Will ESO being sub based affect WoW?

[valliant13]

No, not at all. Been there done that.

Until a game comes out that has the same kind of magic WoW has, people will keep returning to WoW. Blizzard will probably beat them to it though with Titan anyway.

I wouldnt say magic is the word. I would more say polish. And with massive games like MMO's, it's hard to find a game even near the considerable polish of wows calibur. It's why I quit SWToR, Aion, City of Heroes, Rift(to an extent, I actually liked rift more however all my friends left and they purposely picked a less populated shard), and every other mmo I've played.

[Zafire]

I'm jealous of your movie ticket prices. Though how Applebee's could justify charging 60$ for two plates of their "food" is insanity. I'm sure there's a better and less expensive restaurant near you, please look.

A steak meal with a Summer Squeeze on top of desert is about $30 for one person. It wouldn't have to be that expensive if I didn't want to get expensive things. We go to a fancy Italian restaurant called Seraphini's once a year and I usually spend over $100.

If I'm not broke, struggling for money, and I can always come out ahead for the next month, why does it really matter where I go to eat?

Wow@12.50 for a movie ticket. It's $8 here, $10.50 for 3D

[Azrile]

My guess is they are trying to target WoW players and say do you want our new game with ur 15 or the old game for 15

SWTOR, AOC, TSW, Warhammer, EQ2 etc etc etc.. all said the same thing.

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I think a lot of people when bashing TESO often tend to forget that WoW was launched with a ton of bugs, uncompleted zones and unfinished quests. If WoW launched today the same way it went live in 2004, it would have a high chance of simply crashing.

People are looking to compare a game that has been out for over 8 years to a newly released game.

But regarding your questiong OP, I think it will definitely hurt WoW. SWTOR may not be the best example now but back then activity dropped a lot on my realms well at least the first few months. Most importantly there are not many that can maintain two active subscriptions for both games.

But a lot of people that I had played with were really looking forward towards the release of TESO. I quit WoW a few months back primarily cause of it. I just feel it was worth investing any more in the game especially at its current state.

Blizzard may just be smart and release the annual pass this year at Blizzcon thus holding onto a wast majority of their player base.

You know what is funny... fans of every game since WOW have said that same thing ´ our game doesn´t have to launch perfect because WOW wasn´t perfect when it launched´.

But so sorry, it doesn´t work that way. People are not going to leave WOW today to play a game that will take a year to be as smooth as WOW is today. There is some grace period, but mostly it comes down to that free 30 day window. I remember so well the AOC fanboys in the 2nd and 3rd month after launch saying what you said... nobody cares. You are not competing against wow 8 years ago, you are competing against wow now.

[Kickbuttmario]

No, not at all. Been there done that.

Until a game comes out that has the same kind of magic WoW has, people will keep returning to WoW. Blizzard will probably beat them to it though with Titan anyway.

What magic?? What magic do you speak of?

WoW barely has anything that other MMO's have now. Face it, the game is old and was just popular at the time of its release. There will never be an MMO that will be considered to have the same magic in your standards.

The only thing I can think of what made wow so big was just its own world was enormous.

PS. Forgot to mention, WoW is already losing subs due to other games and decline of the mmo market, so it barely makes a difference whether or not EOS does well xD

[hrugner]

A steak meal with a Summer Squeeze on top of desert is about $30 for one person. It wouldn't have to be that expensive if I didn't want to get expensive things. We go to a fancy Italian restaurant called Seraphini's once a year and I usually spend over $100.

If I'm not broke, struggling for money, and I can always come out ahead for the next month, why does it really matter where I go to eat?

Wow@12.50 for a movie ticket. It's $8 here, $10.50 for 3D

It's not a big deal where you eat, I was just impressed that your applebees is more expensive by half and your movies less by a fair chunk. I only encourage people to try places other than chains because there are undiscovered gems all over this country that deserve to be found.

It's 11.00 here for a ticket, but that's down a couple bucks since the theater moved out from under the awful mall rent and built their own cinema.

