CRZ is stupid

[kojinshugi]

If you want PvP only when it's convenient to you, you roll on a PvE server.

When you want that constant risk of camping, ganking or sieges, you play on a PvP server.

This cannot be said loudly enough, yet no one is listening.

I like PvP, I don't like world PvP, because it's inherently unfair and inconvenient. But I do understand why some people like it. Hence, PvP servers and PvE servers.

I think the people complaining about CRZ on PvP servers are mad because PvP servers are actually risky again, and you have to earn the distinction of playing on one. It's all well and good being perma-flagged in deserted zones. But that's not what PvP servers are meant to be.

[Lilija]

I play on a PVP server, so I'm used to getting ganked and ganking others. However, after CRZ zones were introduced, all that's happening is that I and others are getting respawn camped by a bunch of level 90 shitheads.

I don't get how it's related to CRZ. It was exactly the same before on PvP servers :P (that's why I'm so happy I left them)

[Deleted]

I disagree.

Well, obviously.

You are getting exactly what you signed up for, because there are still server types. End of story.

Nope, there are no servers. I never refered to the types.

Discrete servers with a fixed population ended with CRZ. Therefore if you picked a "pvp server" when you started wow you aren't getting what you picked. If you ask fpor a can of coke and are force fed a bottle, you haven't got what you asked for, even if you are still drinking coke.

Now, theres no way you have misunderstood my point 5 times in a row, so an apology is surely in order at this point. Poor debating, bad form.

[Deleted]

Now, theres no way you have misunderstood my point 5 times in a row, so an apology is surely in order at this point. Poor debating, bad form.

demanding an apology on the internet is pretty laughable

[Ashnazg]

Nobody complains that there is PvP.

They complain because bored douchebags decide to camp low level toons because they're incapable of real PvP.

And to be honest, I leveled 3 chars from 1-80 since CRZ was introduced and.. well.. there hasn't been a single time where I thought "Wow, I'm so glad that there is CRZ and there are other people around!", simply because.. it doesn't matter that there are other people around. If I wanted to socialize while leveling, I could do so before CRZ. I won't just suddenly start talking to people just because I see them running around in the same area.

The only things CRZ effectively brought are happier times for gankers and harder times for gatherers.

CRZ revived world pvp in a sense that despite all the gankers, I now see alliance toons of equal or near-equal level while leveling on Illidan. That was unheard of pre-CRZ.

And arguing that ganking isn't real pvp is dumb. Real pvp is hands off, no rules, no restrictions, open world killing spree fest. Arenas, battlegrounds, etc is carebear pvp. Real pvp is an environment and a mindset. Pre-made fotm curbstomps in arena matches are as far from "real pvp" as it gets.

I have nothing against gladiator-style match ups like the arena system, but to call it real pvp is hilariously wrong.

[Deleted]

demanding an apology on the internet is pretty laughable

I didn't demand an apology at all.

[Deleted]

u dont need CRZ for that just real id or battle tag

We do we are not on the same realm.

[Deleted]

Nope, there are no servers. I never refered to the types.

Discrete servers with a fixed population ended with CRZ. Therefore if you picked a "pvp server" when you started wow you aren't getting what you picked. If you ask fpor a can of coke and are force fed a bottle, you haven't got what you asked for, even if you are still drinking coke.

Now, theres no way you have misunderstood my point 5 times in a row, so an apology is surely in order at this point. Poor debating, bad form.

That comparison made no sense at all... So you're sad of the fact that you chose a low populated realm hoping to never run into other people, and now all of a sudden you do? If that's all there is to it I got nothing else to say than you chose the game genre poorly, this is an MMO, not a single player game.

And no, you're in no way shape or form in deserving of an apology.

[Xeraxis]

It's like you're speaking to someone else. -_-

I leveled Kevyne via BGs. He also does PvP when he has time. I have toons on a PvP server. I played in brutal PvP games (from MUDs to F2P Asian grinders). I still believe players who kill others 10 levels below them are cowards. No point calling it even PvP if that is done, it's just carebear PvP by wannabes.

