Will the GOP admit and then adapt to their loss?

[smelltheglove]

You could get a world of debate on the idea that leaders need to be intellectuals. Leadership is a skill. It is not a requirement to be an intellectual to be a great leader. LBJ was no intellectual. Neither was Reagan. Bill Clinton is no intellectual. He has a near photographic memory, which can give that appearance, but he's, well, Bubba. Jimmy Carter was an intellectual, but had terrible leadership skills. Politics is about finding leaders to take the reins of government.

very good point. i do like your assessment of clinton, but i do think he is a bit more... canny than you give him credit for, although that really isnt the same as being intellectual.

glad to see you didnt vilify carter... not a great leader, true, but he is imo a true asset to this country and the world. he has a great heart, and is tireless in trying to better the world (whether you agree with his ideals or not)

[Grummgug]

Bill Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar. Reagan was an anti-intellectual dolt, and it showed.

Clinton was famous for being a total slacker in college. He'd party for weeks than cram for tests and get straight As with that photographic memory of his. An intellectual, he is not because he has no passion for learning. He has a rare skill that allows him to recall large amounts of information verbatim. It makes it very easy for him to be a devastating public speaker. But again, he is no intellectual.

[Spectral]

Clinton was famous for being a total slacker in college. He'd party for weeks than cram for tests and get straight As with that photographic memory of his. An intellectual, he is not because he has no passion for learning. He has a rare skill that allows him to recall large amounts of information verbatim. It makes it very easy for him to be a devastating public speaker. But again, he is no intellectual.

Apparently your definition of intellectual is quite different than mine. I'd consider a Rhodes scholar with a broad range of interests and incredible capacity to learn and store information, then communicate it to others to be an intellectual, even if someone said he didn't work hard in college.

[Grummgug]

The entire Bill and Hillary marriage is one big power trip. Bill has rare skills. But he's not the brains of the operation. Hillary was always the mastermind. She plans everything out and guides him along, with the goal of both reaching the peak together.

Obamacare was put together by democrats in congress. Obama was just the salesman. But health care reform in 1993 was put together by Hillary herself. They spent tons of time locked away in the White House puzzling it out. It wasn't congress working on that.

[Nakura Chambers]

No, there are not.

Yes, there are. In fact, there are over twice as many conservatives than there are liberals in America.

No, they are not. For example, the opinion that women can't get pregnant when they're raped is not just as valid as my thoughts on the matter. The belief that evolution is a "lie from the pit of hell" is not just as valid as my thoughts. The idea that all opinions are equally valid is nonsense.

One guy (Todd Akin) said that and he was immediately asked to step down by Republican voters, Republican politicians, and party leaders. The guy is an idiot, he would still be better than McCaskill, but that doesn't mean he was fit for office.

I'm from Missouri, the state Todd Akin was running in. Let me tell you this, we were going to win that senate seat if it weren't for that one remark. Every single one of McCaskill's Republican challengers (in the primaries) had a 10+ point lead on her in the polls, the guy could have gone into a coma and we still would have won that seat.

[Grummgug]

Yah, you can't seriously pin the Akin comments on the entire GOP. That isn't a way to generate constructive discussion.

[Nakura Chambers]

Well, that completely makes the NDAA okay! Sorry Barry, you can assassinate/detain me without trial now because liberal college grads voted for you along party lines!

Incorrect. CNN exit polls show the vast majority of college graduates vote Republican; whereas the vast majority of high school drop-outs vote Democrat.

[Wells]

Incorrect. CNN exit polls show the vast majority of college graduates vote Republican; whereas the vast majority of high school drop-outs vote Democrat.

citation please.

[SirRobin]

glad to see you didnt vilify carter

I still think his Malaise Speech could have been the start of something new. Just ended up being another missed opportunity.

---------- Post added 2012-11-14 at 08:13 PM ----------

citation please.

Hehe... Like there could be one for that.

[Spectral]

Yes, there are. In fact, there are over twice as many conservatives than there are liberals in America.

You said Republicans vs. Democrats, not liberals vs. conservatives. There was a much larger share of the electorate that self identified as Democrat.

One guy (Todd Akin) said that and he was immediately asked to step down by Republican voters, Republican politicians, and party leaders. The guy is an idiot, he would still be better than McCaskill, but that doesn't mean he was fit for office.

Yeah, it actually fucking does mean he wasn't fit for office. Believing shit that absolutely inane should be sufficient to disqualify someone.

I'm from Missouri, the state Todd Akin was running in. Let me tell you this, we were going to win that senate seat if it weren't for that one remark. Every single one of McCaskill's Republican challengers (in the primaries) had a 10+ point lead on her in the polls, the guy could have gone into a coma and we still would have won that seat.

Yeah, I know you would have won the seat were it not for that remark. I have no idea what you're driving at. I wish more Republicans would join the Rape Caucus openly and get their asses voted out of office.

