[Music] Metal

[Duilliath]

It's an idea but I imagine it becoming very chaotic. A program or site that counts the number of votes for and against within a certain time period that people could vote on would be perfect for this kind of thing. Just add suggestions, give people a chance to vote over a 1 week time period, suggestions with a lot more positive votes than negative would be added to the list right away, albums with equally positive and negative votes will be revoted, albums with a lot of negative votes are not added to the list.

Most popular does not equal essential. Justin Bieber is one of the most popular artists currently. This does not in any way make him an essential artist.

[Kreyzor]

Most popular does not equal essential. Justin Bieber is one of the most popular artists currently. This does not in any way make him an essential artist.

I understand your point, but then who or what is to say what makes an album essential? If you can't rely upon the people who listen to it in the first place, then who do you expect to determine what is essential? You could just look up critic's reviews of albums, but that would entirely defeat the purpose of the thread.

[WaitingforMoP]

Good grief, most of the stuff posted in here is some severely underground music........

Most popular does not equal essential. Justin Bieber is one of the most popular artists currently. This does not in any way make him an essential artist.

Actually, he is an essential (pop) artist for people to know about if they like pop music.

Calling something essential is strictly opinion, technically no music is essential

[nbm02ss]

Good grief, most of the stuff posted in here is some severely underground music........



Actually, he is an essential (pop) artist for people to know about if they like pop music.

Calling something essential is strictly opinion, technically no music is essential

I would argue that "pop" isn't an actual genre though. His music still fits a particular genre, though I don't know what that is because I've not heard a lick of anything he's put out (thankfully, as I'm told).

Also, in terms of essential, I would argue there are in terms of albums that helped shaped genres and influenced other artists, like Celtic Frost's "To Mega Therion".

If none of that made sense I apologize...I'm drunk....

[Duilliath]

I understand your point, but then who or what is to say what makes an album essential? If you can't rely upon the people who listen to it in the first place, then who do you expect to determine what is essential? You could just look up critic's reviews of albums, but that would entirely defeat the purpose of the thread.

To me, and I'll readily admit this is strictly personal and highly subjective, it is how much a band has influenced other bands or how much impact it has had on a specific genre. Good examples would be Black Sabbath, Iron Maiden or At The Gates to name three. A bad example would be Children of Bodom.

This in part also addresses the above post about Bieber: he has not influenced anyone and as such is hardly essential. Possibly in 10 years, we will say that 'Justin Beaker started emulating the Bieber-sound and became highly succesful with it', at which point we might want to include Bieber. However, seeing how there's very little originality in Bieber's sound (from what I've heard, which, again, admittedly, isn't all that much), this may be hard to conclude.

[Deleted]

A bad example would be Children of Bodom.

Depends, CoB pretty much single handedly spawned the so called "extreme power metal".
Although it is a small 'subgenre' the enormous influence CoB had on those type of bands with the at the time unusual keyboard melodies on their early albums is undeniable.

[Duilliath]

Not particularly. Those same keyboard lines were already being done by Arcturus and Dimmu Borgir. Or, if you wish, Beethoven.

[Deleted]

It really depends on what context essential is used in. Essential, as in influential to the genre as a whole or essential as in must be heard by all metal fans? The former is, imo, extremely limiting, the list will be pretty short and let's be honest here, influential bands are not always the best at what they do. The latter is more interesting but also definitely subjective. If we were to use the poll popular bands will have a big advantage, not a bad thing per se, but after having seen some peoples taste I fear the list would look something like this:

Metallica - St. Anger
Dragonforce - Inhuman Rampage
Dimmu Borgir - Abrahadabra
Korn - Follow the Leader

Another problem I see with using a poll would be that there is no way of knowing who votes for what. I don't want some power metal fan down voting "Altar of Madness" or "A Blaze in the Northern Sky" just because they don't like death metal or black metal.

[JohnBrown1917]

It really depends on what context essential is used in. Essential, as in influential to the genre as a whole or essential as in must be heard by all metal fans? The former is, imo, extremely limiting, the list will be pretty short and let's be honest here, influential bands are not always the best at what they do. The latter is more interesting but also definitely subjective. If we were to use the poll popular bands will have a big advantage, not a bad thing per se, but after having seen some peoples taste I fear the list would look something like this:

Metallica - St. Anger
Dragonforce - Inhuman Rampage
Dimmu Borgir - Abrahadabra
Korn - Follow the Leader

Another problem I see with using a poll would be that there is no way of knowing who votes for what. I don't want some power metal fan down voting "Altar of Madness" or "A Blaze in the Northern Sky" just because they don't like death metal or black metal.

As far as "essential" metal albums go, korn and dragonforce are 2 of the last bands I would consider suggesting to somebody,

[Deleted]

Not particularly. Those same keyboard lines were already being done by Arcturus and Dimmu Borgir. Or, if you wish, Beethoven.

