Please no more!

[Elexo]

I didn't even hate Cata all that strongly, but it was so far still worse than MoP.
Cata's revamped 1-60 was amazing and the first tier of raiding was very enjoyable for me, always liked Cho'gall. The second tier I think we can all agree was pretty good as well with a near perfect difficulty I believe, though I personaly couldn't stand the zone itself as it just hurt my eyes over time due to all the fire, I still acknowledge it was pretty good.
But the ZG/ZA rehash, 80-85 zones and DS fiasco make it the worst expansion for me by far.

MoP has the war theme which I really like and I think Garrosh is pretty neat. 85-90 is better than 80-85 but only barely, heck in some zones I concider it worse and the dungeon selection is abysmal.
Pandaria itself and the Pandaren don't suit me at all, Asian themes in general just aren't my thing so I find it hard to give an unbiased opinion on the zones, but for me, they were horrible.
Mogu'shan's palace had a few cool encounters, as did Heart of Fear, but half or more of the encounters were really bland and dull.
ToT is good, bit of a steep difficulty curve early on but it's a good raid, on par with Firelands but not quite Ulduar.

Not a big fan of the filler patches to say it as kindly as I can. Dailies have never been my bag.
PvP has just gotten worse every expansion, not trying to be the typical ''it used to be better in TBC'' guy but that's genuinely how I feel.
The new maps feel pretty awfull and arena just keeps getting more one sided.

I got high hopes for the raid on Orgrimmar for some reason, despite the fact I should know better by now it looks pretty good.

All in all, MoP isn't the worst thing ever but it's without a doubt subpar in many regions and after many years of experience I expect more from Blizzard. Maybe next expac, ey?

[Manabomb]

So we all know that MoP has officially lost 1.3 Million players. It's story line is bottom of the barrel. It's content is saddening. At the start of the expansion we saw mind numbing dailies and rng. Then the crz crisis. We saw the stream lining of lfr. We still have yet to receive new 5 man instances, even thought the majority of players are asking for them. Now Blizzard is adding a cash shop and connected servers. This can only be to recoup the massive subscription losses this expansion.

Okay, well first of all your opinion of the story being bottom barrel is of course your opinion. I've seen thousands of worse stories being forced through the wire of mmorpgs, and MoP (DISCLAIMER, I do not now, or in the future claim that Pandaren strict story-lines are "good". They are a waste of time and effort, and the only good storylines in MoP are the ones involving no Pandaren or when Pandaren are not the focus. Now with this aside.) is not a bad story. We have the rise and fall of a dictator, a rebellion. While it is indeed basic story telling and is basically spoon fed to the community that takes things like data mining for granted, it doesn't detract from the fact that is indeed a -okay- story.

On the content side of the things, I promptly disagree with you completely. ToT was been a breath of fresh air since the whatever t14 content was (trying to be like t11, but then raid finder happened and made multi raid tiers irrelevant). Siege of Orgrimmar is looking real promising as well. The quality of the time spent making unique encounters as well as unique art styles, settings and mechanics have doubled since cataclysm, and it shows if you decide to take a second and look hard enough. Lfr is here to stay, continue to balk at it all you want, it is something that this game has needed to keep the casual masses interested at endgame. As for 5 mans? When it's easier, cheaper and makes more sense to make scenarios and Hscenarios and to save 5 mans for "start of the expansion fodder" then more power imo. Comparing the generally fun 4.0 cata launch heroics to the depressing roflaoe fests that were 4.3 "catchup" 5 mans leaves no contest at which I personally enjoyed more. And "the majority of players asking for them".... what? If the majority of players were seriously getting up and crying to Blizzard about 5 mans, THEY WOULD MAKE MORE 5 MANS. Imagine that.

Now the cash shop and Crz are the only things I agree with you as serious wastes of time and effort on Blizzards part to 1. Artificially fill an "empty world" with drones to make your day just peachy keen competing for crafting resources, rare items, rare pets and those other perks you specifically rolled on a low pop realm for.... And 2, to make even more gracious amounts of money than they need (1.1 billion sitting around to buy vivendi majority stock, GUESS THEY NEED TO MAKE THAT BACK QUICK) especially considering how a lot of the t16 sets look like garbage compared to these wonderful helms, and for 25$ you can have your own!! Yay!! Capitalism!!

