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  1. #281
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Yes, yes you are. I don't see how this is a problem.
    It appears to me clearing LFR makes some players think they are better then they actually are and inflate their self worth until they fail miserably at the most basic of mechanics or have pitiful output.

  2. #282
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    Of course you don't. You cleared normal. Duh. The content was appropriate for you but not the majority of players. Let me put it this way. If it was piss easy and lots more people could do it and you did it so fast that it was over would you see that as a problem? I'm guessing yea but for those players it's right on time for them so they likely wouldn't Is it that hard to get out of your own perspective for just a minute?
    I haven't set foot in normal.

    Try again.

  3. #283
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by babo7000 View Post
    Everyone knows that Blizzard releases a raid, makes normal mode semi-difficult, then nerfs the raid by 10-20% at the next tier, so casuals and less experienced guilds can pug/run them.
    The reason for the nerfs is mostly to help unlucky or slightly undergeared raid guilds to have an easier time catching up to the new raid tear that has just been launched.
    Quote Originally Posted by babo7000 View Post
    But how about, instead of doing this nerf, Blizzard releases a fourth raid difficulty alongside there raids, an easy mode.

    Easy mode will essentially be the instance after its nerfed 20%, but released alongside normal and heroic. This ensures two things:
    1) Raids don't have to be nerfed
    2) Pugs can happen as the raid is relevant.

    The gear could be in between LFR and Normal gear. The difficulty will be above LFR and below Normal (Obv). It is pretty much normal mode, but you can do it with worse gear/slightly less coordination.
    The item level difference between LFR and Normal is just 20 item levels, out of 500+ (current tier). That is already quite the limited gap. Supposing your 'Easy Mode' is implemented, it'd only be 10 item levels 'worse' than Normal, and only 10 item levels 'better' than LFR. With that in mind, why would someone go to 'Easy Mode' where they would still have to mind the mechanics and learn boss strategies and communicate with their raid group, when they can go to LFR, faceroll, and gain practically the same piece of gear?

    Quote Originally Posted by babo7000 View Post
    I can't see what problem people would have with this, as it takes almost no time to implement. TBH, I miss the days of Wrath pugging the first half of Uld and ICC. Same thing doesn't happen now a days with ToT, or even MSV. Pugs are there, but they are rarer. There needs to be a middle ground for people who legitimately don't have enough time to follow a raid schedule, but wan't more to raiding than the botfest that is LFR.
    For the bolded part: clearly you have never worked with programming, and have absolutely no idea how it works. It's not simply 'hey, let's just tweak this number here. What could possibly go wrong?'.

    Here's the problems anyone with two working brain cells would have with that:
    1) It takes JUST as long to make this 'easy mode' of yours as it takes to make a normal or heroic raid. There is balancing to do, both for the fights and gear checks;
    2) It would consume time that developers could have used to either polish the new content, or create new content. So instead of having, for example, a good 8-boss raid for LFR, normal and heroic, we'd have a passable 5- or 6-boss raid with four difficulties;
    3) Do you know why there isn't much pugging nowadays? It's not because of raid difficulty. No sir. The reason? We have LFR;
    4) For people who can't follow a raid schedule: there is either LFR, or try to find a guild with a raid schedule that fits your online hours. For the people who don't want to do LFR, join a raiding guild. You can't please everyone. Someone, somewhere, will always be unhappy. If you try to please everyone, you'll just end up with everyone unhappy.
    Last edited by Ielenia; 2013-05-09 at 06:43 PM.
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  4. #284
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    Of course you don't. You cleared normal. Duh. The content was appropriate for you but not the majority of players. Let me put it this way. If it was piss easy and lots more people could do it and you did it so fast that it was over would you see that as a problem? I'm guessing yea but for those players it's right on time for them so they likely wouldn't Is it that hard to get out of your own perspective for just a minute?
    Is it hard to get out of yours?

