It's official, Night Elves evolved from Dark Trolls (and MORE lore).

[Selkhet]

The first question... *shrug* They may have just been a very localised species from the beginning. Just look at Quillboar and Harpies who presumably have a similar ancestry. Also, there are the Taunka all over Northrend.

Don't forget Tauren used to be nomadic. When something troublesome approached the piece of land they were living in, they probably just packed their things and moved somewhere else.

[Deleted]

Don't forget Tauren used to be nomadic. When something troublesome approached the piece of land they were living in, they probably just packed their things and moved somewhere else.

To be fair, they pretty much only moved from one end of the Barrens to the other and into Mulgore whenever they had the chance.

[Fizzlegear]

-Brann believes all non titan races except trolls and their descendants are the offspring of various ancients. Tauren came from a "bull ancient", gorlocs from a a "frog ancient" (they later evolved into murlocs), Tuskarr from a "walrus ancient", harpies from Aviana, ect.

If all non-troll, non-titan races come from ancients, what kind of ancient spawned goblins? (or the goblin-pygmy ancestor)

[Sal the Shieldhog]

To be fair, they pretty much only moved from one end of the Barrens to the other and into Mulgore whenever they had the chance.

Yeah, then the Centaur were all like, "We keel you!" and Cairne was like, "Yo Thrall" and Thrall was like, "You no keel Taurent!" and then Cairne established Thunder Bluff. Pretty much that part of Warcraft summed up

---------- Post added 2011-08-17 at 04:05 PM ----------

If all non-troll, non-titan races come from ancients, what kind of ancient spawned goblins? (or the goblin pygmy ancestor)

Maybe they (pygmies) are an offshoot of Troggs, which were then exposed to Kaja'mite, thus creating Goblins as we know them

[Deleted]

If all non-troll, non-titan races come from ancients, what kind of ancient spawned goblins? (or the goblin pygmy ancestor)

The goblins were created, according the Faceless on the Lost Isles.

[Selkhet]

To be fair, they pretty much only moved from one end of the Barrens to the other and into Mulgore whenever they had the chance.

The fact that there are Tauren in Kalimdor and Taunka in Northrend shows they moved quite a bit in the past, assuming they started from a common ancestor.

[Fizzlegear]

The goblins were created, according the Faceless on the Lost Isles.

Created by Old Gods, I'm assuming. They could have just meant that goblins had evolved due to Kaja'mite, which is implied to originate from Old Gods.

[Deleted]

The fact that there are Tauren in Kalimdor and Taunka in Northrend shows they moved quite a bit in the past, assuming they started from a common ancestor.

It most likely was pre-Sundering that the races split. The War of the Ancients trilogy does mention some Tauren helping in the war, and they seem to have moved with the Night Elves when the Well of Eternity imploded. They never really struck me as... you know... global travelers.

Alternately, it may have actually been during the Sundering. Maybe a part of their forces moved northward for some reason (perhaps with Night Elves - see the NE ghosts and ruins in Northrend).

[mistuhbull]

To be fair, they pretty much only moved from one end of the Barrens to the other and into Mulgore whenever they had the chance.

Unless Freewind Post and Sunrock Retreat were built in the 10 years between WC3 and WoW (possible, i dunno their history) their existence, along with that of Camp Mojache points to the Tauren migratory region being at least Feralas, 1k Needles, Stonetalon, Mulgore, and Barrens.

Hell it would make sense that they did a circle route with a camp in Desolace, there was a Tauren village thing at the old Kodo graveyard IIRC

[Deleted]

I dunno, I think the taunka are evidence that tauren indeed travelled quite a distance

[Zoma]

Hmm, although it is clear that Tauren and Taunka are related, are they from the same ancient? Or are the Bull ancient and possible Buffalo ancient siblings?

[ELYPOP]

Hmm, although it is clear that Tauren and Taunka are related, are they from the same ancient? Or are the Bull ancient and possible Buffalo ancient siblings?

The Tauren up north just developed more fur/other stuff due to the cold climates. Just like evolution. They could easily have originated from the same Ancient.

[Thorfisnson]

Tauren came from a marooned Welshman who couldn't find a sheep.

[esmifra]

I'm yet to understand how is it possible for Taurens to pre date Titans and be descendants of an ancient at the same time... For what I now from lore that is a paradox.

Also we've never heard of an "Bull" like ancient before...

[Zoma]

I'm yet to understand how is it possible for Taurens to pre date Titans and be descendants of an ancient at the same time... For what I now from lore that is a paradox.

Also we've never heard of an "Bull" like ancient before...

I've been browsing Wowpedia, and I can't find anything that indicates that the ancients came after the Titans visited Azeroth. I'm not sure what the paradox is.

As for not hearing about a bull ancient before, there are plenty of demigods. There is no reason we would know all of them. In WotA, when the ancients join the battle, no exact number is given, but there is said to be "scores of other unique figures" (score = 20). This implies there are at least 40 (minimum, there are probably more), and some of these ones can be the progenitor ancients.

[shadowkras]

Ancients are spirits, for spirits to exist they must have lived someday. So its fair to assume they are like the oldest spirits of each animal, more likely the first ones.

[Deleted]

I've been browsing Wowpedia, and I can't find anything that indicates that the ancients came after the Titans visited Azeroth. I'm not sure what the paradox is.

Hamuul states that Tortolla has been 'a part of Azeroth since the time of the Titans'. So he's been around back when the Titans first came (or at least when they left).

[Zoma]

Hamuul states that Tortolla has been 'a part of Azeroth since the time of the Titans'. So he's been around back when the Titans first came (or at least when they left).

Is there anything that says the Titans were responsible for Tortolla, or did he come into existence naturally at around the time of the Titans? Also, did the demigods come at about the same time, or did some/many exist before others?

[Deleted]

Is there anything that says the Titans were responsible for Tortolla, or did he come into existence naturally at around the time of the Titans? Also, did the demigods come at about the same time, or did some/many exist before others?

Some are older than others. As for the other question, no idea. There is no real evidence to support the Ancients being created by the Titans, but it is not impossible.

[esmifra]

I've been browsing Wowpedia, and I can't find anything that indicates that the ancients came after the Titans visited Azeroth. I'm not sure what the paradox is.

As for not hearing about a bull ancient before, there are plenty of demigods. There is no reason we would know all of them. In WotA, when the ancients join the battle, no exact number is given, but there is said to be "scores of other unique figures" (score = 20). This implies there are at least 40 (minimum, there are probably more), and some of these ones can be the progenitor ancients.

The paradox is that it is stated that when titans got to Azeroth only elementals and Old Gods were present, that was latter retconned but if Tauren are in Azeroth be4 the titans and they descend form an ancient then so all the killboar, harpies, wolfs, turtles and an immense amount of other beings that are similar to ancients.

It is never said that Ancients existed before Titans, but it was stated that the vast majority of life in azeroth either came from the Titans or the curse of flesh.

So proof by obscurity (lack of proof against it) is not valid sorry.
Saying that there is not paradox because there's no proof against it is like saying god exists because there's nothing that proves it doesn't.

The same I can say about there are ancients we never heard about.

This can later be retconed but what I'm saying is so far, in lore, points that this is a paradox.