Why don't you guys believe The Dark Below was a real trademark anymore?

[Hitei]

That sounds like an opinion.

Obviously, was there a need to point that out?

[Wildberry]

Obviously, was there a need to point that out?

Was there a need to point out that you disagree with Harmonious' opinion? If so, then yes.

[Hitei]

Was there a need to point out that you disagree with Harmonious' opinion? If so, then yes.

Yes, because I felt like expressing my own opinion. I also wasn't disagreeing with him, he stated that it sounded like a place name where all the other expansions didn't. And I made a remark about how it still sounds good even if it sounds like a place name.

Whereas your post was just a snide comment.

[DarkTZeratul]

We have to keep in mind who we are dealing with, Boub. This is the guy that leaked Cata, nailed the trademarks for MoP and Cata. Leaked the Cata alpha and then got slapped down and had to remove it and claim it was faked.

He never claimed the Cata alpha was faked. He flat-out stated that Blizzard asked him to remove it and he complied.

[Razorice]

I'm pretty sure The Dark Below was the real deal, Blizzard just posted "Corgis Unleashed" to throw us off.

[Tyrgannus]

In regards to the concept of epilogue patches and past evidences of them, I have a few points to make.

First off, Sunwell Plateau HAD to have been planned, despite the common belief that it was not. The quest line that lead up to defeating Kael'thas in Tempest Keep HEAVILY foreshadowed patch 2.4, specifically the quest that you loot from Kael's body. I believe it was always designed as a plot twist, not an after thought.

Secondly Ruby Sanctum is the only viable example of a true epilogue patch once you admit 2.4 was part of BC's natural progression, but even in this example it was NOT patch 3.4, instead it was patch 3.3.5

Now, I'm not saying it is impossible for Skysunder to be patch 5.5 or for a patch 5.5 to exist, but I would argue that there is no precedent and it would be something completely new in WoW. Back in Vanilla, there were TONS of patches that weren't mega raid patches. BC had at least one patch that wasn't a mega raid patch (forgot if it was 2.2 or 2.3), and MoP has had 2 so far (not to mention the troll dungeon patch in Cataclysm). However, all of these patches were before the final raid tier. With the exception of Wrath of the Lich King, the final raid tier has marked the last content patch until x.0 right before the next expansion (again, this does not mean it CAN'T happen, just that it hasn't and doesn't seem to be Blizz's MO). Wrath being an exception that content was released between ICC in 3.3 and The Shattering in 4.0 is very interesting to note, but I counter that the patch was 3.3.5, not 3.4. Ruby Sanctum was never treated as an entire patch.


My arguments revolve around what has happened, but I fully understand that will happen isn't necessarily dictated by the past, though one can make educated guesses using the information given. If there was a 5.5 epilogue patch, it would somewhat come out of left field, though that is admittedly possible.


The same could be said about the entire speculation of "The Dark Below" really. What we have to work with is what has happened and then make educated guesses as to what will happen. I admit fully that nothing is confirmed in any way, though I completely understood the reluctance on BOTH sides to believe it or not. On one hand, there are legitimate differences between THE DARK BELOW's filing and that of the other fakes, even if it is simply in application form. One would stand to reason that Corgis Unleashed would be more effective in disproving The Dark Below if it followed the format to the letter, especially since the known fakes all resemble Corgis Unleashed more than they do The Dark Below. On the other hand, this really IS just an application and not a trademark. This debacle, while similar to the Cataclysm and Mists trademark finds, is not the same as I believe those were trademarks (heck, Blizzard even acknowledged Mists' trademark) whereas this is only an application. Tin foil hats aside, I find the entire process of finding the information and actively debunking it in an extremely similar yet not exact way in less than 24 hours odd to me, though that does not confirm or deny legitimacy.

[TyrianFC]

First off, Sunwell Plateau HAD to have been planned, despite the common belief that it was not.

We already know Sunwell was planned from the start of TBC, Blizzard initially spoke about it then even. Then they went all quiet about it and hushed it up so they could pull a 'big reveal' later on during the expansions cycle.

There is no ambiguity about it. Many of the people who thought Sunwell wasnt planned were ones that didnt actually play TBC from the start.

[Devboy]

I'm still fairly certain that TBD is the expansion name, and will be the next expansion.

