Yep, another gripe about the LFR looting system.

[FenrisUy]

Cata LFR had a far bigger chance for loot. When you needed something you just rolled on anything you could, then when your item drops you then traded one of your won items for it.
Full tier set took only 2-4 weeks that way.

And this is way we got this new system. Because people abused the old system.

[Mad_Murdock]

I have some serious problems with the LFR system as it is.

Sounds completely different to normal raiding if you ask me.

I hear ya man. The problem my guild is having is that every boss drops exactly the items we need on the first kill. After a month we no longer have a need to raid, because everyone is already BIS.

We actually run 5 different alt groups because after a month of normal raiding everyone is in BIS for that toon. I couldn't imagine a world were I had to raid more than a month to be BiS. Maybe that's Blizzard motivation to get people to go from LFR to Normals,, Because normals\heroics only drop the gear you want.

Like you, I've never seen Holy Pally gear drop in our raids, since we have no H-pallys. Only down side to normal mode raiding, is we never have any shards\or blood spirits because we never DE anything. Everything gets used 100% of the time.

Normal\Heroic loot drops are just sooo much better than LFR.

[Ikkarus]

I don't understand, most of people that keep bitching about LFR loot system are players that won't be doing normal modes anyway, so why they want better gear?

[Shaley]

I didn't know Sha dropped Chest/Shoulders/Helm. Oh he doesn't?

Let's pretend he did. For a level 87 to have "his 4 piece waiting for him" at 90, A player will need to spend 4 weeks between 87 and 90, winning a different, specific piece of loot every week. No PvP gear, no repeats.

Yup. Seems reasonable.

[TrollFu]

Ikkarus that's an ignorant statement man. I can't stand reading about people complaining that their 2-3 hours doesn't yield them bountiful loot. I posted a few posts up about how my N/HM raiding a lot of times doesn't yield the loot I need. It's exactly the same.

But the whole "Why do you want better gear if you're not raiding normals" argument is complete BS. People want better gear because thats why we play this game. For shiny cool things dude. Do I -need- that Quel'serrar transmog sword? Of course not, but do I want it because it looks cool and I feel like a badass? Yes.

[thunderdragon2]

So...how do you measure performance when this guy in a ilv of 486 with his supposed gear from normals is in the same raid with a ilv 465 newbie? /shrug...I am sure you gonna tell me that it is easy to write tools for that. Probably with a pop-up that goes: "Sorry no loot, your performance sucked"? And "Awesome performance, but this week RNG hates you and no loot?"

Come on guys...seriously?

i only said that could be his reason for doing lfr

[Azrile]

Not sure how that works when Sha only drops gloves and legs.

ppssst.. don´t let facts get in the way of his crying.

But I will say this, my pally did indeed have the 2 set pieces and the sha-quest item waiting for him when he hit 90.

[Kagonos]

Ikkarus that's an ignorant statement man. I can't stand reading about people complaining that their 2-3 hours doesn't yield them bountiful loot. I posted a few posts up about how my N/HM raiding a lot of times doesn't yield the loot I need. It's exactly the same.

But the whole "Why do you want better gear if you're not raiding normals" argument is complete BS. People want better gear because thats why we play this game. For shiny cool things dude. Do I -need- that Quel'serrar transmog sword? Of course not, but do I want it because it looks cool and I feel like a badass? Yes.

That's not the point, though. First of all, Ikkarus, like the guy he quoted, is being sarcastic. Second of all the reason we are getting tired (at least this is true for me and I get the sense that it's what many feel as well) of these types of threads complaining about not getting loot is nothing like you getting Quel'serrar. There's too much complaining about bad luck when the entire concept of loot drops is luck. Luck is either good or bad, but either way, it's random. The drops in normal and heroic mode raiding are random, the chance that you will get loot in LFR is random, the chance that you will or will not ever get a Glaive off Illidan or a binding for your Thunderfury, or the bow off Kil'Jaeden are all random.

Look, the old system was random, you just had certain ways off improving your chances by reducing the chances of others, which is not a more fair system. If you take 5 or 10 people into an LFR with you and having every single one for them roll on the item you want, there's still a chance that the 1 person who rolls on it that is not you or your friends could win it and you walk away empty handed. That's random. I have alts that I ran in LFR under the old system that would win 3 or more pieces of loot from the old system, and I have alts that I ran every week and MAYBE won a single item. That's random. The new system just remove the influence of anyone else, so that every single person there, where you feel they contributed or not, has the same exact RANDOM chance of winning a piece of gear as everyone else.

