Poll: Is this fair and legal?

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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by openair View Post
    You have taken something from... the company who developed the software. You have obtained a product for free that would have otherwise cost you money, rewarding this software company for their time, their intellectual property. The fish bowl analogy of "but bestbuy still has a copy on the shelf" says NOTHING about how it affects the people who were paid for their time to write the software and the company who paid these wages.
    They still have the opportunity to sell that copy.

    Im a stingy bastard and will very rarely spend money on anything period.

    Just because I had the opportunity to take it for free doesn't mean I would have spent money if I didn't have that option.

    Nobody was hurt in that situation.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by openair View Post
    You have taken something from... the company who developed the software. You have obtained a product for free that would have otherwise cost you money, rewarding this software company for their time, their intellectual property. The fish bowl analogy of "but bestbuy still has a copy on the shelf" says NOTHING about how it affects the people who were paid for their time to write the software and the company who paid these wages.
    Meanwhile in the real world:

    <Insert Video game here> has reached a record of sales!
    <Insert movie here> has sold more tickets then any movie before!
    <Insert Shitty artist here> has more 15 year old fans then any before!

    <Insert non-digital entertainment company here> has gone bankrupt

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Gnasnimadan View Post
    Meanwhile in the real world:

    <Insert Video game company name> has reached a record of sales!
    <Insert movie here> has sold more tickets then any movie before!
    <Insert Shitty artist here> has more 15 year old fans then any before!
    Meanwhile in the real world... a portion of the people who continue to follow the laws is irrelevant to some who don't. If everyone stopped following laws and everyone pirated, no more record sales.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by openair View Post
    Meanwhile in the real world... a portion of the people who continue to follow the laws is irrelevant to some who don't. If everyone stopped following laws and everyone pirated, no more record sales.
    you do know that a study done recently said that those who frequently pirate buy two times as much movies and music as the average person. the "hardcore" pirates who refuse to pay for anything are the minority the majority of "pirates" do so because its either there only option or they want to test it first

    actually according to this its 10 times as much http://www.zeropaid.com/news/86009/s...an-they-steal/
    Last edited by Immitis; 2012-11-25 at 09:09 PM.
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Methanar View Post
    Tell me how the internet is a private network.
    The infrastructure that you use to access the internet is owned by the ISP.

  6. #66
    I am Murloc! Cyanotical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Methanar View Post
    Tell me how the internet is a private network.

    And you do not "buy" "internet"

    You rent the abilities to use their cables and DNS servers to rout yourself to other servers which will fulfill requests and send you html/js/css/etc code to render a webpage and then you go from there. In the case of websites at least.
    the internet is owned privately, however, each section is owned by different owners, ISPs provide access to consumers for a monthly fee, they pay fees to get access to backbone connections

    an ISP owns everything from the border of your house (MDF) to the edge of their nework

    lets say you want to send a message to your friend:
    you are on ISP1
    your fiend is on ISP2

    you send the message and it leaves your computer, goes to your router and then goes to your modem, this is the point where your network ends and ISP1's network begins, ISP1 routes the message through their network will it reaches ISP2, they then take possession of the data, and then route it to your friends modem

    as long as the data it on ISP1 or ISP2's network, they can look at it and read it all they want, unless you have local laws against it, there is no right to privacy on someone else's network, essentially, you are on their network, you play by their rules

    the internet is not some magical public place of freedom, it's a mass of small to medium sized privately owned networks all interconnected using a standard set of protocols

  7. #67
    Anyone who pirate alot of new stuff, or even 5ish year old stuff are defiantly not my cup of tea.

    I will never support piracy. For me fightning online piracy is good, makes industries such as PC makers more keen to actually make good stuff.
    Youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/c/djuntas ARPG - RTS - MMO

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Nightelfsb View Post
    Anyone who pirate alot of new stuff, or even 5ish year old stuff are defiantly not my cup of tea.

    I will never support piracy. For me fightning online piracy is good, makes industries such as PC makers more keen to actually make good stuff.
    Translated: I like giving corporations the power to police my activities.

  9. #69
    I am Murloc! Cyanotical's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightelfsb View Post
    Anyone who pirate alot of new stuff, or even 5ish year old stuff are defiantly not my cup of tea.

    I will never support piracy. For me fightning online piracy is good, makes industries such as PC makers more keen to actually make good stuff.
    you will always have a group of people who simply do not want to pay for something, however, the fight over internet piracy has spilled over into ever increasingly absurd areas, DRM that is so bad that it prevents people who legally bought something from using it,

    as well as switching from ownership to licensing,not sure how many people know this, but you do not own anything you buy on itunes

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by sockzz View Post
    Translated: I like giving corporations the power to police my activities.
    You mean the activities that you do using their infrastructure? How dare they!

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    You mean the activities that you do using their infrastructure? How dare they!
    you know i think people would have more sympathy for the big wigs if they didnt sue people for millions of dollars for downloading a 20$ dvd
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  12. #72
    Pirating is such a touchy subject. People always seem to defend it as some kind of way to stick it to the corporations, as if they're entitled to some companies product even if they can't afford it.

    I've pirated material in the past, but I've never felt that I had the right to do so. In the end, I did what I wanted and was fully aware of the consequences. If you don't want to be prosecuted for pirating then you should probably stop downloading material that doesn't belong to you.

