[Holy] Patch 5.4 PTR - Changes Discussion Pt. 2

[PosPosPos]

Except I think you're forgetting to realize that overhealing with EF is a GOOD thing with the legendary cloak. I'll overheal all day with EF and that cloak, go ahead and snipe that healing, because then that leaves my EF to do ~30 seconds of overhealing, which is fantastic with the cloak.

It's a proc. Which means it's random. It's the same reasoning why hpallys avoid crit like the plague, even though it's numerically superior to mastery and haste.

If it procs, it's a nice bonus, but never rely on something random to achieve results in a pinch.

[Lucyrotten]

It's a proc that's doing substantial healing on PTR right now. If the number were insignificant I'd agree with you but seeing 10-12% (and sometimes more) isn't unusual at all.

[Lumineux]

It's a proc. Which means it's random. It's the same reasoning why hpallys avoid crit like the plague, even though it's numerically superior to mastery and haste.

If it procs, it's a nice bonus, but never rely on something random to achieve results in a pinch.

You're just being silly. Have you seen how much healing the cloak is currently doing on PTR? It's definitely something that can be relied on. No you shouldn't be "relying" on it to heal the tank in a pinch, that would just be stupid. But you can rely on it to do a decent amount of healing if you're overhealing with EF hots.

[Deleted]

You're just being silly. Have you seen how much healing the cloak is currently doing on PTR? It's definitely something that can be relied on.

Anything that's not there a majority of the time and isn't controllable cannot be relied on, it will only be up 1/6th of the time which is not reliable.

[Lumineux]

Anything that's not there a majority of the time and isn't controllable cannot be relied on, it will only be up 1/6th of the time which is not reliable.

Says the monk who's going to be getting an insane amount of healing from the cloak...?

But thanks for clearing that up for me Reglitch, I should be calling on you when I need to know all things pally I suppose. Glad to see you're back.

What I'm saying is that overhealing shouldn't be necessarily looked at as a bad thing this next patch. Especially since originally the cloak looked to be pretty mediocre for holy paladins (seeing how most of our healing is absorbs) but with EF being buffed and healing for a lot, and potentially overhealing a lot, that makes the cloak better for us.

[Kyuuseishu]

We are. They've as much as said we are. There's a reason we're going to be able to log in and have it in a half an hour.

Which is depressing really, will be a fun balancing pass post SoO.

[Lumineux]

Not sure if anyone else saw this yet or not but:

Holy: Sacred Shield now applies its damage absorption shield immediately, can be active on more than one target at a time, but the talent now costs mana and has 3 charges with a 10-second recharge.

Decent change. It's the talent I've always wanted to take but couldn't because it was crap. I don't think this is a game breaking change but it fixes one of the complaints about SS (not absorbing right away). We'll see where they go with numbers.

[Kyuuseishu]

I find it odd that they reduced the effectiveness of Sacred Shield by 30% for both ret and prot, but the change for holy is certainly a positive one.

EDIT: On a side note, Revival did receive a 30% nerf.

[nightfalls]

I find it odd that they reduced the effectiveness of Sacred Shield by 30% for both ret and prot, but the change for holy is certainly a positive one.

For self-healing the talent was pretty much required for them. OP will be updated about... now?

[Kyuuseishu]

For self-healing the talent was pretty much required for them. OP will be updated about... now?

Well I don't think nerfing it for prot will make them change their mind ^^ but either way, the PTR realms need to get themselves online!

[Floopa]

I find it odd that they reduced the effectiveness of Sacred Shield by 30% for both ret and prot, but the change for holy is certainly a positive one.

EDIT: On a side note, Revival did receive a 30% nerf.

Monks aren't really batting an eye-lid about the Revival nerf (it was expected and it really doesn't accomplish anything than reducing the overhealing value).

The SS change is good: almost works like a PW:S I guess?

[jincuteguy]

I find it odd that they reduced the effectiveness of Sacred Shield by 30% for both ret and prot, but the change for holy is certainly a positive one.

EDIT: On a side note, Revival did receive a 30% nerf.

You sure Revival for Mistweaver got 30% nerf?

[Kyuuseishu]

You sure Revival for Mistweaver got 30% nerf?

Check the official patch notes updated for 2nd August, its there.

Sacred Shield is quite a long way off working like PW:S ^^, it just makes more sense for the absorb to be applied initially rather than 1 tick in, don't know why it wasn't applied earlier.

[Floopa]

Check the official patch notes updated for 2nd August, its there.

Sacred Shield is quite a long way off working like PW:S ^^, it just makes more sense for the absorb to be applied initially rather than 1 tick in, don't know why it wasn't applied earlier.

I agree, the absorb should always have been applied ASAP. Weird it wasn't.

[Corrupt]

Monks aren't really batting an eye-lid about the Revival nerf (it was expected and it really doesn't accomplish anything than reducing the overhealing value).

The SS change is good: almost works like a PW:S I guess?

I would say there isnt much in common besides theyre both absorbs and that they last X amount of seconds without you being able to refresh the absorb.

But PW:S is alot stronger as it absorbs alot more during a damage spike, cost less, is affected by mastery and it can be critical.. Probably also easier to avoid OH with it. And ofcourse its more likely it save someone then our SS due to the big difference in the intial absorb.
Last but not least its cheaper! And every 12s they can gain back the whole cost of one..

Back on topic, atleast theyre making it more interesting for each patch now. But it need to scale with mastery and crit!

[Kyuuseishu]

@Corrupt, I will correct you on one thing, it isn't cheaper ^^, Sacred Shield is 16% base mana, roughly the cost of a holy shock with is 9.6k, PW:S is 13.725k when Disc. Nothing major just technicalities ^_^

But yes, it would be nice if it did indeed scale with mastery, not sure about crit, just scaling with mastery would be fine.

[Corrupt]

Hmm somehow I got into my mind SS cost 16k per use

Seems the change isnt live on PTR yet. Still takes 5s before first application. Curious tho, does this mean we get another tick or will it end up being 5 seconds shorter?

[Dubalicious]

Hmm somehow I got into my mind SS cost 16k per use

Seems the change isnt live on PTR yet. Still takes 5s before first application. Curious tho, does this mean we get another tick or will it end up being 5 seconds shorter?

Ends up being the same amount of ticks only the new SS procs a shield upon cast, whereas the old SS proc'd a shield upon fading

[Deleted]

SS change quite interesting. I'd prefer if it cost 1hp instead of mana though.

[Deleted]

SS change quite interesting. I'd prefer if it cost 1hp instead of mana though.

It would be more hps to run without any tier 45 talent than to pick SS if it would cost HP instead of mana.