I end this paragraph in saying connected servers should have been what crz was, and should have released with next expansion, not subjugating all of mop with a half assed version of connected servers known as crz.

It's at this point I have to ask...When is enough, really enough. We have saw for ourselves that mass casual play, is not working. However neither is mass hardcore play. When will we have the much needed middle ground? When will Blizzard begin to take a real notice to so many serious issues. Since the start of MoP my 25 man guild has dropped in membership. At MoP start we had over 400 members and 3 25 man teams. That didn't last. Players quit left and right. Most leaving due to being unhappy with the state of the game and the poor changes. Leaving the game, and not returning. We are now down to one 10 man group. We barely get by sometimes. I am not a hardcore player by any means. However I also do not consider myself casual. I understand the need for both types of players. However our guild recruitment has dropped off. The quality of players has dropped off as well. New recruits standing in boss aoe abilities, and saying it wasn't their fault. That they did in lfr.

Well, yeah. We do need a middle ground. A ground where players of all skill levels can raid. A ground where everyone has access to the end game content. A sense of equality. Those with far more skill going on to accomplish more difficult and challenging modes and those who do not stay behind and play at the difficulty that suits them. Wait... that sounds familiar.... Sarcasm aside, we have a middle ground. Problem is, casuals don't like exclusivity of any kind and hardcores don't like casualization of any kind. Think democrats and republicans, the only times you will get a bipartisan compromise is on trivial matters next to no one cares about.

I'm sorry to hear about your guild falling apart, and I can sympathize because the same thing happened to my 10 man guild just as we were progressing lei shen. This sort of leads back to the problems with lfr (If you couldn't tell, I didn't praise lfr in my earlier post because it's not a perfect system) and the fact that it takes players that would be -willing- to raid normal-heroic modes and allows them to see the content without them giving a kind of commitment, as will flex raiding. While it does seem to make raiding seem less popular, atleast on my own server there are guilds recruiting 24/7, but I live on a PvE hub, so I guess that's a plus.

Ladies and gentlemen.....the game has been dumbed down to the point it is blindly obvious. If the next expansion goes even more casual...I fear for my favorite game.

I will not deny that the game lacks depth, but in my opinion beyond confusing spell applications and rank 1'ing spells during vanilla, tbc and wotlk, it never really had depth before either. All in all, what attracted people to wow originally is the concept of a game world you can connect with your friends on such a massive scale that wasn't everquest.

So any how I'd like to hear from other gm's or guild leaders. Are you having the same issues? As a die hard World of Warcraft fan...I'm trying to stay strong and true to the game. However it's becoming VERY hard.

I tried to quit the game myself this month, but a friend payed for my subscription so I could continue to RP. I've been losing faith in the intelligence of the developers and the community because of things like accepting the cash store and item squish, as well as "vengeance tuning".

Please note I never said anything I said was a fact. My post is simply my opinions and take on things currently. The issues with the game I listed, are reasons given to my guild for players quitting the game and the most complained about topics on our guild website. If you are here to troll, harass, or just make mind numbing replies....please don't waste anyone times. These are merely opinions and nothing more.

My responses in red, I don't mean to offend, I'm just trying to point out a few things.

[ComputerNerd]

MoP is the expansion with the most losses in WoW history. With a loss of almost 1.5 million players total world wide. MoP was voted by mmogamer the most disliked expansion in WoW history.

And people have said the worst about everything since Vanilla.
"Officially" nothing.
There are many reasons for losses, reasons which many like yourself choose very deliberately to ignore.

