Stop Hating People That Hate Daily's

[Jerot]

Can't be bothered to wade through such a large thread of needless QQ but I think I'll just leave this here:

1. Don't do them all at once, You have all expansion and beyond to finish these. Work on 2-3 at a time, there is no progression-reason to do Anglers, Cloud Serpent, or even Tillers (Other than a bit of gold/mats) in addition to finishing Golden lotus AND klaxxi at the same time.

2. Don't complain that you have to do it on every alt, you decided you wanted to do the same content over by rolling another character. If you don't like it, they have the revered bonus in 5.1, or you can be a responsible person and stick to one character.

3. I put a three down before I knew what I was going to put here, and I forgot. Oh well.

*Edit*
4. Don't hate haters hating haters who hate haters, YOU HATER!

[Pancaspe]

I hate, hate, hate, running Heroics, and I love Dailies. This system is fantastic.

[Gilian]

You could ask for that, which have no logic at all. Some people even did asked for LFR to drop blues and even not drop anything at all.

The difference is that Blizzard has not taken similar actions to what you ask in the past, but they did took actions that seem to contradict how the daily system is working.

Lets take the word mandatory away since you guys dont seem to understand what we want to say with the word and take the word literally.

The thing is: Blizzard has taken off the game things that gave advantages to raiders but required huge grinds to do so (25 man raids doing 10 mans in Wrath, head enchants in Wrath/Cata). The dailies system give raiders a bigger advantage and asks a bigger grind than those taken off the game before. It doesn't make any sense.

It's the same logic you use.

If you don't want a word to be taken literally here then use other words.

You are unbelievable. I give up. Go cry in a corner about your dailies. I hope you quit playing.

[Granyala]

I'm casual, ilvl 463+, and hate dailies. What do you propose I do to advance my character after the weekly LFR if dailies are "optional"?

every action is optional, but the reputations in MoP are an advancement gate. If you want to play more than 2 hours a week and get better gear than heroics offer, you need to do dailies. Saying they're optional is a cop out. Take a second to take off the blindfold and look at this poorly designed reward system.

While I personally don't agree with blizzards decision of rep gating valor items when the acquisition of valor itself is already gated beyond retarded levels, I don't see it as a problem.

With the absurdly slow speed of grinding valor, you casuals surely have the time to do the 5 quests for one faction a day, if you can grind out your valor cap every week.

Thankfully, my raiding main is already in a position where she no longer needs Valor. I'd hate to grind that shit out every week. oO

[Ambrosios]

You've got to play WoW, you've got to play everyday.

[rinleezwins]

Can I kindly ask a mod/admin to fix the thread title already? It makes my eyes bleed every time it pops up in the "recent posts" area.

[Crashdummy]

I agree. The gear has no business having a reputation requirement at all. The valor cap is far more gating. A very simple solution would be to remove the reputation requirement entirely.

That would fix some of the problem yes, and it would actually make dailies optional unless you are an enchanter/BS/LW/Tailor.

It would be a better situation than now of course. Setting reputation requirements to earn valor gear is stupid, the whole point that the egar cost valor points, which is a gated system, is that you can only buy one gear every x time.

They basically double gated valor gear, which makes no sense. I can understand asking for rep to buy an epic for gold, but valor gear is already gated by asking valor points to be bought.

---------- Post added 2012-11-02 at 08:22 AM ----------

Except that Blizzard doesn't want people just sitting in the cities all the time like we did in Cata. Yes, it is a giant control mechanism to get players to act the way that Blizzard wants them to.

Ok, now you see what we are telling since the start. Players are being FORCED to do content they dont like to get this rep and gear. How good is for a game to force people into doing things they dont like is a subject to argue about. A better solution would be to put in the world things that people enjoy doing. I dont recall Wrath having forced dailies and people were nto in the cities all the time, the problem with Cata wasnt the tabard system, the problem with Cata was THAT THERE WAS NOTHING FUN TO DO.

Forcing players to go into the world to create the illusion that people are enjoying the activity is not a good way to go IMO.