  5. #285
    Since an "Easy Mode" most likely would mean even lower item levels, lesser achievements, drops and so on, then no, fuck it. Also make LFR the same as Normal.

  6. #286
    The Insane Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    I haven't set foot in normal.

    Try again.
    Then what do you care if they make it piss easy for everybody? I'd love to know why somebody who doesn't raid, hasn't actually participated in the content feels that he or she thinks it's fair to tell otehrs to wait for it to be nerfed.

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-09 at 06:44 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Is it hard to get out of yours?
    Nope. Mine just happens to be where alot more of the games players are at currently. I understand why you guys like hard content honest. It's just not fair to have two modes for heroic raiders and nothing for normal raiders.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  7. #287
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by NSrm View Post
    Since an "Easy Mode" most likely would mean even lower item levels, lesser achievements, drops and so on, then no, fuck it. Also make LFR the same as Normal.
    Tuning LFR in the same way as the current normals would be for blizzard to shoot themselves in the foot.

  8. #288
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    Then what do you care if they make it piss easy for everybody? I'd love to know why somebody who doesn't raid, hasn't actually participated in the content feels that he or she thinks it's fair to tell otehrs to wait for it to be nerfed.

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-09 at 06:44 PM ----------



    Nope. Mine just happens to be where alot more of the games players are at currently. I understand why you guys like hard content honest. It's just not fair to have two modes for heroic raiders and nothing for normal raiders.
    So you refuse to look at it from a different perspective. That is all you had to say. I'm done with you enjoy LFR. I'll be killing Ra-den and riding my new mount.

  9. #289
    The Insane Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    So you refuse to look at it from a different perspective. That is all you had to say. I'm done with you enjoy LFR
    No no no I get it. It's just not sustainable. I won't have fun in lfr thank you very much. In fact I will go log on now and have a bad time. Just for spite. The nerve of people telling me what I can and can't enjoy.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  10. #290
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    It appears to me clearing LFR makes some players think they are better then they actually are and inflate their self worth until they fail miserably at the most basic of mechanics or have pitiful output.
    It appears to me playing video games makes some people think they are better then they actually are and inflate their self worth until they fail miserably at the most basic challenges in real life.

  11. #291
    Deleted
    How much more easier can you make LFR?

  12. #292
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    No no no I get it. It's just not sustainable. I won't have fun in lfr thank you very much. In fact I will go log on now and have a bad time. Just for spite. The nerve of people telling me what I can and can't enjoy.
    Gotta do Durumu for my Titan stone roll and pet chance on Animus for free money. Maybe I'll see you and you can get a piggyback.

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-09 at 06:50 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    How much more easier can you make LFR?
    0 Mechanics? Boss just lays on the ground like a hunter using FD

    ---------- Post added 2013-05-09 at 06:51 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by thevoicefromwithin View Post
    It appears to me playing video games makes some people think they are better then they actually are and inflate their self worth until they fail miserably at the most basic challenges in real life.
    I'm confused I take pride in everything i do in and out of game. Strawman arguments seem to be the norm around here though.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-05-09 at 06:52 PM.

  13. #293
    normals should be easy, heroics should be hard.

    yes, normals are easy if you are used to heroics, but I mean they should be a stepping stone to heroic. stuff like guilds stuck on garalon/etc shouldnt happen. ideally, normal would be a quick process for the average guild, and then put up brick walls in heroic.

    imo, normals are harder than they have been in the past. LFR is part of the reason I think. another reason is the shitty tuning of these raids. terrace is a joke compared to heart of fear, and the first half of ToT is harder than the second half (minus jinrokh, thats a freebie).

  14. #294
    Uhhhhh have you done heroics? They ARE a stepping stone now.

    harder then second half you say. Comere I wanna introduce you to animus, consorts, Durumu, and Lei Shien heroic. They will kill you so badly your character will jump back to level 85 with perma rez sickness.

