[Megathread] DotA 2

[Valedus]

Well, by that measure, Pudge's hook is bad too, because he's entirely reliant on that. Hookshot really isn't that hard to hit with, because it moves at about 2000 move speed, and his battery assault shuts down a lot of heroes in the game, and pretty much always hits the people in your cogs. And well placed flares can get some early kills, kinda like Sun Strike or AA's ult sniping.

[Lysah]

I went mid against windrunner (yeah...) and pretty much destroyed her. Scepter at 13 minutes and went for pipe after. The amount of damage you can do with a 15 second cooldown on hookshot is pretty high. Definitely not a hard ult to hit, if they're standing next to creeps and you hit the creeps it will still stun and damage them - don't forget that the entire path and landing site in an AoE is affected by the ult. The range once you get level 11 is also totally unavoidable for enemies, you can be so far out of vision they really can't predict it. Rockets also help keep back enemy pushes from across the map, give minor vision, and can help finish off people who barely escape a fight.

All in all, clock really isn't bad. The biggest reason I don't think he's worth picking is that he all but needs mid - he needs to get pretty much all 3 of his spells to 4 before he's that useful in a team fight. Furthermore, he needs to stay tougher than the enemy team or he will just get stomped on when he ults in. The second you start falling behind as clock you're done, wasted pick on your team. Even with rockets he is godawful at farming, if you can't get ganks with hookshot/cogs and make successful kills you're 'gonna have a bad time.

[Valedus]

Yeah, agreed. Blade Mail definitely helps with the getting stomped when you ult in, and its somewhat cheap. IMO, he is definitely a fine strength support initiator, though.

[PizzaSHARK]

Yeah, agreed. Blade Mail definitely helps with the getting stomped when you ult in, and its somewhat cheap. IMO, he is definitely a fine strength support initiator, though.

Problem with Blade Mail is that you both have to be tanky enough to actually survive the incoming damage AND they can't have lifesteal, otherwise Blade Mail is just about wasted money. Sure, 20% leech means they're still taking 80% of their damage, but that's not going to be enough in most cases, and they can always simply not attack you.

For STR intiators, SK and Tide are the obvious choices, especially once they get Blink. Slardar is also really underrated I feel... his ulti is fantastically useful, his stomp has a pretty low cooldown and cost for how effective it is, and once he has treads and maybe some other attack speed source, his bash becomes very reliable.

I would place Pudge's hook above Clockwerk's ulti because it doesn't require a scepter upgrade to be useful. Right from level 1 Pudge can grab enemies or save teammates with well-timed hooks, and in most cases getting hooked by a level 6+ Pudge means you're dead unless someone can bail you out with a cyclone or disruption or force staff.

[Valedus]

Problem with Blade Mail is that you both have to be tanky enough to actually survive the incoming damage AND they can't have lifesteal, otherwise Blade Mail is just about wasted money. Sure, 20% leech means they're still taking 80% of their damage, but that's not going to be enough in most cases, and they can always simply not attack you.

For STR intiators, SK and Tide are the obvious choices, especially once they get Blink. Slardar is also really underrated I feel... his ulti is fantastically useful, his stomp has a pretty low cooldown and cost for how effective it is, and once he has treads and maybe some other attack speed source, his bash becomes very reliable.

I would place Pudge's hook above Clockwerk's ulti because it doesn't require a scepter upgrade to be useful. Right from level 1 Pudge can grab enemies or save teammates with well-timed hooks, and in most cases getting hooked by a level 6+ Pudge means you're dead unless someone can bail you out with a cyclone or disruption or force staff.

Even if they have life steal, most carries can't deal with 80%-100% thorns, so they may not attack you, but when they are stunned and forced into a cage with just you, what else are they going to do? Be cc'd (essentially) for 5 seconds? Also, its not hard for most Str heroes to be much tankier than carries, especially in pub games. Not saying Clockwerk fits well into the current pro meta, and I did not watch the game, but he's a fantastic ganker and initiator.

