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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Argyn View Post
    They won't kill off Sylvanas that quickly. She'll become a villain in the end though, with the new forsaken, use of the plague and torture of Koltira they're setting her up that way. Just wait and see, next expansion we'll be introduced to a new character who'll eventually become her replacement. Or an existing character who she raises after death.

    We already have the new leader of the Forsaken jumping around...

    Lillian Voss anyone?

  2. #142
    The Unstoppable Force Arrashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonheart327 View Post
    We already have the new leader of the Forsaken jumping around...

    Lillian Voss anyone?
    Isnt she dead ? For like second time now ? Or should i go back to scholomance and introduce her to miss. armored feet ?

  3. #143
    The Insane Aquamonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    The simple fact with Lordaeron is that both factions have people who lived there who want it back. Both with slam the other for their own reasons and then butt heads. Shame how people have a habit of disagreeing on it .
    In the end unless Calia Menethil decides to show her face both factions will claim it for themselves.

    I don't know where you're getting the idea that the Alliance wants to wipe them out though.
    Sylvanas' short story has the Wrynn invading Undercity in the future where Sylvanas never returns from ICC. Even without Sylvanas' recent actions and the Forsaken army being destroyed during Garrosh's suicidal order at Gilneas, the Alliance wipes out the Forsaken.

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-22 at 12:15 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by delus View Post
    Yeah, that is probably the reason why the cdev states they just kill those who don't join.
    Except the game shows otherwise on multiple occasions.
    Last edited by Aquamonkey; 2013-06-22 at 07:19 PM.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Darmalus View Post
    Horde needs a Do/Do Not Resurrect Me As A Forsaken thing on our dog tags.
    I think it would conveniently go missing. "DNR? There was no DNR on that corpse!"

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Except the game shows otherwise on multiple occasions.
    You mean the occasions previous to her getting shot in the face? Yeah... whatever dude.

  6. #146
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leonheart327 View Post
    We already have the new leader of the Forsaken jumping around...

    Lillian Voss anyone?
    Shes a play on the Magic: The gathering Liliana Vess. I do wish she was a more important character, but through the Scarlet Monastery quests and Scholomance quests You see she has no allegiances, and that, like Vess, she is in it for herself. SM for far more powerful weapons. Scholo to destroy necromancy, yet she tells you to leave her, so she can run off into the shadows again. What they have her doing is not Forsaken, rather, she hates everyone and only in it for herself. Shes in it for vengence. But Lillian can become a central role if they really work the story in her favor, but as she is now, the way she is written, she cannot become the Queen of Undercity.

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by delus View Post
    You mean the occasions previous to her getting shot in the face? Yeah... whatever dude.
    And what does Sylvanas dying and getting res'ed again have to do with anything?

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Arothand View Post
    I think it would conveniently go missing. "DNR? There was no DNR on that corpse!"
    "ehh... actually, there was DRN on my corpse."
    "shut up, jimmy! you are still confused from the whole ressurection process. go rest outside, or something."
    Warlorcs of Draenorc made me quit. You can't have my stuff.

  9. #149
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Sylvanas' short story has the Wrynn invading Undercity in the future where Sylvanas never returns from ICC. Even without Sylvanas' recent actions and the Forsaken army being destroyed during Garrosh's suicidal order at Gilneas, the Alliance wipes out the Forsaken.
    No they don't. The Forsaken kill themselves rather than become the Alliance PoW.
    All you've provided a source of is the Alliance defeating them in a military engagement. It says absolutely nothing about the Alliance wanting to "wipe them out". As far as your source shows the Alliance counter attacked Horde aggression to the point where they were able to capture the Forsakens capital.

    That's how war works. It doesn't mean they wanted to wipe them out. I'm not trying to invoke Godwin's law of any sort, but just because in WW2 the Allies captured Berlin did not mean they wanted to wipe out the enemy.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    No they don't. The Forsaken kill themselves rather than become the Alliance PoW.
    All you've provided a source of is the Alliance defeating them in a military engagement. It says absolutely nothing about the Alliance wanting to "wipe them out". As far as your source shows the Alliance counter attacked Horde aggression to the point where they were able to capture the Forsakens capital.

    That's how war works. It doesn't mean they wanted to wipe them out. I'm not trying to invoke Godwin's law of any sort, but just because in WW2 the Allies captured Berlin did not mean they wanted to wipe out the enemy.
    At this point I doubt they would spare the forsaken, they think by killing them, they release the Forsaken from their torment. There are enough quests to indicate this mindset concerning the undead. Take Varian for example

    Do you know how many ranger lords exist in this world? How many human ranger lords have ever existed?
    Nathanos' accomplishments were unprecedented. He was a tactical genius, responsible for Alliance victories spanning a decade of conflict.
    And now... the champion of the Forsaken.
    No. This cannot be. Order must be restored.
    Gather an army, <name>. Return to the Plagues with your army and destroy the Blightcaller.
    I wish you luck, <name>. Truly, you will need it for this battle.


    It is a tragedy. I think... I believe that our kind is cursed, <name>. We are cursed to lose our greatest warriors; our most noble heroes; our most gifted scholars.
    We are indebted to you and I assure you, <name>, wherever Nathanos Marris is now, he smiles down upon you.
    Though we both know Nathanos wouldn't agree with that assessment.

