Do you think SWTOR has increased its revenue going F2P?

[Armourboy]

I figure it will be a short term gain only, with a rather steep decline on the backside. New players won't stick with it, and older players may grow tired of it once they realize they are spending more than they were.

[Kelimbror]

Slightly off-topic, but I found the whole HK experience to be great. The scavenger hunt part made for some interesting collaborations on my server at least. It was neat seeing everyone in the same area looking for something, and people helping each other out. And then a guild on my server kept camping the Jawa in the Outlaw's Den, there maybe 10 of them, so we formed a couple 40 main raids and went in there to completely obliterate them. So much fun.

So just because you think that there is nothing epic about it, that it involved no effort, and was just tedious bull crap, doesn't make it true. At this point it seems like you're just reaching lately to find any reason to complain about this game, while tons of people are online having fun.

Try quoting something that isn't 2 weeks old before you tell me that 'lately' I'm reaching for any reason to complain about the game. You've shown your ignorance of me and the game in two paragraphs. Congrats.

If your idea of fun is running around an empty field clicking a button every 30 seconds, then I feel sorry for you. If they continue to under deliver on content like this going forward, no one will pay for that. If Makeb is designed with the same mentality, we will all be worse off for it.

[Morros]

Try quoting something that isn't 2 weeks old before you tell me that 'lately' I'm reaching for any reason to complain about the game. You've shown your ignorance of me and the game in two paragraphs. Congrats.

If your idea of fun is running around an empty field clicking a button every 30 seconds, then I feel sorry for you. If they continue to under deliver on content like this going forward, no one will pay for that. If Makeb is designed with the same mentality, we will all be worse off for it.

Lately is a broad term with no exact meaning, two weeks time frame is definitely relevant to the term lately.

If the HK questline was JUST running around in an empty field (which wasn't exactly empty since there were 25+ other people there at any given time) then I would agree that my idea of fun would be a little sadistic. However, looking at the questline as a whole? It's well put together, the time spent hunting for the three parts needed was nil, I completed the entire thing in around 3-4 hours, which seems about right for an awesome companion that I'm never actually going to use because he's not a healer.

I am curious though, what keeps you hanging around here? Do you even play the game anymore? Do you do Operations with a guild or friends? HM Flashpoints? Warzones? Even I'll admit the game isn't perfect, but what game is? Have you played World of Dailycraft recently? There aren't many options available as far as MMO's that offer a good Raiding/Operation experience. To me, and this is just my opinion I know you will correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like you are wanting this game to be something that it isn't. What exactly do you want from this game? Space combat? Eve Online is a great game if that's what you're looking for, far more detailed than even SWG was. Are you looking for a lot of mini-games? I'm not sure what mmo-type game if any offers that, maybe WoW.

You may be a resounding voice here on the SWTOR forums, and I don't know how much time you actually spend in-game, or what realm you're on, but everyone I know in game is having fun and loves the game, I don't see anyone in-game complaining about the HK questline being under delivered and people threatening to quit or stop paying.

I'm just curious, because you always seem angry in your posts that this game isn't what you want, I could be interpreting them wrong, that's just the way you tend to come off in your posts.

[Kelimbror]

If the HK questline was JUST running around in an empty field (which wasn't exactly empty since there were 25+ other people there at any given time) then I would agree that my idea of fun would be a little sadistic. However, looking at the questline as a whole? It's well put together, the time spent hunting for the three parts needed was nil, I completed the entire thing in around 3-4 hours, which seems about right for an awesome companion that I'm never actually going to use because he's not a healer.

I raved about the Theoretika being the most amazing thing since sliced bread and that the game needs more things like that. The problem is that they gave you 15 minutes of awesome to slap you in the face with a needle in a haystack hunt not once, not twice, but three times. Sure it's better with people, which is the only cool part about it. Otherwise it's like they just got lazy and said eff this, they'll do anything for this robot.

Additionally, most people who play MMOs would agree that this very brief experience doesn't equal to the 'epic' experience they said it would be. Actually, if you look at the threads when it came out, that is the general consensus.

I am curious though, what keeps you hanging around here? Do you even play the game anymore? Do you do Operations with a guild or friends? HM Flashpoints? Warzones? Even I'll admit the game isn't perfect, but what game is? Have you played World of Dailycraft recently? There aren't many options available as far as MMO's that offer a good Raiding/Operation experience. To me, and this is just my opinion I know you will correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like you are wanting this game to be something that it isn't. What exactly do you want from this game? Space combat? Eve Online is a great game if that's what you're looking for, far more detailed than even SWG was. Are you looking for a lot of mini-games? I'm not sure what mmo-type game if any offers that, maybe WoW.