I made a fair few posts about how I believe the expansions have been planned, and hinted at / referenced in-game. (none of this is 100% proved obviously)

How I believe its gone so far; Each expansion has been hinted at / reference / predicted by looking back 2 expansions - examples

Vanilla(The least likely one to use for evidence) - Fair amount of undead content (plaguelands) and final raid Naxx 40 - Leads up to WoTLK (expansion after the next)

TBC - Hinted and referenced Deathwing not actually being dead - quest/storyline around - Leads up to Cataclysm (expansion After the next )

WoTLK (not a lot of decent evidence, but still some references) - a few items (the biggest one I look at was the Panderan Monk pet that was release alongside Lil' KT. Lil KT was a fitting pet release within the expansion, but the Panderan Monk...?) + the globe in ulduar with the continent/giant turtle on top and the glass stained windows in ulduar depicting what look like Sha) - Leads up to MoP (Expansion after the Next)

Cataclysm - Underwater zone with Naga Story line, Neptulon story within Throne of Tides. and ofc DW and his corruption. Faceless bosses in DS etc. - Likely will lead up to The Dark Below (Expansion after the next).

MoP - A whole Legendary questline that clearly points to the legions return. - Likely will end up being the Legion focused expansion (Expansion after the next)

As you can see, it does all pan out quite well, and so far its been accurate, but as its just speculation, it could just be a lucky coincidence. The only way to really know will be when blizzard confirm what the next expansion is.

But personally I think its too early for a Legion expansion. We have not yet dealt with Azshara and N'Zoth, and I don't see them being an expansion after the Burning Legion one (if the burning legion one ends with us facing off against Saergas)

[Hitei]

I'm still fairly certain that TBD is the expansion name, and will be the next expansion.

I made a fair few posts about how I believe the expansions have been planned, and hinted at / referenced in-game. (none of this is 100% proved obviously)

How I believe its gone so far; Each expansion has been hinted at / reference / predicted by looking back 2 expansions - examples

Vanilla(The least likely one to use for evidence) - Fair amount of undead content (plaguelands) and final raid Naxx 40 - Leads up to WoTLK (expansion after the next)

TBC - Hinted and referenced Deathwing not actually being dead - quest/storyline around - Leads up to Cataclysm (expansion After the next )

WoTLK (not a lot of decent evidence, but still some references) - a few items (the biggest one I look at was the Panderan Monk pet that was release alongside Lil' KT. Lil KT was a fitting pet release within the expansion, but the Panderan Monk...?) + the globe in ulduar with the continent/giant turtle on top and the glass stained windows in ulduar depicting what look like Sha) - Leads up to MoP (Expansion after the Next)

Cataclysm - Underwater zone with Naga Story line, Neptulon story within Throne of Tides. and ofc DW and his corruption. Faceless bosses in DS etc. - Likely will lead up to The Dark Below (Expansion after the next).

MoP - A whole Legendary questline that clearly points to the legions return. - Likely will end up being the Legion focused expansion (Expansion after the next)

As you can see, it does all pan out quite well, and so far its been accurate, but as its just speculation, it could just be a lucky coincidence. The only way to really know will be when blizzard confirm what the next expansion is.

But personally I think its too early for a Legion expansion. We have not yet dealt with Azshara and N'Zoth, and I don't see them being an expansion after the Burning Legion one (if the burning legion one ends with us facing off against Saergas)

It's very easy to look back and make connections that aren't actually there in a game as massive as wow.

[Keristrasza]

I don't care what they name it, as long as it's NOT the Burning Legion. I had my fill with demons and the twisting nether back in BC. I'd rather have 30 new zones all under water with the Z axis included, rather than sit through another "Oh no, here comes sargaras' lackies .... again."

[Devboy]

It's very easy to look back and make connections that aren't actually there in a game as massive as wow.

While this is true, try and look at it from the time frame of the expansion it was made. So for example, we are being hinted at a legion expansion now. But it happens two expansions down the line. Looking at it during the legion expansion, and you could say that. But look at it now during MoP, and then it happening as predicted based on previous links. And you've found the key...

[Deleted]

Please excuse me while I nom this dairy milk bar and lol at your straw grasping :3

[Kaleredar]

Because I'd much rather have the burning Legion than face the old gods for the THIRD time in a row.

We've been underwater, we've seen what Blizzard does with Underwater stuff. Blizzard even did some of it in Mists of Pandaria, and it more or less looks exactly like what they did in Vashj'ir. Vashj'ir was cool and all... but it's been done.

Wrathion has been huffing and puffing about the Burning Legion the entirety of MoP. What? Is he going to say "Oh, wait, we got a few more years till they arrive... guess we can just chill and rela- OMGWTFN'ZOTH!" and then have us fight Naga and tentacles for another expansion? And THEN have the Burning Legion show up? Why the hell did he not just freak out about N'zoth and Azshara then? That would have at least made some damn sense. If the Dark Below were to come to pass, they'd just be pulling a complete 180 in story direction...

[Inval1d]

Some people have a real hard time properly reading and comprehending posts on the front page don't they?

[Devboy]

Please excuse me while I nom this dairy milk bar and lol at your straw grasping :3

Clutching at straws... Maybe....

But I see a pattern that accurately predicts expansions... Hopefully this will continue.

[Jessicka]

Because I'd much rather have the burning Legion than face the old gods for the THIRD time in a row.