You keep forgetting that PvP is Player versus Player not even leveled Player versus even leveled Player.

[Deleted]

That comparison made no sense at all... So you're sad of the fact that you chose a low populated realm hoping to never run into other people, and now all of a sudden you do? If that's all there is to it I got nothing else to say than you chose the game genre poorly, this is an MMO, not a single player game.

Not sad at all.

Fact is I picked to play on a pvp server, with all that goes with it. (Rivalry, pvp hot spots you can learn where they are and avoid if you want, ability to blacklist assholes etc etc) And now there are no servers, so I am not getting what I chose.

And no, you're in no way shape or form in deserving of an apology.

I didn't say I deserved an apology.

Only that a decent debater would give one.

Reading, not your thing, is it?

[Deleted]

Not sad at all.

Fact is I picked to play on a pvp server, with all that goes with it. (Rivalry, pvp hot spots you can learn where they are and avoid if you want, ability to blacklist assholes etc etc) And now there are no servers, so I am not getting what I chose.

The problem here is that you think you chose something you really didn't... Blizzard are the ones who decides which kind of server is intended for what kind of purpose, the only intended difference between a PvE and a PvP server is that you should be more encouraged to attack opposing faction members on a PvP server, that's pretty much all there is to it. All those things you mentioned were assumptions that might have gone with it back then, but that has changed now. That doesn't mean your choice was removed, because that particular choice never existed.

Things in life change, either you deal with it and adjust to it, or you decide it's not worth your time and move on to something else.

I didn't say I deserved an apology.

Only that a decent debater would give one.

Reading, not your thing, is it?

so an apology is surely in order at this point.

Riiight...

[Kevyne-Shandris]

Someone from a PvE realm cannot zone into a PvP realm unless invited by someone on a PvP realm over real ID, and even then you are just a "guest" on their server and still have to live up to their rules.

What rules?

It's open season, and anything goes. Which is why the problems exist in the first place.

Blizzard doesn't want to discipline as it can bring a class action lawsuit. Meanwhile, they let the mice play and the community has become "Any man for himself", which is detrimental for MMOs, as MMOs are about community. It's like a Facebook without people to reply back without a community (or worse just filled with drivebys).

[Deleted]

The problem here is that you think you chose something you really didn't... Blizzard are the ones who decides which kind of server is intended for what kind of purpose, the only intended difference between a PvE and a PvP server is that you should be more encouraged to attack opposing faction members on a PvP server, that's pretty much all there is to it. All those things you mentioned were assumptions that might have gone with it back then, but that has changed now. That doesn't mean your choice was removed, because that particular choice never existed.

What on earth are you talking about?

I've had the choice to be aon a pvp SERVER for 7 years and 8 months. And then it's been taken away overnight and replaced with a clusterfuck merger.

Things in life change, either you deal with it and adjust to it, or you decide it's not worth your time and move on to something else.

Irrelevent to my point, again.

Riiight...

Right. You can apologise for out of context quoting as well, you know.

[Deleted]

What rules?

It's open season, and anything goes. Which is why the problems exist in the first place.

Blizzard doesn't want to discipline as it can bring a class action lawsuit. Meanwhile, they let the mice play and the community has become "Any man for himself", which is detrimental for MMOs, as MMOs are about community. It's like a Facebook without people to reply back without a community (or worse just filled with drivebys).

I may have worded that poorly but what I meant with rules were the restrictions that come with the server. Even if someone who originally plays on a PvP server is zoned into a PvE server through a real ID invite, the PvE rules/restrictions still apply in the sense of that he/she won't be able to attack anyone else unless they just came out of a battleground or wrote /pvp.

Also I doubt Blizzard would be able to be sued over something like that anyways, in the ToS we all agree that Blizzard can, close your account at any time for any reason what so ever.

---------- Post added 2012-11-18 at 06:56 PM ----------

What on earth are you talking about?

I've had the choice to be aon a pvp SERVER for 7 years and 8 months. And then it's been taken away overnight and replaced with a clusterfuck merger.