[Deleted]

Mists is my favourite expansion as can be seen by it being the first one where I have got the loremaster meta because I enjoyed the non linear questing ( you could choose different story lines to follow, to break up the main quest), and absolutely amazing zones, I mean seriously, jade forest is beautiful, I was actually amazed when I first stepped into it months and months ago, and exalted with all the factions, because unlike a lot of people on here I enjoyed the dailys, they felt like they were leading to something, the golden lotus, shado-pan and klaxxi in particular. that said id have liked a bigger conclusion to the august celestials daily hub. Battlefeild - barren is only part of the expac I haven't enjoyed fully, this is due to having it fully done in a day, while the dynamic events were good, and cannot wait until the timeless isle.

It caters for both the casual and hard core player, heroic raids are harder than ever, and challenge mode dungeons are very challenging (if going for gold/silver). We are getting better, and bigger raids because they are more accessible, pet battles are a fun way to do while on down time and im glad they are getting continued support. and the introduction of AOE looting, account wide mounts/pets are excellent QoL additions this patch.

and the expansion started of very alt unfriendly, but at its current stage alts are easy and quick to level, and you can gear them up relatively quickly. this expansion, in my opinion is the best yet, it has flaws yes, but its greatness shines through

[Naposim1337]

Pandaria is very very good content-wise but setting just plain sucks. WLK was the best because the setting was awesome, it added LFR and there was good number of PUG's.

[Lord Blackmore]

In no way am I saying the feedback given on the Forums has no effect.

I think it has very little effect. For minor things, sure. But anything that Blizzard thinks affects revenue? No.
That shouldn't, IMO, deter people from providing feedback, however.

I'm just saying the forums aren't always a voice for the "majority".

Forums are almost never the voice of the majority. People who complain on forums are a) a self selected group of people who are into something enough to talk about it and b) the subset of people who have enough of an issue to complain. Unfortunately, too many people see "a lot" of people complaining about something and think it's "most" people.

---

BTW, I had hoped that the title of this thread "Please no more!" was about please no more complaint threads. I am, however, not suprised that it's just more of the same old, same old for MMO-C.

[wych]

I do love the constant mentioning of the "dumbing down" of the game.

Right now we have far more abilities, more classes and specs available and bosses with far more abilities.

Back in Vanilla bosses had 1-2 mechanics at most, and required only half the raid to even stay alive.

In TBC most bosses were really not difficult, bar a handful (Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Reliquary of Souls, Illidan and most of Sunwell which was designed to keep the hardcore happy until WOTLK). Most were just healing or DPS checks.

Not to mention back then I had ONE ability to use, right now i'm using a priority rotation of multiple abilities to maximise DPS whilst paying attention to the boss.

[Deleted]

Back in Vanilla bosses had 1-2 mechanics at most, and required only half the raid to even stay alive.

I see you never got past the 5 man dungeons. Please tell me how the Four Horsemen only had 1-2 mechanics at most, or Chromaggus, Nefarian, Ragnaros, C'thun? Heck, even Lucifron has more mechanics than 2. If you didn't raid back in vanilla please don't talk about it as if you did.

[wych]

I see you never got past the 5 man dungeons. Please tell me how the Four Horsemen only had 1-2 mechanics at most. Heck, even Lucifron has more mechanics than 2.

Ok, most bosses had 1-2 mechanics that you had to look out for.

My point is that in general, bosses now have a lot more to look out for and a lot more to pay attention to.

[Deleted]

Ok, most bosses had 1-2 mechanics that you had to look out for.

My point is that in general, bosses now have a lot more to look out for and a lot more to pay attention to.

Please compare new bosses to something like Chromaggus or Four Horsemen, the game hasn't become that much more complex, you just only remember the easy bosses.

[Sturmbringe]

So we all know that MoP has officially lost 1.3 Million players. It's story line is bottom of the barrel. It's content is saddening. At the start of the expansion we saw mind numbing dailies and rng. Then the crz crisis. We saw the stream lining of lfr. We still have yet to receive new 5 man instances, even thought the majority of players are asking for them. Now Blizzard is adding a cash shop and connected servers. This can only be to recoup the massive subscription losses this expansion.

