This is Thrall's Fault

[Digory Kirke]

Ultimately, everything that has happened under the tyranny of Garrosh Hellscream falls on the shoulders of Thrall. Even though he is considered a selfless hero, his decision to give the mantle of Warchief to Garrosh was a serious lack of judgement, discernment, wisdom, and (I believe) flawed moral character.

Besides the CLEAR signs that Garrosh wasn't ready for the responsibility (his attacking Varian at a diplomatic meeting in Dalaran, his behavior during the Trial of the Crusade, and his challenging Thrall after taunting his leadership ability), Thrall ignored critical advice and council from his most trusted friends. Vol'jin warned him, Cairne warned him, and Saurfang disagreed as well, yet Thrall was either too proud or too blind to recognize the serious mistake he was about to make. Even after he gave Garrosh the mantle, Voljin and Cairne expressed serious concerns, which Thrall ignored. Thrall should have corrected his mistake before he left for the Maelstrom.

So, why did Thrall ignore the friends he trusted and make a devastating decision like this? My answer would be Thrall's own selfish ambitions. One thing you learn very early on about Thrall is that he had a deep affection for his fallen friend, Grom Hellscream. What would bring Grom more honor than for his own son to lead the Horde that he died to save? I believe that it was Thrall's desire to honor Grom's memory that blinded him to the serious danger that Garrosh posed to the world.

Yes, it was Thrall's duty to leave Orgrimmar and save us from the Cataclysm, but of all of the options he had for a temporary Warchief, he chose the worst possible candidate. Voljin, Carine, Saurfang, Nazgrim, and Etrigg would have all been obviously better choices than Garrosh. But again, Thall was blinded by his emotional need to honor Grom's memory.

The genocide of Theramore, the destruction of the Vale, the death of Cairne, and for every other act of savagery that Garrosh has unleashed on Azeroth, the blame falls to Thrall.

In my opinion, he is a fallen hero who owes a serious debt to the people of the Horde, the Alliance, and of course the Pandaren.

As a Horde player, I firmly oppose any further influence that Thrall has in the Horde, especially in selecting a new Warchief.

Thrall has unwillingly become a villain this saga, even though he had good intentions.

Consider how many lives would have been saved and how much destruction could have been prevented, if Thrall hadn't failed so miserably despite the trustworthy advice of his friends.

[Movtre]

maybe thrall knew this would happend. and knew that everyone would rise against Garrosh together for a better world

[Ultramonkey]

Who's to say Garrosh would have accepted the new Warchief and either challenged him for the mantle or rallied the Orcs who look up to him as the Hero of Northrend and split away from the Horde?

There are way too many variables that could have happened, especially since Garrosh had shown signs of progression in his behaviour.

[Deleted]

I believe he wanted to give Garrosh a chance to become a better leader despite his aggresive attitude towards everyone except the orcs. But as we know,power corrupts.. and Garrosh didn't even need much to become paranoid.

[Deleted]

Garrosh had great potential when Thrall appointed him and he even seemed like a good choice early Cataclysm. Thrall cannot predict the writers making Garrosh go apeshit, he was literally the only viable option for Warchief.

[Slowpoke is a Gamer]

This is why I hope the new Warchief is not Thrall.

[Digory Kirke]

maybe thrall knew this would happend. and knew that everyone would rise against Garrosh together for a better world

There was genocide. If your statement is true, he is an even bigger villain.

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Garrosh had great potential when Thrall appointed him and he even seemed like a good choice early Cataclysm. Thrall cannot predict the writers making Garrosh go apeshit, he was literally the only viable option for Warchief.

Tell me one instance where Garrosh showed potential?

[Deleted]

Tell me one instance where Garrosh showed potential?

He was the de facto leader of The Horde in Northrend, was The Horde not victorious?

[Aquamonkey]

There was genocide. If your statement is true, he is an even bigger villain.

Does that make Wrathion a villain too? He was backing Garrosh until he turned half the Horde against himself.

[shimerra]

He was the de facto leader of The Horde in Northrend, was The Horde not victorious?

Did you actually play through Northrend? Or listen to the stupid RP in the hold. Seems to me more like the horde contributed to the victory despite Garroshes best efforts rather than because of them.

[Trassk]

oh here we go..

Smoke some weed lately? you must have, your actually trying to find a scapegoat with one of wow's most noted heroes.

Its like blaming batman for the creation of the joker.

[Zuben]

I blame Aggra.

[MonsieuRoberts]

Mmhmm. He dun goofed.

[Digory Kirke]

oh here we go..

Smoke some weed lately? you must have, your actually trying to find a scapegoat with one of wow's most noted heroes.

Its like blaming batman for the creation of the joker.

Did you read my post? Feel free to tell me where I'm wrong and why you disagree?

[Absintheminded]

Garrosh had great potential when Thrall appointed him and he even seemed like a good choice early Cataclysm. Thrall cannot predict the writers making Garrosh go apeshit, he was literally the only viable option for Warchief.

What? Cairne? Vol'Jin? You can't seriously think Garrosh was the *only* viable option.

Bitch please.

[Deleted]

Did you actually play through Northrend? Or listen to the stupid RP in the hold. Seems to me more like the horde contributed to the victory despite Garroshes best efforts rather than because of them.

Yah I did, Warsong Hold was his command post, his army set up on Garrosh's Landing the Warsong Offensive was commanded by him the leader of the Warsong Clan. Several times it's mentioned that Garrosh is running things in Northrend, at Agmar's Hammer Overlord Agmar states "from this throne I issue the command of Hellscream" pretty obvious who's given orders to him in Dragonblight.

Thrall held celebrations in Orgrimmar afterwards to commend his leadership in Northrend despite their differences, and it was Garrosh at Icecrown Citadel to help finish the job.

[Deleted]

There was genocide. If your statement is true, he is an even bigger villain.

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Tell me one instance where Garrosh showed potential?

No genocide anywhere... Garrosh positionned his army in front of Theramore 1 week before bombing, to let the civils be evacuated.

And he showed potential by winning in Northrend, and was a good warchief when he acted like in Stonetalon.

Then Blizzard basically made him go crazy because even then people were still not liking him.

[Holtzmann]

I saw the title of this thread and thought to myself "Trassk is going to be all up on this". Lo and behold, I was not disappointed!

oh here we go..

Smoke some weed lately? you must have, your actually trying to find a scapegoat with one of wow's most noted heroes.

Its like blaming batman for the creation of the joker.

Well, in his defense, the Batman didn't deliberately put the Joker's impressionable son in charge of Gotham City after filling his head with stories about how awesome his dad was while pranking people to death, without mentioning that everybody with two brain cells to rub together hated that dude.

[Trassk]

Mmhmm. He dun goofed.

And, unlike the players who seem incapable of understanding character development, Thrall comes to correct that mistake.

Oh hey, remember how you people tried to accuse Thrall of being a mary sue who never made mistakes? Hey, he's made a mistake and even trying to right it.

So.. yeah, you guys really don't have a clue.

[Ultramonkey]

It's all Sargeras' fault! Had he not employed Kil'Jaeden, who tricked the orcs into demon blood, who marched through the Dark Portal with Grom in tow, who abandoned his son we would never have got to this point!