LFR is not hard, does not require heroic geared raiders, or smart healers, or even really good tanks. It's for average or below average players so they can experience the content (even in a diminished form) and have a shot at improved gear. If you are a normal or heroic raider and you use LFR to temporarily supplement those sub par pieces taht you might have due to bad luck in your normal raid week, then chances are pretty good that you're doing JUST fine without them and it would be a nice bonus to upgrade those slots. I'm not a statistician, but if you are running for 1 specific item, it's going to make it feel as though your chances are non-existant since you're hoping for 1 boss to drop 1 item (out of several possible items) which is like finding a needle in a haystack.

(I'm not picking on you TrollFu. I just happened to quote your post here so I could respond with my first paragraph.)

[Azrile]

Would be nice if they upped the drop chance from coins a bit. it's what? 15%, 20% chance of getting loot when you use a coin to reroll. Why not bump it to say 25% or 30%. Pretty sure I saw somewhere the chances of getting loot on a coin roll was 20%

The RNG will still be there, it will still suck, but you have a better chance at loot than you do now. If only slightly.



Oh and it would be nice if melee DPS weapons were on different bosses instead of the same one. As a Titan's grip fury warrior, nothing sucked more than seeing that one handed sword from sha of 28.5 gold drop instead of the two handed axe. Oh well, least I have a tank weapon now.

If they upped the chances for coins to work, then the same poster would just be back here crying about having to do dailies..

---------- Post added 2013-01-11 at 06:43 PM ----------

Trading should still be allowed

so A) if I didn't need it I could trade to someone who did (it doesn't effect anyone's loot chance so I don't see a problem) and B) that if I wanted to I could trade it to an Enchanger to see if I could get some Sha Crystals/Blood Spirits to make my own damn gear

Here is the problem. The devs track how fast players gear up. They have a target in mind. If you allow players to trade gear, then player will be gearing up faster then their target, and they will just go back and decrease drop rates. I hate to show you the inside of the sausage factory, but that is exactly what would happen.

I don´t know what the devs target is.. maybe 1.0 upgrades per week for an average player... if the average player starts getting 1.3 upgrades per week because player can now trade items... then Blizzard is just going to decrease the drop rate from 15% to 10% overall.

---------- Post added 2013-01-11 at 06:47 PM ----------

Your complaints about LFR loot are just plain silly and your suggestion to reward people who are at the top of the charts is worse. You can't reward someone for being at the top of the charts because they might have fucked up other mechanics to the fight. Like maybe they stayed on the boss the whole time dpsing instead of helping taking down the adds like they were spos'ed to. Also...how would a tank get rewarded on such a system?

And the system isn't "punishing you" as you claim. RNG is fucking with you as it fucks with every player at one point or another. Just suck it up until next week like the rest of us do.

Imo the loot system is fine the way it is. The only thing I might want to add to it is something like "If you killed this boss X amount of times and you didn't get the piece you were after, now you get the piece." Something along the lines of maybe killing any boss 5 times grants you 1 free pick into its loot table would be nice.

Exactly. There are a lot of fights where ´doing it right´ is a huge dps loss... and do we really want all 6 healers using their fast-cast healing spell racing each other to get tops on the healing charts.

[Wildtree]

An even larger slap in the face is knowing that level 87's can do the Sha sitting around in Kun Lai and have their four set tier waiting for them at 90.

Sha doesn't drop all 4 pieces. Legs and Gloves, and that's it.
Plus, not on all realms 87's are taken for Sha. 89 maybe, 88 already an issue, 87 usually not at all.
Maybe on Monday, when even on higher pop realms the groups become desperate to just fill the raid.
And that chance is pretty much there for everyone to try if they get accepted.

[Azrile]

People don't seem to grasp that it only feels worse than it was because now you actually get to roll every boss, rather than only every so often as drops permitted. I fail to see how the new system is any worse. Nobody can unjustly take loot that should have been yours. Your weapon won't finally drop and get needed on by the tank. It just feels like the system is screwing you because now you can roll on each boss, and you get a bag rather than nothing. Would you rather have nothing?

