Originally Posted by
Ryan Cailan Ebonheart
Am I the only one who thinks Warriors are going to be bottom of the barrel in 5.2 out of all of the melee? I've been reading some other threads about the nerfs and most people keep claiming that Warriors are going to be "fine, just not OP." Here are some of my thoughts why I believe Warriors are going to be terrible if nothing changes. Its long.
Second Wind Nerf/Defensive Stance nerf - This nerf is downright absurd and I'll explain why because I've seen so much ignorance floating around from people who've never played a Warrior. Warriors in Cataclysm originally had Second Wind and an ability named Blood Craze. Without going into details Blood Craze had a 10% chance of healing the Warrior when he received any damage source. Second Wind would only heal through a stun. Basically, these two talents healed for such a minimal amount, that it only made Warrior more resilient against bleeds and dots over DK's who have no passive healing. Old Battle Stance gave the Warrior 5% damage reduction and 5% damage bonus. The only heal that Warriors had that mattered was Enraged Regeneration, which at the time, healed for 30% of health over 10 seconds... 3 minute cool down. Then there was a talent called Field Dressing that buffed it to 36% I believe, but I forget the actual numbers.
5.2 Warrior doesn't have any passive healing outside of Second Wind and only gets a 0% reduction from Battle Stance. Yeah I said "Battle Stance" because Defensive Stance isn't viable with 5.2 Arms thanks to Blizzards ingenious Taste for Blood change. Overpower costs 10 rage and Defensive Stance offers only 10 rage per mortal strike with a small 1 rage bonus per 3 seconds. Previously, 5.0 -5.1 Warriors would just sit in defensive stance and really only use Mortal Strike, Overpower and Colossus Smash while completely ignoring Slam with the occasional Heroic Strike when having excess extra rage. Slam is just painful to use considering Warriors in pvp have way too many globals to fill and to use one of those globals for Slam is just a waste when it could be used to either re apply mortal strike, hit hamstring, hit shockwave or use a sudden death proc. Slam is basically a terrible burden to Arms considering Arms historically never really used it until season 10. Anyway, Defensive Stance in 5.2 will only be used if the Warrior is going to die because of the rage cost from Overpower that didn't exist in 5.1.
Back to healing, Rallying Cry is basically the only "heal" Warriors have but its mostly used as a utility ability to stack with shaman spirit link. Enraged Regeneration is now a talent that has to be chosen over Second Wind but its now a 10% heal on a 1 minute cool down. In other words, it sucks. 5.2 Second Wind is still affected by battle fatigue, and currently doesn't heal through stuns. That basically means once the Warrior is caught in a stun, he could go from 100-0 without a trinket. Before DK's and Ret Paladins go ape shit and explain to me "Well too bad, that's what we have to deal with" let me explain that Warriors have no jail cards out of stuns besides a trinket.
Warriors are also the only melee in the game that moves at 100% movement speed against most classes who can run up to 115% or even up to 125%. Warriors are basically turtles and hamstring is joke considering its only a 50% movement debuff that requires melee range and 10 rage and is also easily dispelled. Compare that to Ret paladin Burden of Guilt which is basically a free ranged 50% movement slow that gives the Ret paladin one charge of holy power and if the ret is specced into long arm of the law can run up to 45% movement speed for 3 seconds. Judgement is only on a 6 second cool down and that cool down can be lowered through haste stacking.
Basically what I'm trying to explain is that Warriors can't kite melee. They have no tools outside of safeguard to break snares and mainly rely on team mates to dispell for them. Warriors don't have stealth, nor do they any type of fade or absorb type abilities. They have fear immunity every 30 seconds, which is great but not useful if the Warrior is the target getting trained. All they have is damage reduction abilities such as Shield Wall and Demoralizing Banner which only delay the inevitable due to their long cool downs. Heroic Leap, safeguard is really the only "escape" a Warrior has, but a defensive Warrior is a dead Warrior. Warriors are only doing well when they are maintaining pressure. If they're constantly being trained into the ground, they're more of a burden to the team healer than an actual asset. This is why I believe 5.1 Second Wind with 25% Defensive stance was not only fine, but necessary if you have a 40 second Shockwave. Warriors are Warriors, they're meant to have high passive defense for their complete lack of being able to avoid damage and slow ass movement speed.
Season 11 Warriors weren't bad because they did no damage. In fact, season 11 Arms did great sustained damage but lacked in the defense department. However, Rogue could basically sit on a Warrior all game and slowed/stunned to the point where the damage didn't matter. This is exactly what is going to happen in 5.2. Its almost as if Warriors are going to become Season 12 Frost DK's without the ridiculous sustained pressure that Frost can deal but every 5 minutes can trounce someone that is stupid enough to sit in Avatar/Reck which by the way thanks to 5.1 nerfs, can be kited.
This thread is about my opinion on the future of 5.2 Warriors. I don't care if you play an Elemental Shaman, Enhancement Shaman, Ret Paladin, WW Monk, Rogue, DK, Balance Druid, and cry on the forums with the "Pity me" attitude by constantly attacking people who play classes such as Warriors and Mages that had a good season. If you're going to make stupid statements like "Well now you know how US RETS FEEL" or "After season 12, I don't have any sympathy for Warriors" just get out, I won't reply to such stupid nonsense. Some people seriously need to get their head of of their asses and stop having so much blind loyalty to a certain class like its some sort of sports team.
I main DK by the way. I have no real sympathy towards Warriors but I want them to be actually viable and not dogshit for another 8 months until Blizzard decides to add a patch. No class deserves to be terrible for a season just because they had a good season. But this is the land of Blizzard and as much as they don't say it, they sure seem to balance this game for some classes around that philosophy.
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and you call me a dumb idiot!we guess what smart guy,shamans were the #1 pvp class in cata. restro shammys were in over 80% of the top 3 mans teams.thats why you did not see many enhance because they were all face rolling as restro. warriors on the other hand were the lowest represented class ever last season.your example is just bad and makes me lol @ you.
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