Is the World of Warcraft community bad? And should we feel bad?

[YouAreAllWrong]

WoWs community is kinda bad, but it's expected considering what WoW is and how WoW works.

[Stuffs]

Not at all Pann, these are the hard truths that have to be stated. The bigger problem are all the apologists who are content to bury their heads in the sand and attempt to sugar coat everything. Wake up, this community went down the toilet, and we're all to blame.

I'll go on a limb and say your blanket statements don't help improve the community.

If someone is being a twat, say as much, but trying to alienate people with comments like "number crunching mouth breathers" or "entitled brats" won't do anything positive.

Instead, actually go off of their actions.

[Schwert]

Online games in general are a toxic place;
And gamers are a toxic bunch.

It has literally always been this way.
Even in the age of console gaming people were being elitist pricks in multiplayer games because of the "better than thou" attitude that runs rampant in younger people. It's only gotten worse because now there's a literally nothing preventing people from not being complete wads to each other.
Social stigma is gone.

I only noticed how bad it actually got when I decided to attend an overnight lock in gaming marathon and was bashed for not only playing WoW;
but for multiple other factors that shouldn't matter in a fun "social" setting. (Gender, Never playing x, Character choice in x game) - To my face.
The attitudes we see online do affect people in real life sadly.
I've seen it.

I can't take other "gamers" seriously because of it;
WoW or not.

People who take online games too seriously will take it too seriously.
And when you're taking something that literally does not matter in your life outside entertainment as seriously as you are...
These things happen.

MMO's are just the worst magnet for these behaviors.

[Lovecrafts]

I'll go on a limb and say your blanket statements don't help improve the community.

If someone is being a twat, say as much, but trying to alienate people with comments like "number crunching mouth breathers" or "entitled brats" won't do anything positive.

Instead, actually go off of their actions.

Blanket statements? No, I'm naming very specific types of people in this game that are making it bad. If I said "ALL PLAYERS ARE X" then that would be a blanket statement. Honestly, if you don't think we should alienate the types of people I've listed, you are part of the community's steady decline.

[Pann]

Blanket statements? No, I'm naming very specific types of people in this game that are making it bad. If I said "ALL PLAYERS ARE X" then that would be a blanket statement. Honestly, if you don't think we should alienate the types of people I've listed, you are part of the community's steady decline.

Seriously I don't know what is worse the fact that you think it is acceptable to insult and alienate parts of the game's population you do not like or that you cannot recognise that this kind of behaviour is major part of the problem with the community and that somehow you think this action will make it better.

[Promithiuz]

depends on the guild and people you play with there are kind people but also some asses around there

[Lovecrafts]

Seriously I don't know what is worse the fact that you think it is acceptable to insult and alienate parts of the game's population you do not like or that you cannot recognise that this kind of behaviour is major part of the problem with the community and that somehow you think this action will make it better.

Do you like those portions of the population? Do you like trolls, do you like people who try and take the fun out of things, do you like the whiners who cause the game to get dumbed down? Do you think these people make the population better? Ohhhhh....they make it worse? Hey, let's do NOTHING about them, yeah...that sure will fix things. Oh god, why are things getting worse!!!???

It's people like you, who do NOTHING, say NOTHING, and hide your head in the sand in regards to these toxic members of the population that have caused these issues to grow like cancer.

[Korgoth]

I stopped reading it at the point when he knocks people for requiring ilvl and achievements... hes a bad player pist that he can't get carried.

[K i s u]

Most gaming communities are awful with just a few redeeming factors and kind, helpful folks in the mix.

[Pann]

Do you like those portions of the population? Do you like trolls, do you like people who try and take the fun out of things, do you like the whiners who cause the game to get dumbed down? Do you think these people make the population better? Ohhhhh....they make it worse? Hey, let's do NOTHING about them, yeah...that sure will fix things. Oh god, why are things getting worse!!!???

It's people like you, who do NOTHING, say NOTHING, and hide your head in the sand in regards to these toxic members of the population that have caused these issues to grow like cancer.

We have several million different players each with different opinions of what is fun and what is not it is inevitable that people are not going to agree about everything. You seem to think it acceptable to abuse players that do not hold your ideals to the point that they leave the game, I don't believe it is acceptable to insult others, especially over their performance in game, and in all honesty I would prefer to see the players that are rude and abusive leave whilst the bad players that say nothing bad to others continue to do bad DPS in LFR.

[Itisamuh]

I stopped reading it at the point when he knocks people for requiring ilvl and achievements... hes a bad player pist that he can't get carried.

What a bad attitude. How are people supposed to get achievements when every group requires them to already have them?

[Lovecrafts]

We have several million different players each with different opinions of what is fun and what is not it is inevitable that people are not going to agree about everything. You seem to think it acceptable to abuse players that do not hold your ideals to the point that they leave the game, I don't believe it is acceptable to insult others, especially over their performance in game, and in all honesty I would prefer to see the players that are rude and abusive leave whilst the bad players that say nothing bad to others continue to do bad DPS in LFR.