We've been underwater, we've seen what Blizzard does with Underwater stuff. Blizzard even did some of it in Mists of Pandaria, and it more or less looks exactly like what they did in Vashj'ir. Vashj'ir was cool and all... but it's been done.

Wrathion has been huffing and puffing about the Burning Legion the entirety of MoP. What? Is he going to say "Oh, wait, we got a few more years till they arrive... guess we can just chill and rela- OMGWTFN'ZOTH!" and then have us fight Naga and tentacles for another expansion? And THEN have the Burning Legion show up? Why the hell did he not just freak out about N'zoth and Azshara then? That would have at least made some damn sense. If the Dark Below were to come to pass, they'd just be pulling a complete 180 in story direction...

It's not a 180, Wrathion says at the end of SoO that he expected his plan to have taken another year, meaning he didn't expect the Legion for more than that.

Also, Wrathion is like 2 years old, and hardly developed or established. It'd be stupid to rush him into his final chapter against the Legion so suddenly. I think he has more to offer than that.

[Sierra85]

If we know the legion is coming, as the King of the Alliance and the Warchief of the horde should be planning to defend our homelands. If we have that information now, then if we do nothing and instead go to Azshara or underwater or something like that, its pretty irresponsible.

We should be planning our defenses and some sort of offensive. Even if the offensive is sending a small band of 10-25 heroes to upload a computer virus to the legions mothership.

[Milerks]

World of Warcraft: Corgis Unleashed

[Hitei]

While this is true, try and look at it from the time frame of the expansion it was made. So for example, we are being hinted at a legion expansion now. But it happens two expansions down the line. Looking at it during the legion expansion, and you could say that. But look at it now during MoP, and then it happening as predicted based on previous links. And you've found the key...

My point is that you're using a flawed prediction system.
You're looking backwards at a massive amount of content trying to find a connection between expansions.. obviously you're going to find one.

If the expansion order had been Wrath > Mists > BC > Cata

You could claim that the panda cub that came with WoW CE, and the Chen quest in the barrens were hints towards Mists of pandaria, and that the demons locked up in Violet hold were a hint towards a BC expansion, and that the Old god stuff and "yawning chasm of darkness beneath you mortals, vast, endless, and all consuming." was a hint towards Cata.

I'm not saying TDB is or is not the expansion.. It's very likely that the expansion will be Azshara/N'zoth or Legion.

But people really need to stop using the expansion-after-next prediction thing as an argument for an expansion being likely.
You're just seeing patterns where you want to see them.
And even if there WERE a pattern, you'd have no way to know what part of Cata is pointing towards the next expansion. It could be the demon in Hyjal who talks about the Legion's return, it could be the faceless ones pointing to a N'zoth expansion.. it could be Kezan pointing towards a southseas steampunk expansion that would make Teriz happy.

To quote myself arguing about this in a previous thread:

It's like trying to say that because you tripped on a curb, and a week later there was an earthquake in Africa.
And then you slipped in a puddle and the next week there was a tsunami in India.
That today, when you fell in a puddle of mud, it's proof that there's going to be a mudslide in California next week.

[Kaleredar]

It's not a 180, Wrathion says at the end of SoO that he expected his plan to have taken another year, meaning he didn't expect the Legion for more than that.

Or he thought he'd fail. Or thought he'd be able to stave off the legion invasion while he worked, or the expansion is supposed to happen a year after the events of SoO, or any number of things.

And like I said, that'd be a colossal, pointless bait and switch. Instead of having everyone pissing themselves about the Legion, including Wrathion himself, they could have just been talking up the threat of N'zoth or Azshara, which is apparently what we should have been planning for this entire time if this indeed does come to pass. But there wasn't ONE damn mention of them. At all. No Naga attacks, no giant tentacles invading Pandaria... nothin'. Not even weird tidal conditions.

Going "What a twist!" is not exactly good story telling when the twist is out of left field and has nothing to do with anything we've been doing on Pandaria.

because right now, it'd be like this:

MoP:
-Wrathion eluding to the Burning Legion's invasion
-Wrathion flatly saying "the burning legion is coming
-Wrathion making a heartfelt appeal to the August Celstials for powers to help fight off the Legion
-The burdens of Shao-Hao detailing the emperor's lesson needed to protect Pandaria from the legion, and the lessons needed to be learned by the Pandaren people in order to defend themselves from the Burning Legion in the future.

-and then the big bad we have to contend with in the next expansion, of course, is...

The Burning Le- JUST KIDDING! It's N'zoth!

So it's not the most... sensible... story avenue.

Also, Wrathion is like 2 years old, and hardly developed or established. It'd be stupid to rush him into his final chapter against the Legion right away.

Who said that would need to be his final chapter?

And besides, he's two... in dragon years.