---------- Post added 2012-11-14 at 09:14 PM ----------

Yah, you can't seriously pin the Akin comments on the entire GOP. That isn't a way to generate constructive discussion.

I can, however, pin rejection of evolution and climate change on the GOP.

[Nakura Chambers]

citation please.

http://edition.cnn.com/election/2012...e/MO/president

---------- Post added 2012-11-14 at 08:27 PM ----------

You said Republicans vs. Democrats, not liberals vs. conservatives. There was a much larger share of the electorate that self identified as Democrat.

The pollsters admitted that they were oversampling Democrats. They tried to justify it by saying that they were trying to recapture the 2008 voter turnout, in which more Democrats voted than Republicans.

Yeah, it actually fucking does mean he wasn't fit for office. Believing shit that absolutely inane should be sufficient to disqualify someone.

I think you misread my statement. I said that just because he was the lesser of two evils, doesn't mean that he was qualified. In other words, he definitely wasn't fit for office.

Yeah, I know you would have won the seat were it not for that remark. I have no idea what you're driving at. I wish more Republicans would join the Rape Caucus openly and get their asses voted out of office.

How liberally "tolerant" of you.

I can, however, pin rejection of evolution and climate change on the GOP.

Not really. Evolution versus creationism is a religious issue, not a political one. It's not that we don't believe in climate change, it's that we don't think there is anything viable the government can do to stop it. Even if there is a viable way to reverse climate change, we need to be careful not to sacrifice our principles and our freedoms in the name of combating it (like what happened with the War on Terror). History is rife with people using things like this as a means to power.

[SirRobin]

http://edition.cnn.com/election/2012...e/MO/president

This link is more useful: http://edition.cnn.com/election/2012...race/president

That is interesting how both some college and postgraduate favor democrats while only college favors republican. I wonder what they forget after college that they remember if they continue their education?

[Grummgug]

I can, however, pin rejection of evolution and climate change on the GOP.

I don't think anyone rejects the idea of climate change. We have clear evidence the climate changes over time. The debate over man-made climate change is an interesting one. I'm old enough to remember scientists claiming all the oceans would be dead by the year 2000 due to man made climate change. They stated their beliefs back then just as confidently as they state their current ones now.

[Nakura Chambers]

I don't think anyone rejects the idea of climate change. We have clear evidence the climate changes over time. The debate over man-made climate change is an interesting one. I'm old enough to remember scientists claiming all the oceans would be dead by the year 2000 due to man made climate change. They stated their beliefs back then just as confidently as they state their current ones now.

Ted Danson said the climate change would destroy the Earth by 1998, he was wrong. Al Gore said the same thing, but extended it 2016.

[Spectral]

The debate over man-made climate change is an interesting one.

No, it's not. It's not even a real debate, it's climate scientists on one side and people that don't know shit about climate science on the other side.

I'm old enough to remember scientists claiming all the oceans would be dead by the year 2000 due to man made climate change.

No, you're not. That didn't happen.

---------- Post added 2012-11-14 at 09:42 PM ----------

How liberally "tolerant" of you.

I have never, ever claimed to be tolerant of stupidity or evil. I regard Akin as either stupid or evil.

Not really. Evolution versus creationism is a religious issue, not a political one.

Get that shit out of classrooms then. One is science, the other isn't.

It's not that we don't believe in climate change, it's that we don't think there is anything viable the government can do to stop it.

It's kind of amusing to see what version of denialism is the flavor of the day.

[KingHorse]

How does it not fairly discredit the GOP? These are states where conservatives have held power for years, often times with little to no opposition. If their ideology is superior then why do the states they control rely on liberal bastions?

Population density.

[Wells]

http://edition.cnn.com/election/2012...e/MO/president

This is a single very red state.

[Bakis]

It's not that we don't believe in climate change, it's that we don't think there is anything viable the government can do to stop it.

You goto be joking? Just shows how little "you" people know of it. It is not about stopping cos that train passed a long time ago.
It is about slowing it down and reverse it and give the planet time to recuperate.
Since you are not able to stop it in a week, fuck it, business as usual amarite?

No, it's not. It's not even a real debate, it's climate scientists on one side and people that don't know shit about climate science on the other side.

Swazi you just made this remark painfully true in at least your own case.

[Nakura Chambers]

It's kind of amusing to see what version of denialism is the flavor of the day.

You can build as many windmills as you want, but it still won't be a viable energy source, plus they are causing the extinction of wildlife (namely birds).

[Grummgug]

Ted Danson said the climate change would destroy the Earth by 1998, he was wrong. Al Gore said the same thing, but extended it 2016.

Al Gore is very damaging to the entire case for man made climate change.

I think science would be much better off just making the case that pollution is bad, and we need to reduce it. I think everyone can get behind that.

But trying to tie it to global climate change projections greatly weakens the case. And its not a needed step. Just say "let's fight pollution."