Not necessarily in the same way or in the same context. Arcturus and even DB (although DB less, as some keyboard lines in Stormblast were main melody lines pretty much) used those things for atmospheric purposes. And Beethoven didn't play metal.

But since they are not a grim true cult frostbitten band and they "sold out" before the last three albums, I don't expect you to see it, but they WERE an influence for many many bands.

But whatever, I don't think any list like that is good anyways since as you said yourself before, it is way too subjective so /careface.

[Duilliath]

As far as "essential" metal albums go, korn and dragonforce are 2 of the last bands I would consider suggesting to somebody,

+1 for reading comprehension. That would be why he put them in his post

@ Uldreth - I own their first CD. It's not like I have zero idea of where they came from. Even so, the keyboard melodies were largely taken directly from Arcturus (or, if you wish, Winds).

[Deleted]

@ Uldreth - I own their first CD. It's not like I have zero idea of where they came from. Even so, the keyboard melodies were largely taken directly from Arcturus (or, if you wish, Winds).

Dunno if you said this before or after my edit but meh, I don't hear much similiarities in the purpose of synths in Something Wild and Aspera Hiems Symphonia.

With that said I am not sure if it is relevant anyways, as bands like Norther or Wintersun don't really build on the Arcturus-type synth playing but on the CoB-type synth playing.

[WaitingforMoP]

As far as "essential" metal albums go, korn and dragonforce are 2 of the last bands I would consider suggesting to somebody,

Dragonforce IS essential power metal imo... NOBODY does it better than them in that genre, and beleive me I've looked into it a great deal

Especially now , they have a new better singer & more varied songs

I get the feeling some people seem to have some idea that Obscure > Mainstream but for no actual/valid reasons. No. It does not make you cooler to listen to bands nobody has ever heard of.

[Deleted]

<snip>
I get the feeling some people seem to have some idea that Obscure > Mainstream but for no actual/valid reasons. No. It does not make you cooler to listen to bands nobody has ever heard of.

I'm really curious how you came to that conclusion.

[Laundry]

Just actually found this thread, and I'm glad I did. Chances are I can find some metalcore fans here, so I thought I'd share a pretty good upcoming band. If anyone is interested, look up Adestria and listen to Outsiders. Their CD just came out on 3-26-12, and it's entitled Chapters.

Technically once you've heard one metalcore band, you've heard em all, but I'm a fan of the genre so yeah, that's that.

Here's a link to the suggested song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8Dq7JJJ1wI

[Kreyzor]

Dragonforce IS essential power metal imo... NOBODY does it better than them in that genre, and beleive me I've looked into it a great deal

Wat. I think this single handedly shows why making an "essential Metal Albums" thread would just not work.

However, if just the OP determines what should and shouldn't be on the list then its going to become inherently biased to the tastes of the OP. But if everybody has a say then the "essential Metal Albums" thread just becomes the "Metal Albums" thread. I can't think of any fair method unless as Duilliath said to somehow determine what is and isn't influential on a specific genre or sub-genre, but different people will always have their own opinions...

I feel like I should post something instead of just talking

[WaitingforMoP]

I'm really curious how you came to that conclusion.

I just see alot of people with that mentality around the internet, here... youtube... other sites, everywhere really. Its an observation not a conclusion.

A bad example would be Children of Bodom.

............. I hope you're just saying COB is not "Essential" in your opinion and not calling them bad.

If you dislike COB well.... then all of your opinions are officially dead to me

[nbm02ss]

I just see alot of people with that mentality around the internet, here... youtube... other sites, everywhere really. Its an observation not a conclusion.



............. I hope you're just saying COB is not "Essential" in your opinion and not calling them bad.

If you dislike COB well.... then all of your opinions are officially dead to me

There's nothing wrong with disliking a band, even if it's lauded over within the metal community. I, myself, find them boring. Much the same way I don't really dig Amon Amarth either. /shrugs

Oh, and Dragonforce is quite possibly one of the worst bands I've ever seen live.

[WaitingforMoP]

There's nothing wrong with disliking a band, even if it's lauded over within the metal community. I, myself, find them boring. Much the same way I don't really dig Amon Amarth either. /shrugs

Oh, and Dragonforce is quite possibly one of the worst bands I've ever seen live.

Dragonforce writes stuff that puts them in over their (or really anyone else if they tried to play its) head cause its so fast, and they are really enthusiastic about getting drunk... I can't say I blame them for doing sloppy jobs live, but studio its great imo

[Deleted]

Dragonforce writes stuff that puts them in over their (or really anyone else if they tried to play its) head cause its so fast, and they are really enthusiastic about getting drunk... I can't say I blame them for doing sloppy jobs live, but studio its great imo

Their (Dragonforce) songwriting is very repetetive however.

And the funny thing is I really don't mind repetition (SPELLINGZ?????) at all so when it gets so repetetive it bothers me then you know there is something stinky there.

DF is way too cheesy, self repeating and pointless for my taste. But then again I dislike the vast majority of EU power metal.