Poll: Would it upset you if LFR went away?

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  1. #661
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    Quote Originally Posted by serenka View Post
    i keep hearing about AFKers in LFR, maybe im just lucky but ive not experienced it too much, pretyt much all AFKers ive had in groups have been kicked pretty fast
    It's largely a myth. umm it does happen and people do get kicked for it but it is of course logically absurd to think it happens with any serious frequency. The bosses don't kill themselves even on lfr.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  2. #662
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chirri View Post
    I'd be upset on behalf of the people who enjoy the game and make proper use of LFR because their lives have changed enough that they're no longer able to dedicate the time that standard forms of raiding require.

    People have kids. People have job schedules. People have disabilities. People have other responsibilities that take priority over any sort of game. They're paying their subscription fees, why shouldn't they even be able to get at least a taste of what's going on end game because a few perfectly able bodied, time free assholes are being assholes?

    Get rid of LFR, and you'll lose a lot of people who are only still playing the game because LFR is their endgame. Sure, they can still do farming, pets, crafting, dungeons, and trade chatting, but that's something you can do at any level. Raiding (regardless of difficulty) is the main course of the game for a lot of people. If we lose the LFR heroes, a lot of Normal and Hardmode players will lose a lot of friends. Guilds will become quieter, servers will become even more empty, and Normal and Hardmode players will be lost as well (not all of them, but I suspect it would be enough to "hurt" those who remain behind).

    I raid twice a week with my guild, but I chat most often with someone whose endgame is LFR because a lot changes in 8 years. If that person quits, I'm out. If I quit, my spouse quits (that's not an unspoken rule, they've said it up front to me that they play because it's something we do together; the game and our guild are not what keep either of us playing).

    MMOs need a community, and the players need a community. When you alienate a large chunk of players without a really, really good reason, you're killing your own game.
    Flex raids will hopefully fill the gap that LFR leaves behind. People with no time for fixed raid schedules will still be able to group up and raid together when it suits them, just in a more challenging environment.

  3. #663
    like it or not is something that keep some players in the game so why remove it? all content and stuff to do is welcome!

  4. #664
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    It's largely a myth. umm it does happen and people do get kicked for it but it is of course logically absurd to think it happens with any serious frequency. The bosses don't kill themselves even on lfr.
    they don't kill themselves but they also don't fight back.

  5. #665
    Quote Originally Posted by ablib View Post
    What does LFR have to do with the way progression used to be? How does it affect progression?
    because the whiny little lfr babies are crying that normal is too hard , when in actual fact , normal is quite easy , lfr has made the playerbase BAD and thats bad because they nerf normal when it doesnt need to be nerfed, and they release content that isnt half as good as the content they used to release before LFR. So to all the LFR PLAYERS I ASK u this , r u mad ? and y dont u keybind.

  6. #666
    Quote Originally Posted by zingar View Post
    challenge is certainly a part of games

    but if youre looking for it MMOs arent a good place for it
    you mean until the last 5 years, mmo's have almost always been the most challenging games.

  7. #667
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakeic View Post
    they don't kill themselves but they also don't fight back.
    I do remember wiping quite a bit on lfr lei shen. He fought back. Regardless of that the idea that theirs this large number of the lfr raiding community afking and bosses are still dropping themselves is obviously absurd. It's outliers, a handful of people.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  8. #668
    Quote Originally Posted by cFortyfive View Post
    Doubt that they would go into that to begin with as that would just fail hilariously.
    I dunno, see the thing is if WoW was built again from scratch they wouldn't have to worry about existing HM raiders, and having NM flexi and HM not would be weird. I'm betting they would take their chances.
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  9. #669
    People who say LFR lets players see content is lies. LFR is NOT content, LFR is dumbed down so much, that the bosses can't even qualify as bosses. I don't bother with LFR much anymore, cuz I have normal/HC, and I can't be bothered stressing myself out with people in LFR who are pretty bad X_X

  10. #670
    i dont understand , does the community not want difficulty or something ? something challenging ? y dont they make lfr just a giant pug and make it hard ? wud u guys complain ? ur seeing the content , but it requires effort ?

  11. #671
    Quote Originally Posted by jakeic View Post
    they don't kill themselves but they also don't fight back.
    Shrug.

    People oversimplify a bit, after an LFR wing has been out for several months and everyone knows what to do and the average ILVL is pretty high then yeah it's faceroll even for pugs. But when a new wing has just come out, unless you're lucky enough to get a run full of NM/HM geared players there's usually a boss or two who can wreck pugs. Time was Garalon or Elegon or Horridon or Council or Durumu would smash every other group. Lei Shen was a challenge for most pugs for a long, long time.

    99% of WoW is gear and practice, I think people constantly underestimate that, even in the context of LFR.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Lyrax View Post
    People who say LFR lets players see content is lies. LFR is NOT content, LFR is dumbed down so much, that the bosses can't even qualify as bosses. I don't bother with LFR much anymore, cuz I have normal/HC, and I can't be bothered stressing myself out with people in LFR who are pretty bad X_X
    It's content as in, player X does all of Wrath to fight the Lich King, but doesn't have the time to commit to raiding so never actually fights him.

    I also think people are way too hung up on the difficulty of the encounter. LFR is designed to be accessible, it's made easy so you can carry slack pugs so you don't wind up sitting around wiping on easy bosses for hours because 1/25 people is afk. I feel like everyone acts as if easymode is the intention of LFR, whereas in fact it's just a side effect of being queue-able.

    P.S. Sounds like you're exactly the market for Flexi.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  12. #672
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    It's largely a myth. umm it does happen and people do get kicked for it but it is of course logically absurd to think it happens with any serious frequency. The bosses don't kill themselves even on lfr.
    Please, you can go into just about any LFR on just about any given day and see some dps auto attacking the boss and doing nothing else. It's logically absurd to exclude the possibility that it could happen. You're right, the bosses don't kill themselves, it's the other people actually contributing to the raid.