It's at this point I have to ask...When is enough, really enough. We have saw for ourselves that mass casual play, is not working. However neither is mass hardcore play. When will we have the much needed middle ground? When will Blizzard begin to take a real notice to so many serious issues. Since the start of MoP my 25 man guild has dropped in membership. At MoP start we had over 400 members and 3 25 man teams. That didn't last. Players quit left and right. Most leaving due to being unhappy with the state of the game and the poor changes. Leaving the game, and not returning. We are now down to one 10 man group. We barely get by sometimes. I am not a hardcore player by any means. However I also do not consider myself casual. I understand the need for both types of players. However our guild recruitment has dropped off. The quality of players has dropped off as well. New recruits standing in boss aoe abilities, and saying it wasn't their fault. That they did in lfr.

Ladies and gentlemen.....the game has been dumbed down to the point it is blindly obvious. If the next expansion goes even more casual...I fear for my favorite game.

So any how I'd like to hear from other gm's or guild leaders. Are you having the same issues? As a die hard World of Warcraft fan...I'm trying to stay strong and true to the game. However it's becoming VERY hard.

The OP is 100% correct in their assessment and, if anything, far too lenient with MoP which is definitely the worst WoW expansion, if it is "Warcraft" at all. I am one of those 1,5-2 million who have quit MoP and I won't even bother looking back to what is basically, pandas & pokemon. I was one of the first to quit back in 2012. Even buying MoP (the box) was definitely a mistake. That money would have been better spent in my local charity.

P.S.: The same posters who now defend MoP as the best thing that has happened to humanity since penicillin, used to defend CATAFAIL on this very same board with the same passion and the same arguments. It is amusing that they now claim CATAFAIL to have been the worst expansion. It was "WoW's best expansion" according to them just one month prior to the launch of MoP. :-)

[-Superman-]

So we all know that MoP has officially lost 1.3 Million players.

It's lost almost twice that since the MoP launch in Sept 2012. Blizz boasted about 10.1M subscribers for the launch. Latest numbers show it at 7.7M. That means, in total, they've lost 2.4M players in less than 11 months. Not saying it is MoP's fault, since all launches start high and stabilize low. BUT, if by the end of MoP we are still below 7.8M, we can definitively show a slow, long-term loss based on trending.

It's story line is bottom of the barrel. It's content is saddening. At the start of the expansion we saw mind numbing dailies and rng. Then the crz crisis. We saw the stream lining of lfr. We still have yet to receive new 5 man instances, even thought the majority of players are asking for them. Now Blizzard is adding a cash shop and connected servers. This can only be to recoup the massive subscription losses this expansion.

It's at this point I have to ask...When is enough, really enough. We have saw for ourselves that mass casual play, is not working. However neither is mass hardcore play. When will we have the much needed middle ground? When will Blizzard begin to take a real notice to so many serious issues. Since the start of MoP my 25 man guild has dropped in membership. At MoP start we had over 400 members and 3 25 man teams. That didn't last. Players quit left and right. Most leaving due to being unhappy with the state of the game and the poor changes. Leaving the game, and not returning. We are now down to one 10 man group. We barely get by sometimes.

Something else to consider: Some times it is not the game that changes, but the real life around it. I do not doubt some of your people left because of the expansion, but without them here, your statement is purely anecdotal at best. We have no means by which to confirm your theory. Blizz sees the change and is introducing Flex Raiding to fill in the gap for people who want to raid, but cannot maintain a consistently sized raid team.

Please note I never said anything I said was a fact. My post is simply my opinions and take on things currently.

Everything said on this forum is an opinion. Anyone who tries to pass everything off as fact is either full of themself, or an insufferable know-it-all pedantic who cannot stand simple opinions. You are certainly entitled to yours. But, understand one thing, the way you presented your opinion borders closely as "speaking for all", and there are plenty of self appointed opinion critics around here who will slap you back to reality.

[Deleted]

I do love the constant mentioning of the "dumbing down" of the game.

Right now we have far more abilities, more classes and specs available and bosses with far more abilities.

Back in Vanilla bosses had 1-2 mechanics at most, and required only half the raid to even stay alive.