People on here that want more out of this game want it to live up to its potential and be a real competitor to the other products out there. Yes, I play World of Dailycraft. In fact, all the complaints about it have been addressed in addition to giving numerous other activities to do. I've never had more to do in an MMO ever. Star Wars already had systems to be ahead of the curve with that, but they didn't. Instead they spent their millions giving us the best leveling experience and then nothing much else. If you are satisfied with the game being below average, I wouldn't get used to playing it for very long.

You may be a resounding voice here on the SWTOR forums, and I don't know how much time you actually spend in-game, or what realm you're on, but everyone I know in game is having fun and loves the game, I don't see anyone in-game complaining about the HK questline being under delivered and people threatening to quit or stop paying.

People in game don't even use forums. They don't read things from the developers and they generally don't have a lot of experience with multiple games in general. Most of the SWTOR population from anecdotal and actual evidence suggest that this is their first MMO. All the people that abandoned the game? Those were MMO vets who realized they weren't getting their money's worth. If they are marketing to people with little to no experience, this game won't last.

[SirRobin]

Do you think SWTOR has increased its revenue going F2P?

No idea. It entirely depends on how many keep their subscriptions and how many spend money in the cash shop. Maybe the most accurate answer would be that its at least hopefully stopped TOR's revenue plummet?

[Daerio]

Increase, if any subscribers are like me then they have probably spent more on the cartel store than they do subscribing.

Those packs with random things in are going to be a gold mine and as they add more content and armour I can see people spending more and more. God knows I would love a Jedi set that has the robes over something like the trooper armour, or a sith set that looks like darth baras.

Hell I'd pay $10 for my sorc to shout "unlimited power" every time he uses force lightning.

As long as you realize you're in a very small minority - people who would pay extra money for each nugget of garbage they throw out there.

That isn't sustainable, and most people wouldn't do it. WoW kinda has that mentality with some people too - people who will pay 5-10$ for every new mount/pet they release, but those people are the minority as well. SWTOR is just drawing from a much smaller pool of those same people - to stay 'afloat.'

It's a fact that their model is going to make it much, much harder to pull in new people. It's going to hurt them long-term.

[RoninaThorstone]

Since this is one of the few threads I have not participated in and the boards have gone awkwardly quite as of late...

In the short term there will be a large increase in revenue. However, this is "increase" is relative given the steady decline in subscribers. I believe it could be best described as "staunching" given the rather precipitous decline in the past ten months. Like many MMOs that have gone f2p, there will be a group of devout followers that will continue to subscribe regardless of changes, WAR and SWG comes to mind.

Now, I should mention that I have always been hopeful for a f2p transition of swtor since I believe the subscription model to be annoying at best. As some of you are probably aware, I have added rift to my portfolio of games but even they offer a way around the subscription free, RAF free months. Once the initial wave of revenue is depleted Swtor will be in direct competition with other f2p mmos like AoC, Lotro, Dcuo, Firefall, Vindictus, Allods, Aion, EQ 1 and 2, and so many more I can't even imagine listing them all here. Although, its worth noting that Eve, Rift, and Tera all offer an either social or in game method of paying a subscription.

Swtor has the benefit of having a superior leveling experience and, arguably, some of the more interesting pvp maps in the genre. The basic content is there. What I would argue is that the continued success of Swtor is contingent on its actions over the coming weeks and months. I can not stress enough the importance of reinvesting the increased revenue into peripheral content. Particularly content that increases player involvement and is repeatable in a viable way. By this I mean, content that promotes team play, socialization, and does not feel like you are grinding the same scripted event time and time again.

You can only do so many black hole dailies before you want to uninstall the game. However, as we have seen in WoW, people are willing to run the same battlegrounds for six or more years. This is because pvp content is inherently dynamic because it is generated by the players. Now, many players do not enjoy direct conflict, and this is understandable given the "type" of person mmo pvp has attracted. I am not implying that new content be PVP but rather should be deeply entrenched around player interaction.

This could range from anything like trade skills requiring components from multiple trade skills (IE: crafting a belt that has a passive chance to heal you when you drop below 25% health could require an armortech to craft it but require a healing injection from a biochem and a grade 6 crystal from an artificer or something).