[Kickbuttmario]

I hope you get the beta yourself, because its not worth buying, at least not right now. They make guild wars look like a paradise of build diversity.

Well exactly how was the fps??

[Mosotti]

It will not affect WoW at all. And their subscription model will flop like all the others before them. To be honest, I think there will never again be a game that could ask a subscription fee, because no company can come with a game with enough content to justify it.

There is a huge difference between now and 2004-2005 when WoW launched. Then WoW made you level for months and months because there was no other better game out there, subscription based or not. The last subscription games that were launched, like Aion, SWTOR, Tera, Rift, The Secret World, all eventually went f2p or b2p. WoW still has a shitload of customers, but they also have a shitload of content that piled up over the years

Arenanet were pretty realistic to not ask a subscription, because really there isn't enough content in there to ask for one. You can pretty much level a character in one month and gear it up in the best gear. You can even do the whole world discovery in that time. Sure you can level another one, and another one, but the stories are not that different. So they went with this in-game shop, which I think it's pretty cool, though the prices are ridiculous

So good luck ESO with your subscription fee...

[Vankrys]

wow subscription will continue to go down no matter what. It'll be hard to say if TESO or other MMO are responsible in full or in part, but it's not a surprise to anyone today, wow is in decline today and will continue to decline. The game is just getting old and people move on, that's the bottom line.

Given that context, TESO and newer MMO, might attract some crowd. Is it because people prefer to play TESO (that may be true for some) or because they just don't want to play wow anymore and look for new blood. Look at it this way, you might have a favorite movie, but you can't watch it every night and keep getting the same quality of entertainment.

SWTOR released when wow was still a strong 10 millions sub MMO. By the time TESO release, wow might still be 5-6 millions sub MMO, but steadily declining. So, unless TESO really is poor quality (i am not in beta, can't say), i think it has all the card to be a succesful MMO. Only move from blizzard i see that could damage TESO is WoW going F2P, or hybrid F2P/P2P. This could kill or be very damaging to any MMO trying to release in that timeframe.

[Zantos]

SWTOR released when wow was still a strong 10 millions sub MMO. By the time TESO release, wow might still be 5-6 millions sub MMO, but steadily declining. So, unless TESO really is poor quality (i am not in beta, can't say), i think it has all the card to be a succesful MMO.

I doubt this. It won't matter in what shape the other MMO's are in, that won't automatically make TESO good or even successful unless they can pull it off themselves. With what I know, you Left click attack, right click block. If they hold steady to that combat system, that alone may kill it in the long run. Two moves literally leaves very little depth from class to class. Oh, you have two spells? So does everyone else.

TESO will need to be able to stand on its own two feet, and wont be able to rely on any other MMO being in poor, or good shape. Going sub based will be really hard. A lot more polished MMO's (combat wise, where most of the action is) and even story wise failed at it. It may just be that the newer generation expects more for less.

[Deleted]

All this means is that the sub hit that wow will take will be smaller. Dumb decicion for them.

[Vankrys]

I doubt this. It won't matter in what shape the other MMO's are in, that won't automatically make TESO good or even successful unless they can pull it off themselves. With what I know, you Left click attack, right click block. If they hold steady to that combat system, that alone may kill it in the long run. Two moves literally leaves very little depth from class to class. Oh, you have two spells? So does everyone else.

TESO will need to be able to stand on its own two feet, and wont be able to rely on any other MMO being in poor, or good shape. Going sub based will be really hard. A lot more polished MMO's (combat wise, where most of the action is) and even story wise failed at it. It may just be that the newer generation expects more for less.

pretty much like me then, you don't know much.

yes mouse click does have action, unlike traditionnal MMO (such as wow) where their main function are camera control.
there is, as i gather from information available, possibility to charge a power attack by maintening button pressed. on skyrim, you could have a more powerful attack pressing both button.

You have a sprint and dodge button also (on keyboard) to actively include in combat.