In TBC most bosses were really not difficult, bar a handful (Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Reliquary of Souls, Illidan and most of Sunwell which was designed to keep the hardcore happy until WOTLK). Most were just healing or DPS checks.

Not to mention back then I had ONE ability to use, right now i'm using a priority rotation of multiple abilities to maximise DPS whilst paying attention to the boss.

This is somewhat true, we have more things to look for now and more buttons to press. But there isn't more choice. For me it don't really matter if I'm pressing 1 and 2 when I do my "job" or 1,2 and 3. What this game lacks is customization. Yes, previous expansions were not great and you can say there is more to do now then there was before and I would agree with it. But what I would expect with the game progressing is Blizz realizing that we can actually think for ourself and given multiple choice is a good not a bad thing. Example I can give is class difference and talents. Yes, the old talent trees were not perfect, majority of people did go for the "cookie cutters", but if you wanted to be unique you could. We could have paladins wearing cloth and being casters, tanking rogues/shamans etc etc. Now, all of this is gone. All the classes are practically the same, with the same spells just named differently and the new talents, as much as I can see what they tried to do there are not really better. I do like the idea of "bring the player, not the class", but I'm sure if they spent just a little bit more time thinking about it, they could come up with something that doesn't totally murder uniqueness of the classes and bring balance at the same time.

So any how I'd like to hear from other gm's or guild leaders. Are you having the same issues? As a die hard World of Warcraft fan...I'm trying to stay strong and true to the game. However it's becoming VERY hard.

I do agree with the OP here, the game seems to be going into a direction I'm not yet sure I want to follow and as a GM of my guild I have noticed the negative impact of the game on my group. But I don't believe it is the expansion's fault. It mostly the game in general. I do hope they will bring something decent for the new expansion or we may see further decline in their sub numbers.

[-Superman-]

The OP is 100% correct in their assessment and, if anything, far too lenient with MoP which is definitely the worst WoW expansion, if it is "Warcraft" at all. I am one of those 1,5-2 million who have quit MoP and I won't even bother looking back to what is basically, pandas & pokemon. I was one of the first to quit back in 2012. Even buying MoP (the box) was definitely a mistake. That money would have been better spent in my local charity.

P.S.: The same posters who now defend MoP as the best thing that has happened to humanity since penicillin, used to defend CATAFAIL on this very same board with the same passion and the same arguments. It is amusing that they now claim CATAFAIL to have been the worst expansion. It was "WoW's best expansion" according to them just one month prior to the launch of MoP. :-)

And yet here you are to grace us with an opinion about a game you no longer play and an expansion you hate. I'm confident this will be taken with the utmost seriousness.

[Gilian]

It's an Expansion placed in the middle of a transitional period when WoW goes from 13 million subs to around 5 or 6 million.

They've shelved out more player friendly content this expansion than any other.

And also, your opinions aren't fact.

I love this expansion as do others.

Thanks.

Player friendly content? What does that mean?

[marthsk]

So we all know that MoP has officially lost 1.3 Million players. It's story line is bottom of the barrel. It's content is saddening. At the start of the expansion we saw mind numbing dailies and rng. Then the crz crisis. We saw the stream lining of lfr. We still have yet to receive new 5 man instances, even thought the majority of players are asking for them. Now Blizzard is adding a cash shop and connected servers. This can only be to recoup the massive subscription losses this expansion.

It's at this point I have to ask...When is enough, really enough. We have saw for ourselves that mass casual play, is not working. However neither is mass hardcore play. When will we have the much needed middle ground? When will Blizzard begin to take a real notice to so many serious issues. Since the start of MoP my 25 man guild has dropped in membership. At MoP start we had over 400 members and 3 25 man teams. That didn't last. Players quit left and right. Most leaving due to being unhappy with the state of the game and the poor changes. Leaving the game, and not returning. We are now down to one 10 man group. We barely get by sometimes. I am not a hardcore player by any means. However I also do not consider myself casual. I understand the need for both types of players. However our guild recruitment has dropped off. The quality of players has dropped off as well. New recruits standing in boss aoe abilities, and saying it wasn't their fault. That they did in lfr.