That is a great point. In DS.. probably half the bosses you never even had an opportunity to roll need. Current LFR, you actually see yourself ´losing´ rolls on every boss. Maybe it is just a psychological thing.

In a way it is like I say about pvp.. no developer can ever balance pvp in the eyes of the players... because balanced pvp means you will lose 50% of the time.. and no player can mentally accept losing 50% of the time.

---------- Post added 2013-01-11 at 07:04 PM ----------

I hear ya man. The problem my guild is having is that every boss drops exactly the items we need on the first kill. After a month we no longer have a need to raid, because everyone is already BIS.

We actually run 5 different alt groups because after a month of normal raiding everyone is in BIS for that toon. I couldn't imagine a world were I had to raid more than a month to be BiS. Maybe that's Blizzard motivation to get people to go from LFR to Normals,, Because normals\heroics only drop the gear you want.

Like you, I've never seen Holy Pally gear drop in our raids, since we have no H-pallys. Only down side to normal mode raiding, is we never have any shards\or blood spirits because we never DE anything. Everything gets used 100% of the time.

Normal\Heroic loot drops are just sooo much better than LFR.

I have read through this thread.. I believe 50% of the people in here will think you are serious.

[Deja Thoris]

This only illustrates that he has no idea what he's talking about. Or a troll... Not sure which yet.

I'll vote for both.

2 posts here and all to moan about lfr loot, seriously, why not just ban people if this is the sum total of their contribution to this community?

[Ikkarus]

Ikkarus that's an ignorant statement man. I can't stand reading about people complaining that their 2-3 hours doesn't yield them bountiful loot. I posted a few posts up about how my N/HM raiding a lot of times doesn't yield the loot I need. It's exactly the same.

But the whole "Why do you want better gear if you're not raiding normals" argument is complete BS. People want better gear because thats why we play this game. For shiny cool things dude. Do I -need- that Quel'serrar transmog sword? Of course not, but do I want it because it looks cool and I feel like a badass? Yes.

But man, I'm serious now, I know what u mean, it's good being rewarded when you kill a Boss, of course it is but, is it really necessarie all this QQ threads about the loot system? Like I said before, the itens aren't necessary for your progression if you only raid in the LFR, and if you want it for transmog (Those terrible itens? Really?) or something there's no need to be hasty, be patient, eventually you'll get lucky.

But I really don't understand all this QQ about it, the game isn't only about gear ppl...

[Pol-Kinabol]

Cata LFR had a far bigger chance for loot. When you needed something you just rolled on anything you could, then when your item drops you then traded one of your won items for it.
Full tier set took only 2-4 weeks that way.

I never ever did that, always thought only douches were doing this... I really hate what the community had become

[Deleted]

You had a far better chance previously to get something, anything especially when it came to the PvP boss before MoP. It was usually 10 people, sometimes 25 and when you got to actually roll on the stuff that dropped. For example a great many people passed on PvP pieces because they didn't need them or already had them.

With Sha it's completly random what kind of item you get and if you get anything. Also with each consecutive item your chance to get something goes DOWN because you might just end up with something you don't need anymore. This means loot that normally would've gone to other people is now going into the trashbin because the person who receives it doesn't need or want it and it isn't tradable.

The new system is great and all for the LFR. But WHY THE HELL did they have to make the PvP boss into an outdoor boss for 40~ people with the exact same loot system?!

[fangless]

I killed 11 Heroic bosses this week and didn't get any loot.

[Deleted]

I don't understand, most of people that keep bitching about LFR loot system are players that won't be doing normal modes anyway, so why they want better gear?

I don't think this is a completely fair response.

I am not doing any normals at the moment (just got 4/8 on MV in normal mode) or even heroics. Work, time commitments etc are crazy so I cant commit to a schedule, but when I will have more time to play I'd like to start doing heroics again. LFR is the only way to get tier sets (and the only way to get a half decent weapon). Sure I also grind dailies for rep gear but that's even slower.

The point is that LFR gear will at least allow me to be semi-competitive (or at least helpful) when I have time to go back to normal modes (or heroics), this is even more important when you are a tier behind like I will most probably be once 5.2 comes out.

The issue would have been moot if 5.2 also included dungeons, but that's not the point now I guess.

Also the tier sets look nice!