Edit: Damn, I really can't wait for the International to happen so they can release some of the newer heroes I haven't experienced because I stopped playing DotA1 years back. So many of them sound unique and interesting, and still missing heroes like TC, Centaur, Soulkeeper, Magnus, Troll, etc. Bah.

[PizzaSHARK]

Even if they have life steal, most carries can't deal with 80%-100% thorns, so they may not attack you, but when they are stunned and forced into a cage with just you, what else are they going to do? Be cc'd (essentially) for 5 seconds? Also, its not hard for most Str heroes to be much tankier than carries, especially in pub games. Not saying Clockwerk fits well into the current pro meta, and I did not watch the game, but he's a fantastic ganker and initiator.

Edit: Damn, I really can't wait for the International to happen so they can release some of the newer heroes I haven't experienced because I stopped playing DotA1 years back. So many of them sound unique and interesting, and still missing heroes like TC, Centaur, Soulkeeper, Magnus, Troll, etc. Bah.

Christ I miss Soulkeeper, baiting idiots in pubs never got old.

[Lysah]

Lothar's>sunder/eth blade/dagon 5 requires something like 8,000 health to survive :x

[Alraml]

Yeah, despite all the hype leading up to it I actually skipped a significant portion of each game in The Defense grand finals because it was obvious who was gonna win.

---------- Post added 2012-08-13 at 11:30 PM ----------

Infused ran a Clockwerk versus Na'Vi in that AMD tournament and predictably they lost. I'm just not convinced Clockwerk is a useful hero. He seems like a hero that becomes more and more weak as the game goes later and later due to his pretty lackluster stats and lack of any real damage output. Flares are fucking incredible for the first 20 minutes of the game (fuck you, you don't get to use clarities) but 200 damage on a fairly lengthy cooldown plus travel time rapidly becomes negligible as the game goes later and heroes go from having 800 HP to having 1500 HP.

There were other issues with Infused's play leading to their loss (TA losing her lane vs Rubick in mid was probably the primary reason for the loss), but I never really got the impression that Clockwerk did anything useful all game, meaning it was essentially 4v5.

Clock is one of those heroes that HAS to do well in the earlier stages of the game in order to transition well. His hookshot is a ridiculously good initiator and with agh scepter it's CD is absurd for a 3000 range hook. You pretty much can't regenerate against clock early though. I've played against one where even when I was hiding my clarity uses and salves got sniffed out. I think it even stops urn

A dagon build for clock wouldn't surprise me cause hook + missile is quite a lot of burst early on.

Maybe he should be built like Dark Seer IE going for a fast pipe

I think he's a good hero it's just that game went so horribly for them. TA lost mid so hard that top lane had to rotate in to try and save him and then brood was just allowed to go unchallenged in top lane.

Darer ran a strange team before. AA, Chaos Knight and Clinkz

[Deleted]

>Trying to show friend how awesome Ion Shell + Smoke is.
>Creeps bug out and run away in random directions.

Does anyone know if this is intentional or something?

[Alraml]

>Trying to show friend how awesome Ion Shell + Smoke is.
>Creeps bug out and run away in random directions.

Does anyone know if this is intentional or something?

It's a recent patch. Basically if the creeps are taking damage from an invisible source they scatter. It prevents dark seer from super stacking the woods and wiping out like 4 packs at once. Dark Seer was the very reason it happened

Just watched M5 vs EG

Tastless: That game was as one sided as a moebius strip

[Lillpapps]

Why did people smoke ion shell anyway? Just ion shell one of the creeps after you have stacked... It doesnt cost any gold.

[Deleted]

It's a recent patch. Basically if the creeps are taking damage from an invisible source they scatter. It prevents dark seer from super stacking the woods and wiping out like 4 packs at once. Dark Seer was the very reason it happened

Just watched M5 vs EG

Tastless: That game was as one sided as a moebius strip

Jahapp.

Why did people smoke ion shell anyway? Just ion shell one of the creeps after you have stacked... It doesnt cost any gold.

