelming. Same is true of Sanctuary. Yes, it's extra healing done, but for a spell where I have to be in the right stance (chakra), for a high mana cost and considering I need to place it properly with foresight for where people will be stacked...it seems awfully weak.

I'd like to see Sanctuary changed. Not to something as simple as more healing done, but something to increase it's synergy with aoe spells (given it's the 'ultimate' spell in our aoe chakra). Maybe players standing within sanctuary gain an increased 50/100% extra healing from EoL. Makes mastery more attractive, makes the spell more attractive. Or, ProM/CoH heals on players within sanctuary are increased by a further 10%. -Edit, maybe even changed the current SoM to reflect such a change to santuary. More ideas. The talent has so much potential.

Just thinking out loud, but I feel kind of one-dimensional when it comes to dealing with AoE, raidwide damage. As much as I enjoy hitting the high HPS numbers, I don't want to heal like Rdruids and Dpriests famously did in Wotlk.

[Deleted]

The new build on the PTR lists a change to Lightwell.

Lightwell now restores [ 11820 + 6% of Spell Power ] health over 6 sec, down from [ 12848 + 15% of Spell Power ]

So it now scales better with spell power but has a reduced initial amount... Does anyone have the maths for this change to put it into context?

[Vook]

So it now scales better with spell power but has a reduced initial amount... Does anyone have the maths for this change to put it into context?

No, it heals for less.

Old: 13k + 15% of SP
New(PTR): 12k + 6% of SP

So it's a decent nerf.

Full changes:

Holy

• Lightwell now restores [ 11820 + 6% of Spell Power ] health over 6 sec, down from [ 12848 + 15% of Spell Power ]
• Chakra now also affects Flash Heal or Greater Heal. Serenity now also procs from Flash Heal, Greater Heal, or Binding Heal. Chastise now procs from both Smite and Mind Spike.
• Blessed Resilience now also procs from a critical hit from any attack.

Dunno what they mean by "Flash Heal and Greater Heal proccing Serenity". Does that mean you can cast Chakra then use FH/GH to get into Heal Chakra? Cool.