I'm not insulting their performance in the game, I'm insulting their shenanigans, attitudes, and disruptive/toxic natures that hurt what's left of the community. I don't really give a shit about their skill/performance level. It's a game, it's about fun, and it's hard to have a fun community when you have toxic players running pissing all over everyone. It's even harder when there's apologists like you running around trying to cover up what they are doing with "let's all love one another" bologna.

In short, yeah I think it's ok to abuse trolls and people purposely trying to hurt the game until they go away.

[Pann]

I'm not insulting their performance in the game, I'm insulting their shenanigans, attitudes, and disruptive/toxic natures that hurt what's left of the community. I don't really give a shit about their skill/performance level. It's a game, it's about fun, and it's hard to have a fun community when you have toxic players running pissing all over everyone. It's even harder when there's apologists like you running around trying to cover up what they are doing with "let's all love one another" bologna.

In short, yeah I think it's ok to abuse trolls and people purposely trying to hurt the game until they go away.

You are the gift that keeps on giving.

I find it highly amusing that you cannot see that the very behaviour you are advocating towards other players is exactly the same as that you are accusing them of.

[Fagatronics]

Most gaming communities are awful with just a few redeeming factors and kind, helpful folks in the mix.

Agreed but with the lack of accountability because of xrealm groups/raids has really exacerbated the decline of communities and demand for efficiency in recent years.

We have several million different players each with different opinions of what is fun and what is not it is inevitable that people are not going to agree about everything. You seem to think it acceptable to abuse players that do not hold your ideals to the point that they leave the game, I don't believe it is acceptable to insult others, especially over their performance in game, and in all honesty I would prefer to see the players that are rude and abusive leave whilst the bad players that say nothing bad to others continue to do bad DPS in LFR.

I think you, Pann, and Lovecrafts just have philosophical differences. Lovecrafts wants to identify the cancers and cut them out while it seems you would prefer to try and cure them. Both intentions are noble and honestly can work. It just depends on the type of player you're dealing with. But there's definitely a middle ground to be had.

If a player is a dick, likes being a dick, and doesn't want to change; they should be publicly denounced and black balled by the community. But if someone is a dick because it's sadly the way he/she learned to play the game, they can be redeemed with some common courtesy and positive reinforcement. Not everyone can be saved but not everyone should be shunned either.

[Lovecrafts]

You are the gift that keeps on giving.

I find it highly amusing that you cannot see that the very behaviour you are advocating towards other players is exactly the same as that you are accusing them of.

I guess I'm more of an old-school person. When I grew up, the shit-heads were called out on being shit-heads, they were punished, and made as an example to prevent more little shit-heads from sprouting up.

It worked pretty darn good. Now we try to explain the shit-heads behavior for them, we try to coddle them, we give them tons of chances, we make excuses for them, we try to pull the whole "kill em with love!" mentality, and all the other little shit-heads realize that there are no consequences for their actions and start coming out of the woodwork's. The original ones, are never punished, or are eventually punished once they've been allowed to wreak havoc and mischief for years.

It's only going to get worse from here on out.

[Pann]

I guess I'm more of an old-school person. When I grew up, the shit-heads were called out on being shit-heads, they were punished, and made as an example to prevent more little shit-heads from sprouting up.

It worked pretty darn good. Now we try to explain the shit-heads behavior for them, we try to coddle them, we give them tons of chances, we make excuses for them, we try to pull the whole "kill em with love!" mentality, and all the other little shit-heads realize that there are no consequences for their actions and start coming out of the woodwork's. The original ones, are never punished, or are eventually punished once they've been allowed to wreak havoc and mischief for years.

It's only going to get worse from here on out.

When I grew up I was taught to say please and thank you, I was taught to treat others as you expect to be treated.

But hey, if you were taught to deal with shit-heads by acting like one yourself I guess ultimately that will end up being your loss.

[Lovecrafts]

When I grew up I was taught to say please and thank you, I was taught to treat others as you expect to be treated.

But hey, if you were taught to deal with shit-heads by acting like one yourself I guess ultimately that will end up being your loss.

And if you want to keep dealing with them by hugging them and letting their behavior fester, spread, and grow, well then I guess that will end up being your loss.

[Pann]

And if you want to keep dealing with them by hugging them and letting their behavior fester, spread, and grow, well then I guess that will end up being your loss.

Who are these people you keep referring to? And what do they actually do to impact on your enjoyment of the game?

[Lovecrafts]

Who are these people you keep referring to? And what do they actually do to impact on your enjoyment of the game?

So basically....you didn't ready any of my posts. Yeah, no, we're done now. Bye-bye.

[Mawnix]

So basically....you didn't ready any of my posts. Yeah, no, we're done now. Bye-bye.

This isn't specifically calling you out, Lovecraft, but Pann and you are an example of the disharmony in the community.

If you go through both of your posts, you act and feel differently about nearly everything.

Due to that fact, you're going to disagree so bitterly.

And because of that fact, you two are at each others throats like the person you're arguing against killed your puppy.