---------- Post added 2012-11-02 at 08:24 AM ----------

Which profs aren't gated?

If you say alchemy, I'll laugh at you.

I meant the professions that are not gated by reputation, and yes alchemy is one. You can get all the recipes for alchemy in a lvl 80 toon.

---------- Post added 2012-11-02 at 08:29 AM ----------

Well that's the point. Scribes & Jewelers are gimped enough by RNG there is no need to gate them further.
Gating alchemy makes no sense at all.
Big enchants were always hidden behind rep, it's tradition at this point.

Armor crafters get their good patterns in raids as usual.

I honestly don't see the problem here.

This is not true. Mongoose and Crusader wants to have a word with you. I'm not saying that Mongoose and Crusader system was better though.

---------- Post added 2012-11-02 at 08:32 AM ----------

*sighs* lets retire from this thread, its getting cyclical and boils down to people saying "I'm not happy with this aspect of the game they should change it" and in fairness, we're not going to alter that. Wish they didn't need to put so much damn whine into it all, its not like paying for wow is .... mandatory (oh yeeah) so with any luck they'll just leave.

Oh yes, the same attitude people refusing to hear valid concerns had in Cataclysm... I hope Blizzard learned from cataclysm that ignoring valid concerns is not the way to go.

---------- Post added 2012-11-02 at 08:39 AM ----------

It's the same logic you use.

If you don't want a word to be taken literally here then use other words.

You are unbelievable. I give up. Go cry in a corner about your dailies. I hope you quit playing.

No its not the same logic i use, and i certainly gave arguments in my posts, you just sit there saying no.

Yeah i will have to do that since apparently people are unable to set the context and intentions of words around here, i will have to talk as if i were talking to a 5 year old kid from now on.

There are plenty of people already quitting about dailies, i wont, but refusing to acknowledge the problems the game has was a HUGE mistake in the past from Blizzard, i hope that unlike you they have learned from the past expansion.

[velde046]

The valor gear and charms are mandatory in the same sense it was mandatory to raid 10 man even if you were a 25 manr aider in Wrath, and in the same way head enchant was mandatory: It gives you a GOOD ADVANTAGE.

Yeah, sure it gives an advantage, but not one that is neeeded. Perhaps if you're in one of the guilds going for world first..., are you?
And funny thing is, all those guilds cleared the instance without having a lot of crafted epics and such (they could have all reps to revered so only few epics possible), so the advantage is becoming negligible more and more.

Turns out that it's becoming 'I want it all and I want it NOW!!' kind of chant...

---------- Post added 2012-11-02 at 12:51 PM ----------

There are plenty of people already quitting about dailies,

Give us a number then please? How many have quit over the dailies? Please back it up with evidence.... And 'ALL my friends quit over the dailies..... I miss them both so much' doesn't count as evidence. I know there are plenty of people that do not like dailies but I doubt many actually quit over it...

[Lora]

The tabard method was honestly the best but laziest. You should not have to log on every single day. That's bad. The max you can get with gear outside of the daily content is 376. People are complaining because you need the reputation to spend the valor you earn by doing heroics or scenarios. You can buy blue items but they are worse than heroic loot. The valor items all require rep. That is a problem.

[AeneasBK]

Oh yes, the same attitude people refusing to hear valid concerns had in Cataclysm... I hope Blizzard learned from cataclysm that ignoring valid concerns is not the way to go.

*shrug* that kinda depends on whether you think the game is better with 12 million subs or 9 million or whether the number of subs doesn't matter one jot to you and the game it self does. So yes, I kinda wish they had ignored the "valid" complaints that 5 man content now required a moment of thinking (maybe a whole 20 seconds before a tricky trash pull, or a *gasp* 30 seconds before a boss to check over tactics, oh the humanity!) and left them as they were, why should I care if 3 million people quit over it, they're clearly very, very bad gamers. In the same way that I hope they ignore these "valid" complaints that dailies are bad and gating optional kinda bad gear behind rep for the people who don't raid is a terrible model.

