PvP "Blog" is here.

[Pendulous]

-snip-

I'll say this one last, final time.

I am not defending Diablo 3. The game is a pile of shit. The gearing and drops are bad, and while I don't care about it, promised PvP never happened.

But you can't have it both ways. You can't complain that a game is unfinished, then complain that they're not allowed to add anything. That's ridiculous.

And what exactly defines a "completed" game? Diablo 2 had an expansion. It had content patches after that. It was being balanced up until, what, 2011?

[Leonard McCoy]

I'll say this one last, final time.

I am not defending Diablo 3. The game is a pile of shit. The gearing and drops are bad, and while I don't care about it, promised PvP never happened.

But you can't have it both ways. You can't complain that a game is unfinished, then complain that they're not allowed to add anything. That's ridiculous.

And what exactly defines a "completed" game? Diablo 2 had an expansion. It had content patches after that. It was being balanced up until, what, 2011?

I didn't say they weren't allowed to add anything, but what they should be adding shouldn't have come from 10 years ago. Or come from lessons learned 10 years ago. LoD didn't add stuff from lessons they learned in Diablo 1. At some point they have to innovate and add something new don't they? They learned from Diablo 1 what worked and what didn't work and made changes. They ignored what worked in d2:lod, did their own thing and then all of a sudden realized HEY MAN THAT WAS GOOD WHEN WE DID THAT THING WE DID (d2:lod thing). Why do we give them a blatant pass on this? If any other developer were this backwards we'd be all over them. Imagine if windows 8 came out and it was totally like vista all over again and people hated and like some MS dude on a forum somewhere was like HEY MAN GIVE IT TIME SERVICE PACKS...

I want them to add things. In fact alot of the problem from D3 I think is that it really lacks innovation. It doesn't change enough fundamentally. It isn't "retro" in the sense that it adheres to what made D2:LoD great but by the same token it doesn't forge enough new ground for me to say oh that system is neat I like that that's innovative thats interesting it needs some work but the core of it is good. I mean I wish I could say that. I mean what are they gonna add in the expansion? Exactly what we know they will add. Pvp is one thing but some kind of method to make items interesting all over again ala rune words. Maybe not specifically rune words but instead of something new and fresh we get a solution to a problem they solved 10 years ago. Look at all they've added so far. All stuff from the previous game. At some point don't they HAVE to innovate? Their building games on 10 year old models that they try and dress up here and there but only really undermine what "worked" in those models and without anything fresh or new make up for it just feels wrong. It's not retro, they pissed in the recipe a bit to much and it's sour but by the same token it isn't avaunt garde or innovative. It's just stale bread that you only half remember the recipe for. I've bought the last 3 titles from the company they've released and the one I've enjoyed the most I guess is starcraft 2. It's stayed closest to the formula but even then it isn't terrible innovative and I haven't enjoyed it anywhere near as much as I did sc and bw. For the same reason as Diablo 3 I think. They forgot what made sc:bw awesome fun but didn't give me something new and exciting to replace what they forgot. At some point doesn't Blizzard have to do something NEW?

[Pendulous]

By the way, the people who worked on Diablo 2 no longer work for Blizzard. They moved over to work on Torchlight 2, which brags about having over 1000 affixes on gear. Which means you have a less than zero percent chance of getting a desired item. Sound familiar?

[Leonard McCoy]

By the way, the people who worked on Diablo 2 no longer work for Blizzard. They moved over to work on Torchlight 2, which brags about having over 1000 affixes on gear. Which means you have a less than zero percent chance of getting a desired item. Sound familiar?

Actually that's not entirely true as was pointed out in the apology blog from Jay Wilson and even if it were so what? Did they take all the notes and research with them? Knowledge like that doesn't solely rest in the brains of the developers. I'm sure someone took a note down somewhere. As much as I don't like D3, I'm positive at some point they did some homework.

As for tl2 getting a "desired" item happens all the time because theirs more that's desirable even with the thousands of affixes. Even more so in PoE which has even more diversity. I've gotten plenty of good items and more to the point character progression is not SOLELY done by gear. Getting rid of stat points took that other form of progression out.

[chadwix]

lol'd, rubberbanding in D3 is great with a 100/20 line

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...28NKRO%29-list

Sounds like bad player, bad keyboard to me

[Redblade]

Nope there is no decent working copy.

Don't be ridiculous, the one or 2 floating copies around simply don't function and can be found on any torrent site.

Yet they work and are a cracked version of D3, how well they work is another matter.