    Would you like to know why they are so much harder on heroic then normal? Because the mechanics are EASY and TRIVIAL on normal mode which is tuned for non heroic players.

    If it's not trivial enough you need to get a better raid leader and everyone needs to learn to do the fight properly.

    If that brief time doing that one time for a 6 month content cycle raid is too much. Then guess what. LFR is your option. Don't like that? L2P. Can't L2P? Looks like some players chose to quit to me. Hopefully more follow that logic and do the same.

    Hell 5.3 gives you yet ANOTHER gearing path. Don't like LFR RNG? Go grind your brains out in battlefield barrens for guaranteed 502 gear.
    Last edited by anaxie; 2013-05-09 at 07:02 PM.

  15. #295
    Quote Originally Posted by Injin View Post
    If normal mode was aimed at the average player, another mode would not be needed.

    The issue with raiding at the moment is best summed up like thus -

    Too

    Many

    Mechanics

    Wow is up against Millers magic number and cannot win.
    Oh wow thank you for this. I'm happy to know I'm not alone feeling this way, and also I hadn't heard of Millers magic number - damned fascinating stuff. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mag...s_or_Minus_Two No wonder I start to feel crosseyed trying to keep track of everything. Lei Shen felt like the superbowl of stacking and spreading. Heroic what's his name (first boss) is just annoying. I hate any time I have to dance. I hated the tornadoes in the firelands, and I hate them in Iron Qon, and I hate them here.

  16. #296
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    Then what do you care if they make it piss easy for everybody? I'd love to know why somebody who doesn't raid, hasn't actually participated in the content feels that he or she thinks it's fair to tell otehrs to wait for it to be nerfed.
    Because I'm in the same exact boat as him (unwilling to play scheduled, etc). The difference is that I accept that I'm not willing to do the required things to participate in modes beyond LFR, so why would I ask the game to be catered any further to me?

  17. #297
    i mean normals are more demanding than in the past for guilds that dont overgear it. of course it's easy to walk into ToT in 517 gear and faceroll it.

  18. #298
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    Getting a High paying job should be reduced in difficulty.
    Raising a family should be reduced in difficulty.
    Can you fix my car or should i turn easy mode on.
    I want you to think a little bit about what you wrote there.

    Imagine that it were actually possible to nerf the difficulty of the difficult things in life.

    It would be UTTERLY MONSTROUS not to do so.

    Can you imagine someone saying, "Yeah, granny's dying of cancer. Suck it up and stop being so casual" if that person could actually nerf cancer?
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
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  19. #299
    The Insane Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Because I'm in the same exact boat as him (unwilling to play scheduled, etc). The difference is that I accept that I'm not willing to do the required things to participate in modes beyond LFR, so why would I ask the game to be catered any further to me?
    because why should you accept any less? you've got to be kidding me with this. First of all I don't think the majority of players should be accepting of less. Let's turn this on it's head. Let's say tmmrw everything is made easier would you then by the same expectation say well things shouldn't be made hard to cater to them? Are you just okay with whatever or is their a distinction between hard and easy. LFR doesn't cater to you unless your a bad. Their is no difficulty that caters to you. That is appropriate to your ability or skill. LFR is not a difficulty.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  20. #300
    See, this is why we cant have good things. Introduce LFR,players want a "easy mode". If easy mode was to happen it would not take long before we read posts here about someone wanting super easy mode.

    Maybe we should just do this :

    LFR - Super Easy Normal - Easy Normal - Normal - Hard Normal - Easy Heroic - Heroic - Hard Heroic - Megaultra hard Heroic.

    I cant believe people still are bitching about difficult levels for raiding. We got ultra easy mode LFR, normal and heroic mode. It's more than enough. it's disturbing seeing people actually want this.

    The real issue for blizzard to focus on is the servers. With low pop realms with few decent raiders, its hard to PUG. On my realm its rare to see pugs being made(in trade). I tried to join several, but it takes so long to get 10 decent people for this..
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