5.2 Class hopes.

[Verain]

I love shadow blades, don't touch that. It's perfect now that it has purple fists. I really like something that works with the autoattacks- it puts them much more within your control. Shadow Blades is great.

We need some goddamned mobility, and some survival wouldn't hurt.

[AceofHarts]

I love shadow blades, don't touch that. It's perfect now that it has purple fists. I really like something that works with the autoattacks- it puts them much more within your control. Shadow Blades is great.

We need some goddamned mobility, and some survival wouldn't hurt.

Shadow Blades is fine for Combat due to synergy.
for Assassination and Subtlety it needs the Ascendance treatment.

[Deleted]

Warlock for 3-4 years speaking now: Affliction and destro should be able to teleport twice like a warriors charge (such as demonology, maybe make glyph of teleport apply a second charge on teleport). Fix glyphs so all are competitive like most talent choices. Increase base haste or lower the cast time on: Incinerate, chaos bolt and fear with 0.2 seconds. The low haste makes casting a nightmare in 3's. I experienced a hastecap of 15% is enjoyable tough to much damage is sacrificed for this if you want to stay competitive.

Buff affliction's scaling with spellpower its pathetic right now.
Fix Backdraft bug consuming conflagrate and fellflames occasionaly
Fix soul shard consumption. Back to cata this time.

Buff soul fire really... its pathetic.

And one general change: Geardifference makes the game unplayable for alts, also the low gaining of the cp resource is a big cause of this.

Ty.

[Squirl]

... Who let the Warlock in here?

[Koji2k11]

i was just about to ask this too

[Verain]

Are warlocks repped low enough to require a second (third?) teleport?

A big problem is that people think that they need to be able to escape a warrior. In general, a warrior is supposed to be able to charge anything you do to make a gap, and if you want him to not do that, you need a root. Warriors and ferals are the MOST mobile melee- if you can escape a warrior or cat, then you have way too much stuff to escape rogues/rets/enhance/DK. Far too much.

We need mobility.

Does shadow blades need synergy with Assassination and Sub? Well, maybe. It seems pretty great for sub.

[AceofHarts]

Are warlocks repped low enough to require a second (third?) teleport?

A big problem is that people think that they need to be able to escape a warrior. In general, a warrior is supposed to be able to charge anything you do to make a gap, and if you want him to not do that, you need a root. Warriors and ferals are the MOST mobile melee- if you can escape a warrior or cat, then you have way too much stuff to escape rogues/rets/enhance/DK. Far too much.

We need mobility.

Does shadow blades need synergy with Assassination and Sub? Well, maybe. It seems pretty great for sub.

its synergy with assassination is incredibly low due to its low CP generation rate.

[Deleted]

now that vanish is on a 2 minute timer I can almost live with having to take shadowstep as a talent. What I'd really like to see is any or all of the following made baseline:

- Anticipation
- Shuriken Toss
- Dirty Tricks

Gouge is too expensive for an ability that breaks from your own dots when not talented and shares a DR with sap. Pre MoP I used it quite often to get a few seconds of breathing room or as an additional interrupt. Now it's pretty much a waste of energy since it breaks immediately and both of the talents in the tree are just too strong to take dirty tricks over them. Additionally, glyph of blind is still mandatory when fighting next to pretty much any other class, and it negates half the benefit of the talent.

Anticipation and shuriken toss are more quality of life issues. I'd just like not to lose combo points during dance while still maintaining some sort of ranged capability. If that's too strong they could reduce the max stacks of anticipation to 2 or 3 to prevent back-to-back eviscerates

[orderofmaken]

Well... GC just tweeted this so.

@EvilAipac: “I love how Druids can vanish and ShStep BETTER than rogues and about 6x more often... kudos man. you are a master of balance.”
@Ghostcrawler: “One ability compared to another ability doesn't scale to one class' comparison to another. It's about the whole package.”
@Ghostcrawler: “I wasn't commenting on RvD, but on comparing one ability in a vacuum to another. R talents in 5.2 prob have the most changes.”

Maybe some light that rogue talents are getting some changes, but whether or not they are meaningful and actual effort put into them is another question. I do love how he is fine with druids having an even more powerful ShS/Vanish on a massively low cd though.

[Verain]

its synergy with assassination is incredibly low due to its low CP generation rate.

But it's 20% better during half of the vendettas!


I don't think it needs to add the same to all specs to be a good move. I also think it's quite powerful if used sub 35%, as it's double the CP generation for a spec that makes very good use of CPs.


The GC post is only true on the face of it. The real issues is that all three rogue specs are equally helpless, while ferals zip around like they are lag-hacking.

[Deleted]

Well... GC just tweeted this so.

@EvilAipac: “I love how Druids can vanish and ShStep BETTER than rogues and about 6x more often... kudos man. you are a master of balance.”
@Ghostcrawler: “One ability compared to another ability doesn't scale to one class' comparison to another. It's about the whole package.”
@Ghostcrawler: “I wasn't commenting on RvD, but on comparing one ability in a vacuum to another. R talents in 5.2 prob have the most changes.”