Another idea would be to make constant PVE events that focused on the conflict the game revolves around. This would be something like gather parts and building war mechs and deploying them against enemy bases (like gathering alterac rams for the Calvary) or taking objective points guarded by enemy NPCs that grants some tactical advantage (like saving the griffin riders who proceed to drop bombs on the enemy lines) or remapping much of the planets so there are many "neutral" or "capturable" out posts that offer daily quests or access to wares or flash points.

You would have the option to essentially rally troops to fight for you through repeatable quests or go in there with a couple of friends or a mix of both. Swtor has to do a lot to its level 50 game to make itself more competitive in a market that is trended more and more toward this player action driven content.

edited for the sake of kittys eyes.

[Kelimbror]

*snip*

Thank you sir. Still like the idea.

We all know how much potential is there. Too bad I didn't win the Powerball to somehow influence the creative direction of the game. Probably would not be a good investment anyways. Just a labor of love I guess. Though with that much I could create my own game, that would be cool.

[FusedMass]

I know it has. I heard people talk about buying the 5500 Cartel Coin pack which equals out to 40 dollars. A game cost 15 dollars a month. I'd say they very very easily have increased their product. It reminds me of Mass Effect Online where you buy a random mystery package and get "random items" It's easier to use the shop then to grind credits on dailys for weeks for legacy perks.

While it concerns me a bit people able to buy gear and selling the same items they bought on the market. I suppose it's good for business. I am a bit concerned that nearly ALL content even for subs you will have to buy. Let me give an example. There is TONS of new content on Cartel Market. Most of it is free for subs but some like the armor is not, little perks like that and they're "newly added" section leaves me to believe they will start selling items there.

Why make content for everyone when you can get paid for armor every few months.

[RoninaThorstone]

Why make content for everyone when you can get paid for armor every few months.

because without content there won't be anyone around to buy armor.

[quras]

Short term increase with a leveling out eventually out.


What I think will have to happen is the store will need to be greatly expanded with numerous customizations in multiple areas to keep revenue up outside of monthly fees.

[Edge-]

because without content there won't be anyone around to buy armor.

This so hard. One of the arguments I hear quite often against F2P games/games that transition is that they'll only focus on the cash shop and not create any actual content.

It's bunk. It really is. If you don't create any other content in the game, people will get bored and leave. You need a hook to keep people playing, because when they're gone, it's very hard to bring them back in. So without those players, those awesome new purple hats and adorable pets that they just put in the cash shop reach a much smaller audience.

Yes, there will always be new cash shop items and there will definitely be some of the team devoted to that. But the devs have to find a balance between developing content and developing for the cash shop that will maximize revenue without driving players away. Heck, one of the reasons players left SWTOR to begin with was because the rate at which content was being released was too slow, so I fail to see how a similar strategy (slow content releases in favor of cash shop items) would be in any way logical >.>

[Airlick]

Obviously there will be more players for a short while - some people will want to try the game out. Then they will find out that it's the biggest fail in the history of MMO genre and will simply quit.

Infracted

[Kelimbror]

Yes, there will always be new cash shop items and there will definitely be some of the team devoted to that. But the devs have to find a balance between developing content and developing for the cash shop that will maximize revenue without driving players away. Heck, one of the reasons players left SWTOR to begin with was because the rate at which content was being released was too slow, so I fail to see how a similar strategy (slow content releases in favor of cash shop items) would be in any way logical >.>

No one said logic had anything to do with this. This is EA we are talking about. Money Now> Logic Later.

[Deleted]

Obviously there will be more players for a short while - some people will want to try the game out. Then they will find out that it's the biggest fail in the history of MMO genre and will simply quit.

Thank you for your irrelevant opinion

[Airlick]

Thank you for your irrelevant opinion

You're delusional if you think otherwise, sir.

[Edge-]

No one said logic had anything to do with this. This is EA we are talking about. Money Now> Logic Later.

It is EA, but I would hope they have enough sense to realize this. I was more commenting on the notion as a whole, as I see it used as an argument against F2P all too often. There are some games that take that strategy, but more often than not you see pretty high rates of players leaving and occasionally game closures.

[RoninaThorstone]

Obviously there will be more players for a short while - some people will want to try the game out. Then they will find out that it's the biggest fail in the history of MMO genre and will simply quit.

Hear that everyone.
Turbodymoman has spoken.
And we all know how important he is.

[namelessone]

With reduced XP gains, I really don't see anyone playing long-term without subscribing. I think people who wanted to play free and dip into cartel market would skip this game in the long run.

[Highdark]

Whether or not i like the f2p system it has most definately increased revenue. Even when f2p falls off the option of buying what you want will still give increased revenue