You also have a small action bar that you can activate with 1-6 key. This was criticized by skyrim fan, stating that it's too much "wow like" and a betrayal of the elder scrolls series, but i think you'd appreciate the presence of action bar.

They also talked about combo attack, akin to fighting game i suppose, i don't have much info on it.

Finally, comabt stratege would be to manage both magicka (mana) and stamina (kind like energy for rogue). melee attack and defence (dodge) both will require stamina, as well as spring and power attack.

i think they can make an interesting comabt system. Hey, batman arkham serie have a combat system based on 4 buttons (attack, block stun, dodge) + a few gadget, and it's one of the most fun combat i have had in years.

It's not about having a 8 keys rotation, it's about engaging the player in combat, making quick decisions, balancing attacking and defending, managing ressource.


Finally keep in mind, you can use just about any weapon and spell with any class, so you can create your own fighting style.


we know little so far.

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here are more detail about TESO combat for information.

http://tamrielfoundry.com/development-faq/#combat

[corebit]

Of course the release of any new MMO will affect WoW's sub numbers. The number of people who primarily play MMOs is finite, therefore MMOs are basically competing for a share of the same pie.

Now if we were talking how much of an effect, my personal guess is that it will be limited. WoW will always have a healthy following, but the player numbers will keep declining, because the game is getting pretty old, and no game rules forever. Basically, you will never see a 11-12 million sub number for WoW again no matter how hard Blizzard tries.

What's interesting is that not only ESO, but also Wildstar and FFXIV are going subscription based, despite all the doom-and-gloom prophecy that P2P model is "dead". Perhaps they are banking that WoW is finally losing its magic among MMO players and will slowly but surely migrate towards other games and call them their new home.

I will personally check out ESO and Wildstar. Despite enjoying my time with WoW and this expansion in particular, I find every time I login I don't feel excited or interested, and it's just doing my daily routine.

[Skorpionss]

Lost interest in ESO completely when I heard this. I wouldn't have minded a model like GW2 but no way in hell am I paying a sub.

[l33t]

Well, to be honest, its not about the pay system, or even about cheap it or not to pay for wow and eso at the same time. I just don't like the idea of supporting yet another potential swtor, giving away my money to greedy and cynical developers. I'm just not sure if the game will be worth it, and it won't be and abomination like swtor was in the end.

[Deleted]

And ESO doesn't look anywhere near polished enough to maintain a sub.

Isn't the game like a year away from release?

[Deleted]

Sorry but what is ESO? I never heard of it.

[Toffie]

WoW is boring, it's declining everyday.
ESO & Wildstar will surely grab thousand of former WoW veterans just like me.
I believe a sub based game is the key to succes, you would never see WoW as popular as today if it hasn't been a monthly pay-to-play game. Wildstar does it better though, you can trade your earned gold for gametime which is just awesome.

[Deleted]

For a Bethesda dev:

"We have been in talks with Microsoft about that very thing, and seeing whether or not there's any room to change their minds about that for folks who are only playing The Elder Scrolls Online and don't want to pay for an Xbox Live Gold subscription just to play The Elder Scrolls Online. The answer right now is that's the way it works, but it's something that we're aware of and we keep pushing on to see if there's something that can be done."

In other words, ESO being sub based only affects ESO itself, they are already having problems with the decision they made.

[Vankrys]

Sorry but what is ESO? I never heard of it.

Elder Scrolls Online. Do you know Skyrim?

[Deleted]

For a Bethesda dev:

"We have been in talks with Microsoft about that very thing, and seeing whether or not there's any room to change their minds about that for folks who are only playing The Elder Scrolls Online and don't want to pay for an Xbox Live Gold subscription just to play The Elder Scrolls Online. The answer right now is that's the way it works, but it's something that we're aware of and we keep pushing on to see if there's something that can be done."

In other words, ESO being sub based only affects ESO itself, they are already having problems with the decision they made.

Few people bitching isn't an issue, if you can't afford to pay for sub then don't. :P