Which cloak for prot?

[Deleted]

pally tanks already have a myriad of defensive cds - i really dont think we "need" another, particularly one out of our control that, as mentioned, in all likelihood would only delay your inevitable death by a few GCDs (heck if you've already "died" once then something's not going to plan....)

the dps cloak proc IS always useful as several people have already mentioned.

Blizz has already given us plenty of tools to survive - we really dont need any more in our current state. Stand in fire, moar deeps.

---------- Post added 2013-07-02 at 09:47 AM ----------

It'd be funny if the cloak you take determines which legendary buff you get and all these tanks taking the DPS cloak were stuck with the DPS buff. I highly doubt Blizzard would do that, but it'd be funny none the less.

this is what we want tbh

i dont want the "tank" legendary buff

[Viradiance]

Not read the whole thread but... Gotta chime in on this.

What about taking the Tank cloak for vengeance scumming? Say, on Ji-kun's Talon Rake. If you want to take extra stacks for vengeance, that's an entire extra stack. Let it build up until the hit will be powerful enough to kill you, then you don't even have to pop a CD, other tank taunts off, and you start battle healing or cranking out the DPS.

At least, that's why I plan to use the tank cloak. Exploiting stacking debuffs <3

[Deleted]

Not read the whole thread but... Gotta chime in on this.

What about taking the Tank cloak for vengeance scumming? Say, on Ji-kun's Talon Rake. If you want to take extra stacks for vengeance, that's an entire extra stack. Let it build up until the hit will be powerful enough to kill you, then you don't even have to pop a CD, other tank taunts off, and you start battle healing or cranking out the DPS.

At least, that's why I plan to use the tank cloak. Exploiting stacking debuffs <3

After spirit kings they changed so that overkills does not give you vengeance.

[Nairobi]

It'd be funny if the cloak you take determines which legendary buff you get and all these tanks taking the DPS cloak were stuck with the DPS buff. I highly doubt Blizzard would do that, but it'd be funny none the less.

You say stuck, as if most every good tank in here is not lobbying to use the DPS cloak 99.99% of the time. We don't want the tank cloak, just like we don't want the tank meta. Blizz never understands this, and keeps giving shit procs and itemization, because they refuse to give up on and/or acknowledge that dodge/parry, TDR, and proc-based reduction are piss-poor mechanics and metrics in the educated tanking realm.

After spirit kings they changed so that overkills does not give you vengeance.

I think most people don't realize this, because they see/hear people saying that they eat (point-blank) decap's on LS for massive veng, and don't realize the big vengeance comes from the following 100% dmg taken debuff.

[Deleted]

I think most people don't realize this, because they see/hear people saying that they eat (point-blank) decap's on LS for massive veng, and don't realize the big vengeance comes from the following 100% dmg taken debuff.

I just eat the full face decap + use /sit for the next 3-4 auto atttacks after decap. Vengeance

[-Skye]

During progression that proc can save you a raid cooldown or save you from death if someone messes up/the healing is tight, that makes it worth more than the DPS one imo.

[Deleted]

During progression that proc can save you a raid cooldown or save you from death if someone messes up/the healing is tight, that makes it worth more than the DPS one imo.

During progression the dps proc can save the entire raid by killing an add before it casts a spell or something and it can also amke and break an entire encounter making the difference between wipe and kill.

Not to mention that the stats on the dps cloak can also possibly save you from death / the stats on the tank cloak can possibly cause deaths that would not happen otherwise.

I rather take a good itemized item with an useful proc over a terribly itemized item that may or may not possibly provide a small help.

[Deathgoose]

Personally, I'd take the DPS cloak. Two juicy stats stats at all time compared to only one, and even if Crit is just a pure DPS stat, it can can be reforged into Hit/Exp to unload that elsewhere for more Haste/Mastery. And as others have said, people have been doing progression long before the tank proc, and they will be doing it long after (You have to know it will be nerfed if used by a player over level 90. They love to do that shit. ) And it isn't like the DPS cloak buff is entirely useless, unless your raid doesn't factor in tank DPS at all.