    Also, as far as the whole it's "stealing" debate, theoretically it may be, but it literally is copyright infringement. Other than that, you won't be sent to jail, just fined a large amount of money. They've tried to have it changed to "stealing" before, but the change was struck down.

    Moral of the story, this new six-strike rule doesn't hurt those who don't pirate, and threatens those who do. As long as there is a clear distinction between those who pirate and those who aren't within the ISP's line of sight, I'm all for them punishing those who get caught downloading someone else's intellectual property.

  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    you know i think people would have more sympathy for the big wigs if they didnt sue people for millions of dollars for downloading a 20$ dvd
    I'd have more sympathy for people that actually didn't break the law in order to save $20.

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Aerts View Post
    Moral of the story, this new six-strike rule doesn't hurt those who don't pirate, and threatens those who do. As long as there is a clear distinction between those who pirate and those who aren't within the ISP's line of sight, I'm all for them punishing those who get caught downloading someone else's intellectual property.
    not really people who pirate just people who use torrents without blocking their ip.

    the law says nothing about downloading streaming or anything like that only peer to peer stuff aka torrents
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Immitis View Post
    not really people who pirate just people who use torrents without blocking their ip.

    the law says nothing about downloading streaming or anything like that only peer to peer stuff aka torrents
    Depending on how they configure their system to pick those downloading illegal materials versus those who are not is what matters to me.

  16. #76
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    Downloading black ops right now

    say these magic words: F*CK YOU COMPANIES, YOU CAN S*CK MY D*CK, wont give you money never!

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyanotical View Post
    the internet is owned privately, however, each section is owned by different owners, ISPs provide access to consumers for a monthly fee, they pay fees to get access to backbone connections

    an ISP owns everything from the border of your house (MDF) to the edge of their nework

    lets say you want to send a message to your friend:
    you are on ISP1
    your fiend is on ISP2

    you send the message and it leaves your computer, goes to your router and then goes to your modem, this is the point where your network ends and ISP1's network begins, ISP1 routes the message through their network will it reaches ISP2, they then take possession of the data, and then route it to your friends modem

    as long as the data it on ISP1 or ISP2's network, they can look at it and read it all they want, unless you have local laws against it, there is no right to privacy on someone else's network, essentially, you are on their network, you play by their rules

    the internet is not some magical public place of freedom, it's a mass of small to medium sized privately owned networks all interconnected using a standard set of protocols
    Yeah because the ISPs totally have a right to read any medical records that might be emailed to me.

    Or if a business was sending emails containing sensitive technical data to a computer outside of their LAN that becomes free game for any isp to read into.

    They can totally be staring at any celebrity's emails and read all the gossip they could ever want through their channels of communication and publicise it to the world right?

    I mean, the cables belong to the company right, by using that service its like you're just handing the data over to the company!

    ---------- Post added 2012-11-25 at 09:44 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Butler Log View Post
    The infrastructure that you use to access the internet is owned by the ISP.
    That doesn't answer my question at all.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Decagon View Post
    It's different because, following your analogy, you're stealing a strangers DVD and keeping it, it's not like sharing with a friend. If pirating was so beneficial as a demo, then more companies would use a free demo, as most games do not or have highly limited demos, demos obviously don't dramatically increase sales. Why should companies have to be "clever" just because people are awful and will steal their stuff if there is no legislation?
    you aren't stealing anything. You merely copy a file and view it later. Its literally a victimless crime if you could even consider it a crime. Sharing information is the way things are now and big business will have to get used to it. If people can easily pirate software/movies/tv they are going to do it no matter how many you lock up (or at least attempt to lock up). Thereby wasting our taxpayer money to fund the police to bust in some dude's basement "control center" in their mom's house. Do you really want to live in a police state that determines what you can and can't show on the internet? That is what will happen if you let anti-pirating legislation pass. To be honest, its really not worth the cost considering pirating only hurts the very wealthy exploiting "business men" (who are still insanely wealthy) and no so much the artist. If an artist wants to make money they have to do live shows and sell tickets / CD's like they did before affordable recording devices.

    The fact is we live in a different world now and these laws will never be able to keep up with technology. So what if you even manage to shut off every pirating site? People will still share. I saw pictures of hard drives being put into bricks with USB outlets outside so people who knew the locations could easily upload and download through the ports. It's a waste of money trying to fight this because people always have some kind of workaround for anything internet related.
    Last edited by Mischiefpwns; 2012-11-25 at 09:48 PM. Reason: grammatical errors.

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rukentuts View Post
    I'd have more sympathy for people that actually didn't break the law in order to save $20.
    So what you're saying grand larcency is better than petty theft?

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Aerts View Post
    Depending on how they configure their system to pick those downloading illegal materials versus those who are not is what matters to me.
    according to the website for the law if a company sees your ip when they check out torrents they call your isp and after an unspecified amount of complaints you get one strike and then your isp will keep a look on you to see if your doing illegal activities and some will slow/lock down your internet till you take some knd of survey about copyright stuff.

    the majority of people who pirate know how to hide their ip and they said on the site they arent after the ones who pirate often but its more of a preventative thing to try and prevent new people from doing it
    "I was a normal baby for 30 seconds, then ninjas stole my mamma" - Deadpool
    "so what do we do?" "well jack, you stand there and say 'gee rocket raccoon I'm so glad you brought that Unfeasibly large cannon with you..' and i go like this BRAKKA BRAKKA BRAKKA" - Rocket Raccoon

    FC: 3437-3046-3552

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