It's not been taken out, you're still on a PvP server! The only change is that you get to meet people from other PvP servers as well, and as I said before, this is a good thing.

Irrelevent to my point, again.

It's completely relevant because you don't seem to be able to handle changes in life.

Right. You can apologise for out of context quoting as well, you know.

What I showed with that quote was that you indeed did ask for an apology, how that isn't obvious to you is beyond me.

[thunderdragon2]

We do we are not on the same realm.

my friend isnt on the same realm or same realm type as me and we can do sha together coz we have each others battle tag and it works just fine. so if u and ur friend go to ur battle net page and make a battle tag and then add each others battle tag you 2 can quest to gether when every you want even in pandaria

remember CRZ dosent affect pandaria

[Deleted]

It's not been taken out, you're still on a PvP server! The only change is that you get to meet people from other PvP servers as well, and as I said before, this is a good thing.

No, I am no longer on a discrete pvp server and neither is anyone else. All servers stopped being single serving servers the moment CRZ launched - and no one opted for it. it's just happened all of a sudden.

It's completely relevant because you don't seem to be able to handle changes in life.

No, it irrelevent because you are wittering on without being relevent.

What I showed with that quote was that you indeed did ask for an apology, how that isn't obvious to you is beyond me.

No, saying an apology is in order (or expected) is in no way asking for one. if I say a decent debater would apologise by now, all I am doing is explaining what i expect a decent debater to do. if you want to be a bad debater, don't apologise.

[Deleted]

my friend isnt on the same realm or same realm type as me and we can do sha together coz we have each others battle tag and it works just fine

Yes it use CRZ

[Deleted]

I FUCKING LOVE CRZ.

now that my opinion has been capitalized, the reasoning behind it will follow:

CRZ brings back the adventure feeling when danger awaits in contested territories. My alts are now being ganked upon but with asking for some help in /1 the intense of seeing pvp geared lvl 90's fight for teh dominance is uber. Heck, they are back to attacking Xroads! I missed those times =D

Please blizzard, keep it. And also fix AH on low pop servers. Prices are huge and you can't even make a decent living with professions.

[Deleted]

No, I am no longer on a discrete pvp server and neither is anyone else. All servers stopped being single serving servers the moment CRZ launched - and no one opted for it. it's just happened all of a sudden.

Yes, welcome to World of Warcraft, it's been known to be an ever growing game with new systems added to it over time. It doesn't matter if you asked for it or not, it's an MMO and sometimes Blizzard makes changes you like, sometimes they make changes you don't like. The only thing you can do is either suck it up or leave it. You can also submit your feedback to Blizzard in hope to sway their minds, but I wouldn't count on it. CRZ is here to stay, and grow further.

No, it irrelevent because you are wittering on without being relevent.

I'm just going to ignore this...

No, saying an apology is in order (or expected) is in no way asking for one. if I say a decent debater would apologise by now, all I am doing is explaining what i expect a decent debater to do. if you want to be a bad debater, don't apologise.

It is though... If someone says "an apology would be to be expected" that is asking for an apology, because the person is indirectly asking for one.

[Deleted]

Yes, welcome to World of Warcraft, it's been known to be an ever growing game with new systems added to it over time. It doesn't matter if you asked for it or not, it's an MMO and sometimes Blizzard makes changes you like, sometimes they make changes you don't like. The only thing you can do is either suck it up or leave it. You can also submit your feedback to Blizzard in hope to sway their minds, but I wouldn't count on it. CRZ is here to stay, and grow further.

It certainly does matter if I signed up for it or not if the response to my complaint is "well you signed up for it, tough shit". If i didn't sign up for it (and I didn't, no one did), then i can therefore complain all I like.

Does it make much practical difference? No.

But it does mean everyone who says "you signed up to it" can piss off, because they are wrong.

I'm just going to ignore this...

Well why not, you've been ignoring my points for ages already.

It is though... If someone says "an apology would be to be expected" that is asking for an apology, because the person is indirectly asking for one.

Not at all, providing you the opportunity to apologise isn't asking you to.