Ladies and gentlemen.....the game has been dumbed down to the point it is blindly obvious. If the next expansion goes even more casual...I fear for my favorite game.

So any how I'd like to hear from other gm's or guild leaders. Are you having the same issues? As a die hard World of Warcraft fan...I'm trying to stay strong and true to the game. However it's becoming VERY hard.

Please note I never said anything I said was a fact. My post is simply my opinions and take on things currently. The issues with the game I listed, are reasons given to my guild for players quitting the game and the most complained about topics on our guild website. If you are here to troll, harass, or just make mind numbing replies....please don't waste anyone times. These are merely opinions and nothing more.

Talking in a holier-than-thou manner, and then backtracking saying it was an opinion doesn't make it so. Either pick your tone carefully at the beginning of the post, or take responsibility, man up, and stand your grounds, no matter how uninformed that would be.

[hambadger]

Well after a long guild meeting last night. Almost all of what was left of our guild unsubscribed. The game just lost about 16 good players for good, all of us from BC. We all agree the game has gone down hill. The post replies only helped me see this. We have decided that we will vote with our dollars, so to speak. We are going to be playing Rift until the launch of ESO. Then we will try ESO out as a guild. At least Rift developers listen to the player base both in game and on forums. Rift went f2p at the request of the player base. Not only are they up in player numbers, it's rumored to be around 2 million. That's good enough for me. I'm going back to not posting on these forums again. Too many attention starved fanboys here. It feels like a endless sea of teenage girls here at a Justin Bieber concert.

[Gilian]

I do love the constant mentioning of the "dumbing down" of the game.

Right now we have far more abilities, more classes and specs available and bosses with far more abilities.

Back in Vanilla bosses had 1-2 mechanics at most, and required only half the raid to even stay alive.

In TBC most bosses were really not difficult, bar a handful (Vashj, Kael'thas, Archimonde, Reliquary of Souls, Illidan and most of Sunwell which was designed to keep the hardcore happy until WOTLK). Most were just healing or DPS checks.

Not to mention back then I had ONE ability to use, right now i'm using a priority rotation of multiple abilities to maximise DPS whilst paying attention to the boss.

It's being constantly mentioned because it's a fact and it does ruin the gameplay for many players. I'm not sure why some people keep denying this.


All those class abilities only made it easier for us. Maybe to maximize your performance is more complicated but all those selfheals and buffs and whatnot made the game overall much easier. Solo capabilities are much higher than ever before.

[Pann]

Cata = 3 million subs lost (12 mill - 9 mill) (peak)

MoP = 1.3 million subs lost (9 mill - 7.7 mill)

Cata was the worst.

The figures for MOP are incorrect subscriptions rose from 9.1 million as of June 30th 2012 to "...more than 10 million..." as reported in the Q3 2012 earnings call at launch of MOP. By the end of Q4 they had fallen to almost the same level as Cata with 9.6 million, Q1 2013 saw them drop even further to 8.3 million and the latest results report 7.7 million subs.

Thus MOP has lost a million more subscribers than you have written and at nine months in has lost 600k less than Cata lost throughout its entire lifespan it is reasonable to assume that by the time the next expansion is released the losses from MOP will exceed those from Cata.

[Terridon]

The OP is 100% correct in their assessment and, if anything, far too lenient with MoP which is definitely the worst WoW expansion, if it is "Warcraft" at all. I am one of those 1,5-2 million who have quit MoP and I won't even bother looking back to what is basically, pandas & pokemon. I was one of the first to quit back in 2012. Even buying MoP (the box) was definitely a mistake. That money would have been better spent in my local charity.

P.S.: The same posters who now defend MoP as the best thing that has happened to humanity since penicillin, used to defend CATAFAIL on this very same board with the same passion and the same arguments. It is amusing that they now claim CATAFAIL to have been the worst expansion. It was "WoW's best expansion" according to them just one month prior to the launch of MoP. :-)

Failed post :P
Show the same posters that said cata was awesome now saying it's horrible? No? stop posting then :P