---------- Post added 2012-11-02 at 11:54 AM ----------

The tabard method was honestly the best but laziest. You should not have to log on every single day. That's bad. The max you can get with gear outside of the daily content is 509. People are complaining because you need the reputation to spend the valor you earn by doing heroics or scenarios. You can buy blue items but they are worse than heroic loot. The valor items all require rep. That is a problem.

Fixed the iLvl there for you.

You say in one line you can buy blue items but they are worse than heroic loot, and in the next say the VP needing rep is a problem but VP items are worse than raiding gear so whats the beef? If you want good gear raid!

[Boogieknight]

*shrug* that kinda depends on whether you think the game is better with 12 million subs or 9 million or whether the number of subs doesn't matter one jot to you and the game it self does. So yes, I kinda wish they had ignored the "valid" complaints that 5 man content now required a moment of thinking (maybe a whole 20 seconds before a tricky trash pull, or a *gasp* 30 seconds before a boss to check over tactics, oh the humanity!) and left them as they were, why should I care if 3 million people quit over it, they're clearly very, very bad gamers. In the same way that I hope they ignore these "valid" complaints that dailies are bad and gating optional kinda bad gear behind rep for the people who don't raid is a terrible model.

The game should matter the most, but that won't be the case anymore since the sub numbers are as high as they are. Profitability will be the most important thing, and one thing the changes in Cataclysm should show is that what you, me, or anyone else wants will be secondary to maintaining subscribers for profit. They aren't going to accept another mass exodus like they had from 4.0-4.3, and I can guarantee you that if this rep/daily issue is the source of it they will change it in some way. I'm an achievement hunter and I stayed through all of Cataclysm even when I had nothing to do, but even these dailies are beginning to test my patience and resolve (Shado-Pan in particular.) I really think August Celestials and Shado-Pan should not be gated behind Golden Lotus reputation, and the valor/justice gear should not have a reputation component. I think a lot of players would be fine with those few changes, but taking a "suck it up, or fucking quit" stance like the heroics caused in 4.0 will just instigate a mass loss of subs and the reaction from Blizzard will just upset you more than the complaints. If you expect some people to be flexible and suck it up, you damn well better be willing to do the same and deal with the complaints and find a reasonable compromise.

[AeneasBK]

The game should matter the most, but that won't be the case anymore since the sub numbers are as high as they are. Profitability will be the most important thing, and one thing the changes in Cataclysm should show is that what you, me, or anyone else wants will be secondary to maintaining subscribers for profit. They aren't going to accept another mass exodus like they had from 4.0-4.3, and I can guarantee you that if this rep/daily issue is the source of it they will change it in some way. I'm an achievement hunter and I stayed through all of Cataclysm even when I had nothing to do, but even these dailies are beginning to test my patience and resolve (Shado-Pan in particular.) I really think August Celestials and Shado-Pan should not be gated behind Golden Lotus reputation, and the valor/justice gear should not have a reputation component. I think a lot of players would be fine with those few changes, but taking a "suck it up, or fucking quit" stance like the heroics caused in 4.0 will just instigate a mass loss of subs and the reaction from Blizzard will just upset you more than the complaints. If you expect some people to be flexible and suck it up, you damn well better be willing to do the same and deal with the complaints and find a reasonable compromise.

I agree with you, I don't really voice a "suck it up or quit" opinion too loudly, most of my shouty in this thread has been mostly in an attempt to persuade people that they don't have to do these dailies if they don't want to, rather than saying "just quit". However in agreement with the "profits will steer this games direction" comment, I feel that it almost allows people to "hate on the people that hate dailies", its kinda cyclical.

I still believe though that dailies are there to do as and when you can be bored enough I barely do any, I'll get my gear from raid kills or LFR, I'll do the dailies when I just wanna chill in the afternoon and chat with people.