  11. #151
    The Insane Aquamonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    No they don't. The Forsaken kill themselves rather than become the Alliance PoW.
    All you've provided a source of is the Alliance defeating them in a military engagement. It says absolutely nothing about the Alliance wanting to "wipe them out". As far as your source shows the Alliance counter attacked Horde aggression to the point where they were able to capture the Forsakens capital.

    That's how war works. It doesn't mean they wanted to wipe them out. I'm not trying to invoke Godwin's law of any sort, but just because in WW2 the Allies captured Berlin did not mean they wanted to wipe out the enemy.
    They weren't afraid of being taken as PoWs.

    The few Forsaken who remain are throwing themselves into the bonfires, she realized, rather than facing their executioners. --Edge of Night

  12. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    At this point I doubt they would spare the forsaken, they think by killing them, they release the Forsaken from their torment. There are enough quests to indicate this mindset concerning the undead. Take Varian for example

    Though we both know Nathanos wouldn't agree with that assessment.
    The fact that they allowed DK's into the Alliance shows this not to be the case though.

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    The fact that they allowed DK's into the Alliance shows this not to be the case though.
    Not Quite

    <Varian stares off into the distance.>
    Indeed old friend... Blood and honor.
    <Varian affixes his gaze upon you.>
    Were it not for this letter from Tirion, you would be a stain upon my floor. Only an endorsement from one of the greatest paladins to ever live could have ensured your survival.
    We... We will work together against the Scourge. Against the Lich King!
    GLORY TO THE ALLIANCE!
    This time there is no Tirion to stop him.

  14. #154
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    They weren't afraid of being taken as PoWs.

    The few Forsaken who remain are throwing themselves into the bonfires, she realized, rather than facing their executioners. --Edge of Night
    Do note that was a thought by Sylvanas. She had no idea what the Alliance would've intended for them.

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-22 at 09:36 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Not Quite

    This time there is no Tirion to stop him.
    Doesn't change the fact that they were allowed in. They were given a chance because of the words of Tyrion. Varian did not have to give it to them, but he did.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post

    Doesn't change the fact that they were allowed in. They were given a chance because of the words of Tyrion. Varian did not have to give it to them, but he did.
    Because someone like Tirion vouched for them, otherwise he would have killed them without batting an eye. Who will vouch for the forsaken, who just recently waged wars and unleashed a plague at the wrathgate? No one and as such he would most likely do what he had done to the death knight if it hadn't been for that letter. If Tirion would have been there I might concur, but Varian on his own assaulting undercity is a death sentence for the forsaken.

  16. #156
    What is Sylvanas was a being of light like a Naaru, that went around and raised dead bodies into living again bodies of light? Then how would you feel?

  17. #157
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    Because someone like Tirion vouched for them, otherwise he would have killed them without batting an eye. Who will vouch for the forsaken, who just recently waged wars and unleashed a plague at the wrathgate? No one and as such he would most likely do what he had done to the death knight if it hadn't been for that letter. If Tirion would have been there I might concur, but Varian on his own assaulting undercity is a death sentence for the forsaken.
    Because Tirion had to vouch for a Death Knight. Nobody has to vouch for the Forsaken, they are not joining the faction. The Alliance know there are good Undead out there and at the same time show an awareness to the influence a leader can have on a race such as Sylvanas.

    But as I mentioned there is no source that claims it's in the Alliance's interests to wipe them out.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    Because Tirion had to vouch for a Death Knight. Nobody has to vouch for the Forsaken, they are not joining the faction. The Alliance know there are good Undead out there and at the same time show an awareness to the influence a leader can have on a race such as Sylvanas.

    But as I mentioned there is no source that claims it's in the Alliance's interests to wipe them out.
    It is the very mindset of humans, they don't really see forsaken as people, they are monsters, unnatural things that only brought them pain and loss. You see this mindset several times in books and in quests. Killing them is nothing bad, it is doing them a favor, the forsaken mindset has become exactly the same considering resurrection, they are two sides of the same coin.

  19. #159
    I am Murloc! Scummer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Combatbulter View Post
    It is the very mindset of humans, they don't really see forsaken as people, they are monsters, unnatural things that only brought them pain and loss. You see this mindset several times in books and in quests. Killing them is nothing bad, it is doing them a favor, the forsaken mindset has become exactly the same considering resurrection, they are two sides of the same coin.
    Oh no I don't deny they loathe them. Doesn't mean they will wipe them out though. If the imprisonment of the Orcs is anything to go by then given the choice the Alliance would rather lock them up than have further blood on their hands. The Orcs were alien monsters hell bent on killing them and weren't culled, I'd say that favours the notion of not wiping out the Forsaken.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Scummer View Post
    Oh no I don't deny they loathe them. Doesn't mean they will wipe them out though. If the imprisonment of the Orcs is anything to go by then given the choice the Alliance would rather lock them up than have further blood on their hands. The Orcs were alien monsters hell bent on killing them and weren't culled, I'd say that favours the notion of not wiping out the Forsaken.
    The orcs were still living though, they had children and a future so to speak. Something humans could relate to, they might have been aliens but they were still natural, forsaken on the other hand have nothing like that, they are walking corpses, that slaughtered them and can't have children, they have a choice indeed lock them up for decades or centuries, spending enormous sums on something that isn't alive or restore order.

    I might look to deep into it, but I seriously doubt humanity would spare the forsaken, if they had the chance.

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