Plus, if you have a Ret offspec, you're ready to go with your cloak with just a spec swap without being saddled with Dodge/Parry and a pretty useless tank proc.

[Nillo]

We got a 40% magic reducing shield wall on a 30 sec cd, I'd sill choose the dps cloak, even in that extreme scenario...

There are some abilities where a 30sec cd still isn't enough (and you need more than 40% red to survive)

[Lonerteey]

There are some abilities where a 30sec cd still isn't enough (and you need more than 40% red to survive)

Could you give me an example please?

[Nillo]

Could you give me an example please?

Dark Animus Massives and Twins both end up dealing way too much damage and their abilities are on about a 20 sec cd.

For some other tank classes horridon also falls into this category.

[Lonerteey]

Checking your armory it seems we both killed Animus and Consorts, we both survived it multiple times, and if we both can do it then every1 else can do it aswell (without 30 sec magic shieldwall since its not live yet)

And this is a paladin discussion, so i guess we can just skip horridon. (for dks and warriors I'd most likely take the tank cloak anyway)

[celinamuna]

I just eat the full face decap + use /sit for the next 3-4 auto atttacks after decap. Vengeance

Btw they nerfed /sit :>

And to the previous poster, w/e amount of extra veng you're going to get, isn't going to out perform dps cloak buff.

[kynthrus]

Yes, and using that logic everyone in the raid should get the tank one.

Good idea, I've already informed everyone in my guild that they must get the tank one. now we are invincible.

[Deleted]

Btw they nerfed /sit :>

Yeah, well not yet. It is nerfed in 5.4

[celinamuna]

Yeah, well not yet. It is nerfed in 5.4

Ohh snap, didn't realize it was ptr notes and not hotfix.

[Deleted]

Im not going to explain it to you fully, but Haste and Mastery are both MUCH better survival stats for a prot paladin then either dodge or parry. You can also reforge the crit to hit or exp. Allowing the haste /mastery to go untouched.

This is exactly why I ask. Survival standpoint, haste and master > dodge or parry. If none of the mechanics will realistically even proc the defense of the tanking one, itd be waisted pretty much.

If none of the mechanics would proc the tank proc its because you ARENT DIEING in which case ALL stats are irrelevant

[rhandric]

If none of the mechanics would proc the tank proc its because you ARENT DIEING in which case ALL stats are irrelevant

If you're not dying that means you're doing your job well (or your healers are), which is helped more by haste and than by dodge and parry.

[Pickwickman]

So far in PTR testing I can only think of one fight the tank cloak can be useful, and that is taking two hits of Immerseus' frontal nuke (600k magic dmg on normal, probably 1m in heroic). And while there it might be useful, on other fights I doubt you will get hit that hard as far as we can see now.

'Small' hits devalue the tank proc, since negating a 100k melee and then getting hit for anything after that will kill you anyway (DoT or ground effect) so that makes the tank cloak useless.

And I am still waiting to see if it saves you from ALL damage sources, and not just physical, for if it is physical, the dps cloak wins by a large margin seeing more SotR will be immensely more useful.

[celinamuna]

So far in PTR testing I can only think of one fight the tank cloak can be useful, and that is taking two hits of Immerseus' frontal nuke (600k magic dmg on normal, probably 1m in heroic). And while there it might be useful, on other fights I doubt you will get hit that hard as far as we can see now.

'Small' hits devalue the tank proc, since negating a 100k melee and then getting hit for anything after that will kill you anyway (DoT or ground effect) so that makes the tank cloak useless.

And I am still waiting to see if it saves you from ALL damage sources, and not just physical, for if it is physical, the dps cloak wins by a large margin seeing more SotR will be immensely more useful.

Haven't had the chance to even look/test but are you suppose to take 2 hits of it ? and is it 300 & 300 or 600 & 600 on normal ?