Waypoints? Good or Bad?

[Deleted]

I'm also quite curious what the general dislike for mounts, or the specific dislike for flying mounts is all about...

Basically, mounts destroy the wilderness of wilderness, especially flying mounts where you can fly anywhere in the world without risk.

This is why I prefer waypoints/flightpoints, or my personal idea of having roads that boost run speed as long as you stay on them (or mounts that only work on roads). Safe travel is not the problem. Safe travel pretty much everywhere is a problem.

[Alatian]

It's worse for the new player. Remember that sense of awe when taking your first flightpath? It's better for the experienced player in the long run, though. One thing I really admire with Anet is that they always stick to their core values, one of which is "Having fun, not waiting to have fun". Waypoints are simply an extension of that, allowing you to meet up with your friends, tackle a dungeon, or enter the Mists instantly.

[Deleted]

I prefer not to give that any consideration at all.

Get off your high horse if you want to continue participating in a constructive discussion.

If you expect people to take your opinion seriously then you better start by respecting theirs.


There can be valid cases made both for and against way-points.

Imo they symbolize the continuing trend of instant gratification by removing all penalties and downtimes like death, travel etc. It's ironic that people complain about the lack of life in Azeroth and the fact that people can port to any content they want while it's revered as a great feature in GW2.

[Mif]

Imo they symbolize the continuing trend of instant gratification

It's about the trend of removing grind.
Travel in Wow isn't meant to be fun, it's meant to waste your time to stretch content out so you don't get bored and cancel your sub.

And since GW2 has no sub, they don't have to screw their players around with crap like flight paths.
Instead they can offer instant map travel so you can play any content you want, when you want.

[Deleted]

Found this developer post on guildwars2guru when looking around if waypoints could be disabled by dynamic events.

If I fail to cull the horde and the timer reaches zero then the zombies will all shamble out of the swamp and attack the fortress. I have failed the event but now a new event presents itself where I can defend the fortress from the horde. If the fortress is overrun it will remain occupied by zombies until cleared, a valuable travel point will be lost, merchants and other NPC’s will be unavailable.

So apparently they can be disabled. Which is very nice since you won't be able to teleport in behind the front line in that case.

[Deleted]

It's about the trend of removing grind.
Travel in Wow isn't meant to be fun, it's meant to waste your time to stretch content out so you don't get bored and cancel your sub.

You don't honestly believe that, do you?

Do you really think the designers that together when designing WoW and said "Hmm, we definitely need a feature that wastes a lot of player time"?


Any script writer will tell you that even an action movie can't be filled with 90 minutes of gun-fights and explosions. You need slow-paced parts in order for the fast-paced ones to matter. The Battle for Middle Earth would seem a lot less dramatic if the Fellowship could simply teleport there.

Or using a different analogy, imagine a family trip to Disney Land. Unless you live in South California that's quite a trip to make. It requires a little planning and forethought but the journey makes the whole trip more meaningful. If you could simply teleport to Disenyland, sure you could get right to the stuff that matters (rides, shows and attractions) but it would also "cheapen" the experience.

By having waypoints everywhere you make you location within the world practically meaningless.

In a way it's similar to having trash-mobs in a raid-instance. Do you still remember how much less epic TotC felt compared to more conventional raid-instances?

But honestly, I've argued about this waypoint debate more than enough and am slowly getting tired of it. People are arguing pro waypoints because ANet is implementing them. But nobody would be defending them if they weren't.

[Mothhive]

Do you really think the designers that together when designing WoW and said "Hmm, we definitely need a feature that wastes a lot of player time"?

Not quite. More like "Hmm, we definitely need a ton of features that waste a lot of player time".

Virtually everything in WoW is designed around wasting players time in order to keep them subscrbing, because money and subscriber numbers are all Blizzard really care about now.

[Durzlla]

You don't honestly believe that, do you?

Do you really think the designers that together when designing WoW and said "Hmm, we definitely need a feature that wastes a lot of player time"?


Any script writer will tell you that even an action movie can't be filled with 90 minutes of gun-fights and explosions. You need slow-paced parts in order for the fast-paced ones to matter. The Battle for Middle Earth would seem a lot less dramatic if the Fellowship could simply teleport there.

Or using a different analogy, imagine a family trip to Disney Land. Unless you live in South California that's quite a trip to make. It requires a little planning and forethought but the journey makes the whole trip more meaningful. If you could simply teleport to Disenyland, sure you could get right to the stuff that matters (rides, shows and attractions) but it would also "cheapen" the experience.

By having waypoints everywhere you make you location within the world practically meaningless.

In a way it's similar to having trash-mobs in a raid-instance. Do you still remember how much less epic TotC felt compared to more conventional raid-instances?

But honestly, I've argued about this waypoint debate more than enough and am slowly getting tired of it. People are arguing pro waypoints because ANet is implementing them. But nobody would be defending them if they weren't.

Well the fellowship of the ring wouldn't change at all since yet haven't discovere those waypoints first..... And totc wasn't dry epic due to the majority of bosses bein pretty lame... Secondly you get rewarded for NOT usin them, arenanet is totally planning on rewarding their explorers!! And lastly, blizz isn't wow, so they're not going to force people to waste their time instead of playing the game... And btw, you don't have to use waypoints if they bug you that much

[Eorayn]

I see waypoints as flight routes in WoW. You just skip the flight time between the two locations, so you don't have to wait such a long time.

[Glytch]

Imo they symbolize the continuing trend of instant gratification by removing all penalties and downtimes like death, travel etc. It's ironic that people complain about the lack of life in Azeroth and the fact that people can port to any content they want while it's revered as a great feature in GW2.

i would make the argument that it's not so much instant gratification by itself but its a disconnect between RP'ers (Dungeons and dragons pnp type games) and those who play video games. while all RPGS stem from PnP RP games they are lacking the back and forth that occurs between players and the stuff you did between adventures. when you're sitting at the table with other people that all mattered because the DM/GM could toss anything at you whenever they wanted so it had to be accounted for. plus it offered the chance for players to bond without the stresses (even though they werent real) of combat

the reason we dont see this level of detail in video games is mostly due to our level of technology when it comes to AI, its still very primitive even with all the advances over the last 20 years. we cant build an AI that can deliver the same thing. in addition to the technical limitations in an MMO you arent always around other players so theres no point to have a long drawn out travel time since you dont have that back and forth with another player.

the idea is fragmented but hopefully you catch my drift