Since they used to just stand there, you'd do damage to the entire camp instead of everyone but the guy with the shell on him. If you just Ion Shell'd a creep they'd also all run towards you, get blocked etc and eventually Ion Shell would just be damaging like 2-3 creeps because they'd spread out in a line.

[Finear]

leaked 6.75 screen

more here
http://www.dota-blog.com/2012/08/dot...han-place.html

[Alraml]

leaked 6.75 screen

Anakin.... I don't even know you anymore. You're going down a path I can't follow =)

[Glorious Leader]

Oh shit I wonder if we'll see pitlord in dota 2.

[Finear]

rosh used to be here
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1925062/war...7-51-15-38.jpg
"new" ramp location
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1925062/war...7-51-30-58.jpg

it definitely looks less dire favored which is good
but it kills beastmaster ancient farm on bot lane
and as radiant you cant buy items inside rosh pit anymore (ofc you cant as dire to but previous location gave radiant easy acces to shop)

keep in mind this is beta leak

[Deleted]

What

[Alraml]

rosh used to be here
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1925062/war...7-51-15-38.jpg
"new" ramp location
https://dl.dropbox.com/u/1925062/war...7-51-30-58.jpg

it definitely looks less dire favored which is good
but it kills beastmaster ancient farm on bot lane
and as radiant you cant buy items inside rosh pit anymore (ofc you cant as dire to but previous location gave radiant easy acces to shop)

keep in mind this is beta leak

They changed the whole rosh area once before to make it more accessible to the sentinel. I guess they've changed their minds

Dota 1 looks so alien to me now, too much Dota 2

[PizzaSHARK]

Clock is one of those heroes that HAS to do well in the earlier stages of the game in order to transition well. His hookshot is a ridiculously good initiator and with agh scepter it's CD is absurd for a 3000 range hook. You pretty much can't regenerate against clock early though. I've played against one where even when I was hiding my clarity uses and salves got sniffed out. I think it even stops urn

A dagon build for clock wouldn't surprise me cause hook + missile is quite a lot of burst early on.

Maybe he should be built like Dark Seer IE going for a fast pipe

I think he's a good hero it's just that game went so horribly for them. TA lost mid so hard that top lane had to rotate in to try and save him and then brood was just allowed to go unchallenged in top lane.

Darer ran a strange team before. AA, Chaos Knight and Clinkz

Where would he get the farm for the fast Pipe from? He's pretty meh at farming creeps, especially compared to Dark Seer. And I'd think Hookshot+Dagon would cause a lot of mana problems for him. His ulti is his only expensive skill, but due to his awful stats, he doesn't have a lot of mana and Bottle can't really be used in a fight since damage will stop the charges. I've tried Soul Ring on him and a lot of the 150 MP tends to go to waste since you don't get to keep leftovers and the costs of his individual skills is so low.

EDIT: Interesting fact: apparently Tiny is better off taking his ulti at level 6 instead of delaying it. The autoswing damage boost and Toss damage boost basically even out with Toss+Avalanche being maxed one level earlier as long as you get one autoswing in, and if you get more than one autoswing in during the combo, it's actually more damage, not to mention the movespeed boost.

[Alraml]

Where would he get the farm for the fast Pipe from? He's pretty meh at farming creeps, especially compared to Dark Seer. And I'd think Hookshot+Dagon would cause a lot of mana problems for him. His ulti is his only expensive skill, but due to his awful stats, he doesn't have a lot of mana and Bottle can't really be used in a fight since damage will stop the charges. I've tried Soul Ring on him and a lot of the 150 MP tends to go to waste since you don't get to keep leftovers and the costs of his individual skills is so low.

EDIT: Interesting fact: apparently Tiny is better off taking his ulti at level 6 instead of delaying it. The autoswing damage boost and Toss damage boost basically even out with Toss+Avalanche being maxed one level earlier as long as you get one autoswing in, and if you get more than one autoswing in during the combo, it's actually more damage, not to mention the movespeed boost.

Just ideas, i've not really put any serious thought into it