Maybe some light that rogue talents are getting some changes, but whether or not they are meaningful and actual effort put into them is another question. I do love how he is fine with druids having an even more powerful ShS/Vanish on a massively low cd though.

That's really good news.

Also I don't have a problem with the ferals "vanishing" all the time, cause it doesn't really benefit them. They have to move around much and gain their weak openers.
I have a problem that stealth doesn't benefit us enough. I want openers I always want to use. As a night elf I don't even think about shadowmeld in assa or combat spec in PvE, because the openers don't gain me any benefit, its quite ridiculous. :/

[Verain]

Most Changes != Buffs


I bet we see:

Nerve Strike Nerfed
Shadow Focus Nerfed

We might see:

Removal of Prep (this is possibly a gamequit for me, no lie)
Removal of Deadly Throw (this would make me sad, but it wouldn't be The End Of Times)
Removal of Shuriken Throw / it becomes baseline and is horribly nerfed
DPS abilities becoming a tier, removing actual choice

[Wow]

Most Changes != Buffs


I bet we see:

Nerve Strike Nerfed
Shadow Focus Nerfed

Shadow focus I could see maybe but why would nerve strike get nerfed?


Clearly something will happen with Versatility since no one takes it for anything.

What do people think they will do to "fix" Versatility? The said theme of the tier is "breaking the rules" so it doesn't have to be anything to do with what it was.

[Imbashiethz]

Shadow Blades is good but incrediby boring. Look at alter time. Now thats a fun ability.

[Deleted]

Shadow Blades is good but incrediby boring. Look at alter time. Now thats a fun ability.

To be honest... alter time is unique among all classes. No class got a similar interesting ability, so its not really justified to ask for something of that magnitude at this point of WoW.

[D3athsting]

And what about killme spree? U have to pray every time you use that to not get into the fire, fall into elegon's pit or finish under garalon's ass...

[Verain]

Pray, or, you know, run the killing spree glyph that prevents that from happening. Garalon's ass you can prevent with careful positioning, but I'll point out that (1) it's probably legit not worth using on Garalon, given the risks and (2) I think it's fair to say that Garalon is a friendly fight for combat rogues, right?

[Amuramie]

I love shadow blades, don't touch that. It's perfect now that it has purple fists. I really like something that works with the autoattacks- it puts them much more within your control. Shadow Blades is great.

Auto attacking is the definition of not in your control. Shadow Blade doesn't give you control over your auto attacks. It does nothing but provide a boost to damage that is already far too passive in nature.

[mtvoelker]

I theorize that tier 4 rogue talents will be reworked, with ShS and prep made baseline and the tier 4 talents revolving around improved aspects of ShS. In essence, it will be very similar to tier 1 hunter talents and tier 1 warrior talents. I expect that one talent would reduce ShS's cooldown, one would double the range but either halve or negate the movement speed buff afterwards, and one would maintain the current cd but remove stuns/snares (however not fears/blinds/MC, etc). The latter would be similar to burst of speed, but would likely be tied into ShS and not a separate CD.

I could see Shuriken Toss being made baseline also, however they may scale back the damage to discourage players from building too many CP's from range. In it's place I would like to see another CP generating cooldown or ability (though I know some may not wish another button to press). Currently we have Anticipation which allows us to generate up to 10 CP's on a single target, and Versatility which removes the cooldown on redirect. It might also be interesting to have an ability which, when used, generates a combo point to every target within range, every 2 seconds for 10 seconds. Give it a 2-3 minute cooldown, and any combo points not used within 10-20 seconds then disappear. Balance issues may be possible, but I'd like to hear from more sagacious minds as to the ramifications.

Finally, regarding Shadow Blades, I agree graphically it is left wanting, and while it is nice having a CP booster and autoattack dmg increase, it could still use a bit of utility tied to it. I offer the idea that each strike of auto attack would leave a debuff, stacking to 20, that would decrease the effectiveness of an opponents spells and abilities by 1% per stack, and buffing the rogue damage and healing by 1% for each stack gained. This effect would last for 10-20 seconds (once again please speak up as to the ramifications). Think of the Sleight of Hand buff from Heroic Kings, but would stack more gradually. This effect would likely need to be dispellable, however I believe only the stacks from the target would be removed. The buff to the rogue would last for its full duration. Additional graphical effects would be purple essence "leeched" from the target into the rogue itself, and a slight size or aura effect given to the rogue would add a nice touch. For pve purposes, the debuff would not work on raid bosses, but trash/heroic boses would be vulnerable and the temporary dmg buff to the rogue would be given against all targets (including raid bosses, even though they are immune to the damage debuff).

I openly ask for constructive criticism and thoughts. By no means am I versed enough in WoW to think my ideas are infallible.

[Feindy]

change blade flurry back to wotlk model, i just loved it as a cooldown