I now remember why I stopped arguing with you as well, sticking you head in the sand spouting random (factually incorrect) lines of Blizzard praise isn't discussing nor arguing.

[chadwix]

I havent tried personally but they sometimes work. Not exactly the experience you want in a single player game where you want solo time to afk. Bnet on a shakey connection is more stable than this.

Plus you cant show you stuff off to friends even if you found it yourself. Blizzard games are about the social aspects, i can play free wow on a private server but it isnt the same without my friends on the real version.

[PizzaSHARK]

Question is how well this complexity translates to interesting spectator experience. There is no point to judging eSports based on skill caps and complexity alone ... you need audience for a game to be successful eSport. We will see how well Dota 2 does in that regard once the game is released.

I agree, and that's why I can't hand the crown to SC2. While I feel it's the best game of the three technically and mechanically, the "scene" is stagnating and doesn't seem to be growing much, possibly due to Blizzard not putting any effort into helping it grow. Stagnation means a life of obscurity or death. I personally feel twitch shooters like Quakeworld, Nexuiz, and Warsow are the best games in a mechanical and technical sense for eSports, but they don't grow fast enough or stay popular enough to really receive the nod for "best eSport."

Right now, I'm handing that title to League of Legends, but I'm also completely certain that League of Legends will get laughed out of everywhere except maybe MLG (the refuge of "pro" console gamers) once Dota 2 sees official release.

By the way, the people who worked on Diablo 2 no longer work for Blizzard. They moved over to work on Torchlight 2, which brags about having over 1000 affixes on gear. Which means you have a less than zero percent chance of getting a desired item. Sound familiar?

Is that a bad thing, though? Part of the allure of Diablo back in the day was trying get that perfect Full Plate Mail of the Whale or Ages or whatever the hell the desired affixes were. It was so incredibly rare that it was really satisfying to get something like that. Knowing that most stuff you'd get would be crap made getting stuff you really could use and wanted all the sweeter.

I dunno. Maybe people can reverse-engineer Diablo 3 enough to allow modding and private servers, and then the game would actually be worth playing.

[Deleted]

This is pathetic.

There's really no other way of putting it. The entire Diablo III lead design team needs to be sacked asap.

Blizzard is a classic example of a company that has grown too fat and too comfortable due to their financial security. Even Gamers gave them lots of credit.

Basically Blizzard could do no wrong. Until Diablo III.

A game that suffered from over-iteration and a lack of understanding by the lead-designers about what made the game so addicting in the first place.


And now the whole thing is continuing even after release.

Just pathetic, really.

[abijax]

Is that a bad thing, though? Part of the allure of Diablo back in the day was trying get that perfect Full Plate Mail of the Whale or Ages or whatever the hell the desired affixes were. It was so incredibly rare that it was really satisfying to get something like that. Knowing that most stuff you'd get would be crap made getting stuff you really could use and wanted all the sweeter.

So D3 is bestest game ever? At least get some coherence in your QQ...

[Lolsteak]

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...28NKRO%29-list

Sounds like bad player, bad keyboard to me

Ghosting is the least of someones worries with this poor game, it's not like you even need to use the keyboard anyway.

[PizzaSHARK]

So D3 is bestest game ever? At least get some coherence in your QQ...

Man, this is why I'm glad I stopped playing Blizzard games. It seems like nothing but shit people are drawn to them anymore. Oh well, one more person to toss into the ignore pile.

[Howard Moon]

<snip>

And yet, D2 was a thousend times more fun than D3.

[PizzaSHARK]

There's really no other way of putting it. The entire Diablo III lead design team needs to be sacked asap.

Blizzard is a classic example of a company that has grown too fat and too comfortable due to their financial security. Even Gamers gave them lots of credit.

Basically Blizzard could do no wrong. Until Diablo III.

A game that suffered from over-iteration and a lack of understanding by the lead-designers about what made the game so addicting in the first place.


And now the whole thing is continuing even after release.

Just pathetic, really.

Honestly, I began to lose faith with Cataclysm and the SC2 beta. It really felt like Blizzard wasn't really interested in making good games anymore, but instead doing what they wanted to do, and doing what would generate the most revenue. MoP seems to be continuing this trend, HotS is definitely continuing it, and Diablo III... man, the hurt is still fresh.

[Enkidulgaa]

Honestly, I began to lose faith with Cataclysm and the SC2 beta. It really felt like Blizzard wasn't really interested in making good games anymore, but instead doing what they wanted to do, and doing what would generate the most revenue. MoP seems to be continuing this trend, HotS is definitely continuing it, and Diablo III... man, the hurt is still fresh.