Guess loads of people are in really really uptight guilds. Well we got 8/8 HC DS last expac (6/7 HC Fl, all but Sinestra and Throne of 4 Winds encounters HC from t11) so our formula seems to work out well enough

[Synstir]

Well already changes to rep-gain are announced and also vp-gain. This had a reason.
The question is: is this enough?

if it isn't and players start leaving, then yeah Blizzard will take action.
it is normal to have the maximum possible players for any company.
if players only complain and keep playing, well then yeah this was the correct action to take.
We'll see what the numbers do, because I think that is the only thing which has influence on the thinking of blizzard.

The players are devided on this, some like the grind and some don't. I think Blizzard sure is keeping an eye on this.
I personally think they went overboard with it, but that is me.

[GotYoShoes]

Dailies are much better then spending all day farming while you wait for your guilds raid nights to come up.

I like getting gold, VP, motes, gerbs, Golden Lotus and other goodies for 1-2 hours of my time.

[Deleted]

I don't understand the max lvl system they use in MoP.
I hit lvl 90, bought the ilvl 450 pvp gear from AH to boost my ilvl to get into heroics. (was enough to be able to tank so np there)

By the time i had Jp to buy something there was only 1 upgrade left so that kinda sucked because i flew to the vendor expecting a variety of items.(luckily for me they already changed the rep needed, else i wouldn't even have a choice)
*Also buying a Jp item and then getting a better 463 item from a Random generated lootbag from a craptastic 3 man scenario wasn't a nice surpirse either.

Then i got to 1250 Vp and i got the grand choice of 1 neck item to buy from klaxxi because i didn't have enough days of repgrind dailies. (started 2nd day at 90 i think)

So when I log in I don't think "what could I do now, farm some? Get some satchels ? lvl an alt ?"
Nah, it's, "Skip all that and go do the dailies because else i can eat my vp with my morning coffee or something"

[Crashdummy]

Dailies are much better then spending all day farming while you wait for your guilds raid nights to come up.

I like getting gold, VP, motes, gerbs, Golden Lotus and other goodies for 1-2 hours of my time.

One thing to note, no one is asking that Blizzard removes dailies.

What people are asking is either give us alternatives to raise the rep for those of us that DESPISE dailies, or take the valor gear from the double gating of rep and leave dailies and rep for what they were always were, mounts and vanity items.

So if you enjoy doing dailies, you would still do them, and the vanity items and tyhe mounts you will get will be mroe exclusive, because only those that LIKE to do the dailies will have them, those that dont like dailies wont have them because they wont be forced to get so close to them that will do the last gap.

[Deleted]

What people are asking is either give us alternatives to raise the rep for those of us that DESPISE dailies, or take the valor gear from the double gating of rep and leave dailies and rep for what they were always were, mounts and vanity items.

Big ² to that.

[Gurbz]

Ok, now you see what we are telling since the start. Players are being FORCED to do content they dont like to get this rep and gear. How good is for a game to force people into doing things they dont like is a subject to argue about. A better solution would be to put in the world things that people enjoy doing. I dont recall Wrath having forced dailies and people were nto in the cities all the time, the problem with Cata wasnt the tabard system, the problem with Cata was THAT THERE WAS NOTHING FUN TO DO.

Forcing players to go into the world to create the illusion that people are enjoying the activity is not a good way to go IMO.

How about you follow that quote with the rest of what I said, instead of only the part that seems to support your argument. The daily system does not force players to do anything any more than any other rewards system in WoW does. The entire game is a giant carrot on a stick, and has been since it launched. Further, when broken down to basics, every video game is built on exactly the same principle. Do Activity X for Reward Y. And if you don't do the activity, you don't get the reward. If I don't raid, I don't get Tier gear. If I don't PvP, I don't get PvP gear.

Rewards of various fashion have ALWAYS been locked behind some activity or another. The only reason some people are complaining now is because now something that they want is locked behind something they don't want to do.

That is really all this comes down to. You want the reward without having to do the activity associated with it. The only basis for your argument is that this reward has never been tied to that particular activity, so it obviously shouldn't be now. Or that you should be able to perform a different activity for the exact same reward. Nothing in WoW has EVER worked like that, especially valor gear. To access it, you have to do dailies. Before MoP, to gain access to valor gear you had to run dungeons and/or raids. The only thing changed was the activity associated with accessing the reward. Not liking that activity is not a valid enough reason to demand that it change, especially when there are people who prefer this model over the other. Your opinion is no more valid than theirs.