    While this is not an attack against LFR, as I don't mind it existing, it's naive to say that this only rarely happens.

    Regardless of that the idea that theirs this large number of the lfr raiding community afking and bosses are still dropping themselves is obviously absurd.
    These bosses are so undertuned on LFR that you don't need a full raid group of people actively participating to kill it. Just because bosses die doesn't mean it was because everyone was participating. LFR Lei Shen caused so many problems because the fight has a large degree of personal responsibility in comparison to the rest of the bosses.

  13. #673
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    Quote Originally Posted by Allarius View Post

    While this is not an attack against LFR, as I don't mind it existing, it's naive to say that this only rarely happens.


    In the scope of all lfr and all the players participating in lfr yes I imagine it's quite rare.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  14. #674
    Quote Originally Posted by Guinzil View Post
    Flex raids will hopefully fill the gap that LFR leaves behind. People with no time for fixed raid schedules will still be able to group up and raid together when it suits them, just in a more challenging environment.
    Flex raids are not randomly queueable. Long as that remains the case, they will never be a replacement for LFR, just like how you'll never get rid of LFD. EVER.

    Accept it, LFR is here to stay as long as WoW remains playable. Deal with it or don't, run it or don't, but to try and deny this is as foolish as asking for Humans to be playable by Horde and Orcs to be playable by Alliance.

  15. #675
    Quote Originally Posted by lawow74 View Post
    Yes, because it would mean Blizzard was catering to a bunch of whiny crybabies
    Oh, the irony.

  16. #676
    Quote Originally Posted by Glorious Leader View Post
    In the scope of all lfr and all the players participating in lfr yes I imagine it's quite rare.
    It's possible this is true. It's bit hard to believe that though, just due to the vast personal experience I have with it. Very rarely have I been in an LFR where someone WASN'T slacking off(and it's usually multiple people). It's highly possible that due to the realms that are linked together may have more than other battlegroups. If that's the case then I could definitely see how some people might never experience it.

  17. #677
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by lawow74 View Post
    Flex raids are not randomly queueable. Long as that remains the case, they will never be a replacement for LFR, just like how you'll never get rid of LFD. EVER.

    Accept it, LFR is here to stay as long as WoW remains playable. Deal with it or don't, run it or don't, but to try and deny this is as foolish as asking for Humans to be playable by Horde and Orcs to be playable by Alliance.
    You realize there was life before LFR, right? People with a desire to raid/gear up/experience endgame used to find like-minded people through Trade-chat (it's called a PUG, "pick-up group"). It's what people did before LFR was introduced, and sadly it ended in Cataclysm because the high difficulty ramp of Normal raids made it very hard for a PUG to be successful.

    The problem with queues is that 25 people are suddenly thrown into a raid. There is no sense of leadership - rarely does someone speak up and explain the bossfights, and therefore the raid is balanced to the point where no leadership or direction is required. Having to invite players into your raid has some negative effects (it takes time, and some raidleaders may set high gear requirements), but also a lot of positive effects (it's clear who's in charge, and there is a better sense of community among the players).

    Your "here to stay" argument is ridiculous, removing LFR isn't even close to being on par with "making Humans playable by Horde". LFR has only been here for 1,5 years, many of the current WoW players have played WoW before the implementation of LFR and many see it as an experiment that failed. The only reason they keep doing it, is because LFR is literally the ONLY way to gear yourself up in 5.3.

    I don't expect Blizzard to admit their experiment didn't work out as they wish it had, though. That's why we probably won't see the removal of LFR.

  18. #678
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    Quote Originally Posted by Allarius View Post
    It's possible this is true. It's bit hard to believe that though, just due to the vast personal experience I have with it. Very rarely have I been in an LFR where someone WASN'T slacking off(and it's usually multiple people). It's highly possible that due to the realms that are linked together may have more than other battlegroups. If that's the case then I could definitely see how some people might never experience it.
    Oh I'm sure almost everybody has experienced it like once or twice. However think about this in terms of numbers. Add up all the participants of every lfr group that has ever existed since the beginning of lfr. Now compare that to even a grossly exagerrated figure of possible afks completing a boss (and not disconnecting actual WILFULL afks alt tabbing for whatever) and my guess is the ratio is actually extremely small.
    The hammer comes down:
    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    Normal should be reduced in difficulty. Heroic should be reduced in difficulty.
    And the tiny fraction for whom heroic raids are currently well tuned? Too bad,so sad! With the arterial bleed of subs the fastest it's ever been, the vanity development that gives you guys your own content is no longer supportable.

  19. #679
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    Quote Originally Posted by taurenguard View Post
    I think someone understands what a *Game* actually is and what it is for.
    What you quoted as me saying... I most certainly did not say.

  20. #680
    Quote Originally Posted by Batmoonn View Post
    i dont understand , does the community not want difficulty or something ? something challenging ? y dont they make lfr just a giant pug and make it hard ? wud u guys complain ? ur seeing the content , but it requires effort ?
    Just look at poll result - looks like more people dont want difficult game, they dont want challenge.
    Why having to put effort? Why bumping the wall when you can go around it?
    Im fine if you want to bump your head, but I want to go around the wall and get to the same goal. I had my share of wall bumping in TBC and Wotlk, but thanks, not anymore.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by zingar View Post
    what does gear progression mean when your end goal is LFR? why would you want better gear? so that you can keep doing LFR??
    Why not want better gear? At max level, only character progress is thru gear. Be it for LFR, be it for looks, be it for doing dailies faster doesnt really matter. People set their own goals and they dont have same goals. Thank god for that.

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