February 7: Blizzard Conference Call

[ScottsdaleHokie]

It proves however that the release of a PvP oriented game didn't have a big impact on WoW. It did in fact have none.
If TESO will have an Impact about as large as GW2, then theres nothing to worry about.



You're such a daredevil... but you forgot the sunglasses. ._.



*giggles*
But sadly, not even half as productive.

GW2 is PvP oriented? Fooled me.

[SamR]

You do realize that just because WoWs subs went up that quarter, it doesn't mean GW2 didn't take subs from WoW, right?

Of course. But I'm just taking away the low hanging fruit.

Still waiting for any type of evidence that GW2 impacted WoW subs in any significant way.

[RoKPaNda]

What? I think you're the first person I've heard saying such a thing...

The Korean MMO of choice isn't WoW. I can't think of what it's called at the moment, but it's something most people stateside won't have heard of I think. They have buses with advertisements for it over there. StarCraft 2 in Korea isn't unpopular, it's just not nearly as popular as StarCraft 1 was. The big game in Korea right now though appears to be League of Legends.

[Orange Joe]

If WoW loses 2 million players in one Quarter its going to die. It only has about 4+ mil players playing in NA/EU. Losing 2 mil would be devastating. I expect subs to go back up a tad next Q but not the full 400k If it does decline again it will be a small decline or it will stay steady. 5.2 is getting released soon so some will come for that. The next big hit WoW is gonna take is when TESO gets released.

You are THAT guy aren't you. Every new mmo that comes out is the next wow killer isn't it?

[Lemmiwink]

You are THAT guy aren't you. Every new mmo that comes out is the next wow killer isn't it?

Yep, plenty of them going around. If we look at it historically, how many games actually killed WoW? How many games made a dent in WoW's sub numbers? Doesn't take a genious to know that hyping up games to be WoW-killers is not beneficial to the games, it's even damaging. It creates an expectation of something better than WoW, while most likely a new game wouldn't even be on par with WoW. Not to mention all the time people have invested in their WoW-characters.

I wish people would stop hyping things up so much, it only creates massive amounts of rage once the games are actually released and people discover that it isn't what it was hyped up to be. Good example would be SWTOR.....

[Deleted]

WoW subs will remain at the same level. What will be really surprising and I'm most eager to know is how much money they managed to milk... I mean "earn" from D3's RMAH.

[Alewen]

Well lets see... in a span of September to December, new expansion launch, holiday season, especially around christmas... and they lost 400,000 subscriptions. I don't think they ever lost subscriptions around christmas before. So I do consider that a rather sizable loss. And hopefully now, Blizzard will actually start shifting their direction. Maybe start actually stop trying to silence people on cross realm zones issues and actually listen and respond in a more respectful tone. Heck, not even Cataclysm lost that many subs in this short a time.

So now, the ball is in Blizzard's court. Will they simply plow on ahead, not addressing the issues their player base is having issues with, and/or silencing their player base? Or will they realize us players who did cancel around that time, were serious about our issues with flawed systems and try to be more open to our suggestions or more open to our feedback? For me, it is now a wait and see. I have no desire to see the game die. But the course Blizzard is on, is suicide and needs to be shifted. Numbers don't lie, and losing that many subs around christmas, isn't a good thing.

[mosely]

9.6 million future unsubscribers.

[Deleted]

Wow could lose millions of subs and still be living well

[Mormolyce]

So, 53 pages about sub numbers which have nothing to do with the game. Sigh. I wish they'd keep the subs secret really to stop this kind of stupid pissing contest on the net.

It's just pathetic, people making all these posts trying to act like fluctuations in sub numbers are some kind of vindication of whatever chip they have on their shoulders about the game design. Is that really the sad, petty level you want to live your life on?

Play games you like, and if you don't like them don't play them. How many other people play a game doesn't mean shit.

[mosely]

Well lets see... in a span of September to December, new expansion launch, holiday season, especially around christmas... and they lost 400,000 subscriptions. I don't think they ever lost subscriptions around christmas before. So I do consider that a rather sizable loss. And hopefully now, Blizzard will actually start shifting their direction. Maybe start actually stop trying to silence people on cross realm zones issues and actually listen and respond in a more respectful tone. Heck, not even Cataclysm lost that many subs in this short a time.

So now, the ball is in Blizzard's court. Will they simply plow on ahead, not addressing the issues their player base is having issues with, and/or silencing their player base? Or will they realize us players who did cancel around that time, were serious about our issues with flawed systems and try to be more open to our suggestions or more open to our feedback? For me, it is now a wait and see. I have no desire to see the game die. But the course Blizzard is on, is suicide and needs to be shifted. Numbers don't lie, and losing that many subs around christmas, isn't a good thing.

Also, there were no major releases by competitors during this quarter. This is a loud and clear message from 400,000 people that WoW is no longer good enough to justify a subscription.

[Deleted]

I just want to point out that subs are higher than 9.6 million.

The actual report states:
"As of December 31, 2012, Blizzard Entertainment’s World of Warcraft remains the #1 subscription-based MMORPG, with more than 9.6 million subscribers."

