Find Weakness buffed to 100% Build 16911

[Verain]

Dance is not damage that must be stopped, dance is damage that must be prevented or cooldowned.

That's what I said.

If it gets stopped the rogue is either bad, chose to use it for utility or doesn't know how to use it.

Correct, but not relevant. Dance always has to be responded to. But outside of dance, enemy defensive cooldowns just pool up. I maintain if the first is an issue, the second sure is too.

[Evolixe]

Correct, but not relevant. Dance always has to be responded to. But outside of dance, enemy defensive cooldowns just pool up. I maintain if the first is an issue, the second sure is too.

You need to learn to force cooldowns with control then.

[Verain]

You need to learn to force cooldowns with control then.

That is not valid advice for all comps. Isn't the goal to be useful outside of certain power comps? Dance getting either kills or > 1 min defensives goes towards that goal, but so does higher sustained.

[Razorlor]

Dumb change. I can't see why they couldn't just keep it at 70%.

Rogue openers are far, far too powerful.

[Evolixe]

That is not valid advice for all comps. Isn't the goal to be useful outside of certain power comps? Dance getting either kills or > 1 min defensives goes towards that goal, but so does higher sustained.

Bullshit. Every comp can and should force cooldowns with control... what the fuck this is kind of the essence of pvp lol..

[Illiterate]

Rogues are looking even weaker than they were in 5.0

[jsz]

Three weeks after re-subbing and the nerfs are already building up, feels bad man. So many other classes have ridiculous damage from what I've experienced and yet I don't see any similarly severe nerfs for them, Mages for example are totally insane during burst and they are barely touched.

It's exactly like 4.3 where a stupid trinket made us out of control, and of course they don't just nerf the trinkets and then see how it pans out but go straight for the nuclear option. These nerfs combined with the pvp power nerfs really worry me, because Rogues already had awful survivability and the only thing it seems to me that made us dangerous was our burst.

So you resub solely because rogues are fotm/OP and hey, you happen to have a rogue!

[Koji2k11]

Rogues are looking even weaker than they were in 5.0

thats exactly what i was thinking first they over buff them then they nerf us into oblivion so no one is playing rogues again but hey maybe sub will be viable in pve ?

[Evolixe]

thats exactly what i was thinking first they over buff them then they nerf us into oblivion so no one is playing rogues again but hey maybe sub will be viable in pve ?

Oh please, the only change that has any chance of impacting us is the Find Weakness one. And if it does that badly, it'll be changed soon enough. Stop saying the sky is falling please.

[Deleted]

read the entire post, 100% and 50% against players, it is a nerf not a buff.

[Evolixe]

read the entire post, 100% and 50% against players, it is a nerf not a buff.

Who said it was a buff?

[Verain]

Bullshit. Every comp can and should force cooldowns with control... what the fuck this is kind of the essence of pvp lol..

Some comps are CC heavy, others are not. There's a difference between like, blind->fear->silence and like fear->fear->cylone->cyclone->sheep->sheep->silence, for instance. There has to be more to play than just stacking forward CC and aiming to get cooldowns enough to actually kill someone next time- and indeed, there are comps built around different things.

Oh please, the only change that has any chance of impacting us is the Find Weakness one.

The ST change hurts sustained and control versus ranged. MfD remaining untouched is a real puzzler when that seems to be the kill cycle one. ST will really hurt stuff outside of tight comps pretty bad, which seems mean. The FW change could be very bad. Plate at 30% armor is manageable. Plate at 50% armor is still very tough. We don't have the same uptime with FW that warriors do with smash, so this COULD easily be an overnerf.

And if it does that badly, it'll be changed soon enough. Stop saying the sky is falling please.

So far, Blizzard has only made changes like this on a PTR. If they are rogue nerfs, they have a 100% record of staying on the PTR and going live. You'll notice rogues were shit for 5.0, bad for 5.1, and are only now getting actual rep- but with 5.3 closing in, they are quickly nerfing rogues so that they won't go a whole season. We have no reason to suspect they will repair an overnerf before 5.4 or a 6.0 "redesign", should this in fact be one.

[1Snail]

FOR PVE:

Just implemented the new changes in simcraft, looks to be about a ~10k increase in dps.

Old: (Live)
http://hostr.co/file/OO7WAZoRooNh/Sc...t-20.50.01.png

New: (PTR)
http://hostr.co/file/BLoA5SZb4ygs/Sc...t-20.50.36.png

[Maelstrom51]

And if it does that badly, it'll be changed soon enough.

Ehh, it seems to me that rogues tend to take a long time to get buffs and nerfs.

[Illiterate]

Oh please, the only change that has any chance of impacting us is the Find Weakness one. And if it does that badly, it'll be changed soon enough. Stop saying the sky is falling please.

cloak and dagger, cheap shot, garrote, fw, st...what else?

Ehh, it seems to me that rogues tend to take a long time to get buffs and nerfs.

nobody plays them so they are at the bottom of the list

[Evolixe]

cloak and dagger, cheap shot, garrote, fw, st...what else?

Nothing. And Find Weakness is the only one that could really hit us at all.

[Maelstrom51]

Nothing. And Find Weakness is the only one that could really hit us at all.

What about CnD not working with Shadow Dance?
That's how it currently is on the PTR and there's this: https://twitter.com/holinka/status/330068422681587712

[Coldkil]

What about CnD not working with Shadow Dance?
That's how it currently is on the PTR and there's this: https://twitter.com/holinka/status/330068422681587712

People will all go back to ShS and after the first days of whining people will play like they played before. It sucks because one of the few choices we could make about talents will return a pretty much "forced" one.

[Wow]

People will all go back to ShS and after the first days of whining people will play like they played before. It sucks because one of the few choices we could make about talents will return a pretty much "forced" one.

Isn't that the theme of every rogue tier in pvp and pve though lol. 5.3 is killing most of the choices we have now st nerf means people don't take st which also means they don't take deadly throw, CnD nerf means everyone goes to shadowstep pvp and thats all anyone ever took in pve. What small amount of choice rogues got for 5.2 is being taken.

I wouldn't be shocked if A MfD nerf happened too.

[Deleted]

Oh please, the only change that has any chance of impacting us is the Find Weakness one. And if it does that badly, it'll be changed soon enough. Stop saying the sky is falling please.

WOW! You must really be in denial....

Garrote and CS glyph nerfed.

Cloak and dagger is now a paltry 20 yard (huge nerf)

Find weakness lost 20% arp.