This was completely obvious to me a few months after the Activision merger. I still remember how, on this very forum, people were assuring each other that nothing would happen, Blizzard are still in charge etc.
Everybody with half a brain knew that Blizzard games would change, if not the merger would have been completely pointless. Blizzard obviously took economics classes from Kotick and now they started shoveling the same overmarketed, over hyped garbage onto the market as Activision. The games are made to appeal to the largest demographic possible, even if that means sacrificing gameplay. Why did they get Wilson on board instead of someone who has experience with RPGs?
Because it doesnt matter, they didnt want to make a great ARPG, they wanted to make a game that would sell X number of units and would continue to generate revenue through the RMAH. Wilson certainly doesnt know how to make good games, but he can make games that sell well.

[PizzaSHARK]

This was completely obvious to me a few months after the Activision merger. I still remember how, on this very forum, people were assuring each other that nothing would happen, Blizzard are still in charge etc.
Everybody with half a brain knew that Blizzard games would change, if not the merger would have been completely pointless. Blizzard obviously took economics classes from Kotick and now they started shoveling the same overmarketed, over hyped garbage onto the market as Activision. The games are made to appeal to the largest demographic possible, even if that means sacrificing gameplay. Why did they get Wilson on board instead of someone who has experience with RPGs?
Because it doesnt matter, they didnt want to make a great ARPG, they wanted to make a game that would sell X number of units and would continue to generate revenue through the RMAH. Wilson certainly doesnt know how to make good games, but he can make games that sell well.

Pretty much the story with Kotick. The man is frankly a genius at running a business. I can't fault him for it and what he does, he does amazingly well.

But at least in my opinion, a game developer should be putting making a good game in front of making a good profit, so I don't think he's a good fit for head of a game developer/publisher.

But then again, I'm not an investor of Activision-Blizzard

[RoninaThorstone]

By the way, the people who worked on Diablo 2 no longer work for Blizzard. They moved over to work on Torchlight 2, which brags about having over 1000 affixes on gear. Which means you have a less than zero percent chance of getting a desired item. Sound familiar?

Mmm. 1000 affixes.

Glad I got it on steam sale a few days ago.

[Tzalix]

If only it was just ONE MISSING FEATURE. You ignore everything else, what purpose is their in having a discussion with you if your just gonna plug your ears and scream IT DOESN'T MATTER I LIKE IT and ignore all the evidence. I'd love to know another non mmo game that promised me something for months on end only to tell me HEY MAN GUESS WHAT... NOT SO MUCH.... A rarity I'm sure. I want to be clear though Diablo 3 being unfinished IS NOT A FUCKING OPINION IT'S A FACT. One that doesn't bother you and in your opinion is non existent. Hey man that's cool, people deny global warming and evolution all the time. Maybe you should join them at one of their camps this summer?

I thought we were talking about PvP and nothing else? That is one missing feature... I dunno how you count.

They haven't signed off on PvP, it's just been delayed.

Diablo 3 being unfinished is an opinion. Capsing that it's a fact does not make it so.

You're just being rude when you compare me to people who deny global warming and evolution. Can we not have an adult discussion?

[Leonard McCoy]

I thought we were talking about PvP and nothing else? That is one missing feature... I dunno how you count.

They haven't signed off on PvP, it's just been delayed.

Diablo 3 being unfinished is an opinion. Capsing that it's a fact does not make it so.

You're just being rude when you compare me to people who deny global warming and evolution. Can we not have an adult discussion?

It's a fact but just like global warming and evolution you can call it an opinion if it makes you feel better. It's impossible to have an adult conversation because you refuse to acknowledge facts and would rather plug your ears in ignorance. So no we can't have an adult conversation. Until you acknowledge D3 was and is unfinished.

[Kelimbror]

It's a fact but just like global warming and evolution you can call it an opinion if it makes you feel better. It's impossible to have an adult conversation because you refuse to acknowledge facts and would rather plug your ears in ignorance. So no we can't have an adult conversation. Until you acknowledge D3 was and is unfinished.

Biggest semantical argument if I've ever seen one. We could say every game is unfinished, it doesn't make your particular point in this instance any more or less correct. Nothing is ever finished. Our cars have to be taken to the shop to have things replaced, repaired, and upgraded...are we driving unfinished vehicles?

Semantics, semantics, semantics.