Obviously, we don't know exactly how many more than, just as we didn't when it was "over" 10 million but, we can't really even say it was 400k lost. Even the front page of MMO-C just assumes it is bang on 9.6 million. It could quite easily be 400,050 subs lost as easily as it could be 750,000 subs lost.

Again, the numbers really just don't mean a whole lot to anyone but certain people.

It is less than 9650000 cause they would round it up to 9700000, if not definately is under the later number.
More than 10 mil again means less than 10,1. The margin is most likely around 350k to 450k subs between the two calls. It can by no mean be more than 500k
Blizzard is not going to round down 10,3 million subs to 10 million saying "more than 10 mil", no way.
Close to be correct (said 500 to 800 minus), but the further decline of the subs the 40 days that have passed after december 31 probably blurred my judgement. I estimate that the game right now is having no more than the subs of the end of Q2, strugling to stay above 9 million.

Pitty, because the content wasnt bad, although the setting was a bit allienating and the Sha's a bit of a smudge of an end boss.

[SamR]

Also, there were no major releases by competitors during this quarter. This is a loud and clear message from 400,000 people that WoW is no longer good enough to justify a subscription.

I've sent Blizzard that message quite a few times myself. Once during vanilla. At the end of TBC. I think twice during Wrath which I just kind of drifted in and out of really. And twice during Cata(took breaks to play Rift and D3).

I wonder if Blizzard got my message that vanilla sucked and every single expansion has sucked. Wait, that wasn't the message behind my many WoW unsubs/resubs at all...

[Chaochamp]

So, 53 pages about sub numbers which have nothing to do with the game. Sigh. I wish they'd keep the subs secret really to stop this kind of stupid pissing contest on the net.

It's just pathetic, people making all these posts trying to act like fluctuations in sub numbers are some kind of vindication of whatever chip they have on their shoulders about the game design. Is that really the sad, petty level you want to live your life on?

Play games you like, and if you don't like them don't play them. How many other people play a game doesn't mean shit.

Actually, the amount of players playing the game represents player enjoyment.

Also, if subs numbers didn't matter, Blizzard wouldn't put the "x subscribers currently playing!11!1!!1" stickers on their game boxes. Stop pretending like subscribers don't matter, because even Blizzard disagrees with you.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

You made a claim that GW2 took subs from WoW.

I pointed out that WoW subs went up that quarter.

So now you're arguing that GW2 would have totally had a visible impact on WoW subs if only a lot of things were different back then.

Usually when you make a claim, you need to provide evidence. Making rationalizations about what might have been when someone points out why your claim is contradicted by actual facts and figures isn't very strong evidence.

These threads always follow the same trend.

1. Thread is made, we speculate sub changes.

2. Someone points out a feature they think will cause massive (1m+) losses.

3. We argue over that feature for a while.

4. Repeat 2 and 3 until the numbers are revealed.

5. Doomsayers or Fanboys claim a win.

6. We argue over the implications of the sub changes.

7. Someone brings up "X game is doing it, X game is the new king of MMOs."

8. We devolve into game vs game.

9. Thread locked.

10. Repeat in 2 months.

[mosely]

I've sent Blizzard that message quite a few times myself. Once during vanilla. At the end of TBC. I think twice during Wrath which I just kind of drifted in and out of really. And twice during Cata(took breaks to play Rift and D3).

I wonder if Blizzard got my message that vanilla sucked and every single expansion has sucked. Wait, that wasn't the message behind my many WoW unsubs/resubs at all...

What message do you think you were sending? What you're saying here exactly supports my point. If WoW was good enough to keep you entertained, you would not have unsubscribed. You would not have felt the desire to take a break and check out Rift or Diablo. You would not have had any reason to drift in and out of the game. Your unsubscribing is completely incongruous with the idea that WoW was good enough (to you) to justify a continuous subscription.

[killidan]

9.6M

as expected and below 10M

from now on, the only way is down until the next expansion

[Deleted]

What message do you think you were sending? What you're saying here exactly supports my point. If WoW was good enough to keep you entertained, you would not have unsubscribed. You would not have felt the desire to take a break and check out Rift or Diablo. You would not have had any reason to drift in and out of the game. Your unsubscribing is completely incongruous with the idea that WoW was good enough (to you) to justify a continuous subscription.

Entertainment doesn't automatically correlate with attachment. This forum takes a giant sample of dissafisfied customers who have gone back repeatedly.

Personal predictions are very good financially - I expect Blizzard to attempt a giant resurgence of subscribers in X5, due to contrasting theme, nostalgic attachment from the dusty shelf of former customers.

Expect Expansion 5 to be the Wrestlemania of WoW - All the loyalists will flock back, and it'll be beautiful for a short while. Then afterwards it'll all be over.

[Deleted]

How many other people play a game doesn't mean shit.

Tell that to the people who come to other games and ask for all sorts of shit: raids, arenas, archievements, whatever. Why? WoW has it and WoW has 93487509238457603984675 subscribers, so it must be great, right. I stopped caring about WoW per se a while ago but as long as it keeps influencing the whole market, subscriptions cannot drop fast enough.

[Mawnix]

On topic, I'm not surprised at the loss. I just wish it didn't incite people the way it did. I still want to know what happened to simply enjoying a game for being fun.

Agreed. Myself included; I can get a tad heated and consumed by discussion here a lot.