There are multiple paths available as alternatives for getting equivalent or near equivalent gear for every aspect of the game, though not always in the same amount of time. If you don't like to raid, you can get roughly equivalent gear by doing dailies and buying valor gear. If you don't like arenas, you can do BGs for conquest points. If you don't like doing dailies, you can ignore them and only do LFR/Normal/Heroic raids. If you want to maximize your character's total potential, you may be required to participate in activities you do not find enjoyable, but that has been true since Vanilla where raiders had to spend hours upon hours farming mats for consumables. And it is purely your choice. Even Blizzard has started shooting down the argument that it is not. Yes, certain guilds may require it. But there are other guilds that do not. Or you could form one that does not. You have options. Choices exist. It is not anyone else's fault that you are not taking them.

[Crashdummy]

How about you follow that quote with the rest of what I said, instead of only the part that seems to support your argument. The daily system does not force players to do anything any more than any other rewards system in WoW does. The entire game is a giant carrot on a stick, and has been since it launched. Further, when broken down to basics, every video game is built on exactly the same principle. Do Activity X for Reward Y. And if you don't do the activity, you don't get the reward. If I don't raid, I don't get Tier gear. If I don't PvP, I don't get PvP gear.

Rewards of various fashion have ALWAYS been locked behind some activity or another. The only reason some people are complaining now is because now something that they want is locked behind something they don't want to do.

That is really all this comes down to. You want the reward without having to do the activity associated with it. The only basis for your argument is that this reward has never been tied to that particular activity, so it obviously shouldn't be now. Or that you should be able to perform a different activity for the exact same reward. Nothing in WoW has EVER worked like that, especially valor gear. To access it, you have to do dailies. Before MoP, to gain access to valor gear you had to run dungeons and/or raids. The only thing changed was the activity associated with accessing the reward. Not liking that activity is not a valid enough reason to demand that it change, especially when there are people who prefer this model over the other. Your opinion is no more valid than theirs.

There are multiple paths available as alternatives for getting equivalent or near equivalent gear for every aspect of the game, though not always in the same amount of time. If you don't like to raid, you can get roughly equivalent gear by doing dailies and buying valor gear. If you don't like arenas, you can do BGs for conquest points. If you don't like doing dailies, you can ignore them and only do LFR/Normal/Heroic raids. If you want to maximize your character's total potential, you may be required to participate in activities you do not find enjoyable, but that has been true since Vanilla where raiders had to spend hours upon hours farming mats for consumables. And it is purely your choice. Even Blizzard has started shooting down the argument that it is not. Yes, certain guilds may require it. But there are other guilds that do not. Or you could form one that does not. You have options. Choices exist. It is not anyone else's fault that you are not taking them.

I wont keep the discussion of if people are forced or not to do them because i have discussed that for about 20 pages and we wont reach a consensus, it makes no sense to keep discussing it.

Clearly, a lot of people feel they are forced to do them, and the alternatives to get equivalent gear were not always there (tell me without using heart of fear what alternative to similar gear a shaman caster has for his wrist slot that is not from valor).

The point is, asking people that in order to get a big advantage in an activity he likes (dungeon/raids) they need to spend A LOT of time in a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT activity is not a good thing IMO.

The dailies system was working fine when it rewarded vanity items and mounts, and the rep system was working fine before. Want to make improvements? Fine, but dont break what was working.

Again, both giving choices to raise the rep or getting all the valor gear out of the reputation gating since they already are under a gating system (if dailies are so fun and people are so eager to do them, and are not being forced to do them i'm sure taking valor egar away from them wont change much, right?), both options would work fine IMO.

[willtron]

this is not true. firelands dailes were optional content. mop dailes are not. or maybe you think of everything as optional content. bgs are then optional as well as raids.

technically, they are - you aren't made to do anything in the game