Horde racial's are overpowered. Why isn't this being addressed?

[Fluorescent0]

The same argument can be said backwards too.

If alliance sucks so much for raiding, horde racials are OP, every serious raider went horde etc etc... how come the second best US guild is alliance? Are they god's gift to raiding or something?

Outplaying (Midwinter did an awesome job this tier) and various problems had in the tier by other guilds as well (Exodus disbanded as a 25man raidguild which meant it had inner problems. Envy, the other guild behind them in world progress, basically had 4 of his core raiders help method for their first kill). But again:

Why should outplaying be needed? Why shouldn't two players, given equal skill, perform equally?

Are racials so much important to you that they have to be yet another imbalance between players?

[kidsafe]

Right, top 20 US is bleeding edge where a 1% difference can mean a kill or a wipe.

Doesn't apply to 99% of guilds...where stronger individual performances are the result of failure, not 1% racial bonuses.

It applies to general population balance/health. If all the good players are going Horde, why should I force myself to keep playing the inferior faction filled with inferior players? Alliance doesn't offer any compelling reason to stay other than aesthetics and the human racial for PVP...and even PVPers are going Horde because the playerbase is obviously better on the whole.

[Deleted]

I suppose 5 % more damage on beasts is the same for high end raiders and mid to low range raiders. Don't you think mid to low range also have very close (first)kills on their progression? That's not something exclusive to Method and their likes.

Of course players of none world first guilds can improve their play more then those 5 %, but no matter how low the dps, as troll it's 5 % higher on beasts.

[Deleted]

The WoW scene is horde biased. Just take a look at wowprogress or arenajunkies. Theres only disadvantages being alliance.

[Deleted]

i have spent hundreds of dollars moving alts. by no means will i quit the game because of this.
Why hasn't blizzard fixed the racial's so people can play what they want rather than what they need?

This is not one of your clever days, eh?

- - - Updated - - -

The WoW scene is horde biased. Just take a look at wowprogress or arenajunkies. Theres only disadvantages being alliance.

insta queue #ontopic

[Erolian]

I think the difference between want and need is starting to become extremely blurred in this thread. Obviously in a game where your character progression and strengths is the focus your racials will SEEM like a huge deal because we focus on the smallest of numbers in our quest to tune our characters perfectly. Under that microscope, and it is a microscope, racial bonuses are huge but when you step back and look at the big picture they really are not that big of a deal and getting a boss kill a day or a lockout earlier in the absolute worst case scenario that you'll likely never even see isn't a big deal for most at all. Yes in a world first race that's heated it can mean the world to those players or even on a server first race it can mean a lot but again in the large picture it just isn't a big deal. Its actually a pretty small number if you put into perspective how long raid tiers are and how much time you will spend in them. That, IMO, applies to the vast majority of raiders. Its sort of weird how everyone tries to emulate top players and will also copy the opinion of said player when that opinion doesn't honestly apply to their reality.

[sarasun]

Guys. All the top world first guilds that faction transferred are retards. They obviously weren't playing to perfection - if they would they'd oneshot every boss. They would be much better improving themselves because they're bads and can't be perfect on every single pull, therefore the dps increase of racials is irrelevant.

If you lost the server first race in your server (say a scrub, US 100th server) to a horde guild by one day, it cannot possibly be explained by racials. It 100% means they are better players than you are because you're not performing at your 100% potential.

(My sig might or might not be relevant)

[Deleted]

I think the difference between want and need is starting to become extremely blurred in this thread. Obviously in a game where your character progression and strengths is the focus your racials will SEEM like a huge deal because we focus on the smallest of numbers in our quest to tune our characters perfectly. Under that microscope, and it is a microscope, racial bonuses are huge but when you step back and look at the big picture they really are not that big of a deal and getting a boss kill a day or a lockout earlier in the absolute worst case scenario that you'll likely never even see isn't a big deal for most at all. Yes in a world first race that's heated it can mean the world to those players or even on a server first race it can mean a lot but again in the large picture it just isn't a big deal. Its actually a pretty small number if you put into perspective how long raid tiers are and how much time you will spend in them. That, IMO, applies to the vast majority of raiders. Its sort of weird how everyone tries to emulate top players and will also copy the opinion of said player when that opinion doesn't honestly apply to their reality.

We only raid 2 nights a week (5/13hc currently), so we don't have a lot of time to waste. For us every lock out counts and the sooner we can put a boss behind us the better. As such I want to play my character to it's fullest. I reforge and gem as the boss needs it. As soon as I saw how powerfull the troll racial is in ToT I went troll. It fits my playstyle that I min/max my character. So why exactly should I pass those extra 5 % on beast bosses? Further, why should I care about reforging, gemming, enchanting? When you dismiss strong racials, you can also dismiss reforging or gemming or enchanting or going for the best trinkets like Lei Shen for demo locks.

[judgementofantonidas]

blizzard loves the horde.

[Erolian]

We only raid 2 nights a week (5/13hc currently), so we don't have a lot of time to waste. For us every lock out counts and the sooner we can put a boss behind us the better. As such I want to play my character to it's fullest. I reforge and gem as the boss needs it. As soon as I saw how powerfull the troll racial is in ToT I went troll. It fits my playstyle that I min/max my character. So why exactly should I pass those extra 5 % on beast bosses? Further, why should I care about reforging, gemming, enchanting? When you dismiss strong racials, you can also dismiss reforging or gemming or enchanting or going for the best trinkets like Lei Shen for demo locks.

Perhaps we just look at things differently but you might've missed the point of what I was saying in the first line. I also make a distinction between spending real money on my character and buying enchants/gems off the auction house though so perhaps that leads into it a bit as well.

[markdall]

Blizzard loves the horde. Just go horde. I did, even though I hate them. The game has never been better. I just wish my stupid looking tauren paladin was my original day one of vanilla human paladin. It's still better though.

[Fluorescent0]

Perhaps we just look at things differently but you might've missed the point of what I was saying in the first line. I also make a distinction between spending real money on my character and buying enchants/gems off the auction house though so perhaps that leads into it a bit as well.

You don't necessarily have to spend real money on that, you can just switch character inbetween expansions (or tiers if your guild has good alt runs to initially gear up) without paying anything. What it creates, though, is faction imbalance which is hard to justify.

[Deleted]

Ok it's kinda true the 5% troll racial was too good in ToT.

But honestly the beast bosses (Horridon, Ji-Kun, Maegera & Tortos) aren't really that hard to kill on heroic so it was definately no make or break for world first lei shen (the only kill that actually mattered).

Other than that the troll racial is still great (especially for dot classes) but not crazy OP.

[Fluorescent0]

Ok it's kinda true the 5% troll racial was too good in ToT.

But honestly the beast bosses (Horridon, Ji-Kun, Maegera & Tortos) aren't really that hard to kill on heroic so it was definately no make or break for world first lei shen (the only kill that actually mattered).

Other than that the troll racial is still great (especially for dot classes) but not crazy OP.

Thok in PTR is looking to be quite a DPS check and it's marked as beast. It's also pretty late in the tier and drops tier tokens. It may just be PTR tuning, but it could turn to be quite a bit worse this tier.

[Inthislzon]

I'll just leave this link here.

http://www.wowhead.com/spell=63042

Because horde racials were "always superior".

[Fluorescent0]

I'll just leave this link here.

http://www.wowhead.com/spell=63042

Because horde racials were "always superior".

They learned from that mistake and other mindcontrol abilities can't be broken by EMFH. On the other hand, next tier has two beasts, one of which is looking to be quite a DPS check. Oh, for the record, WotF worked on that too.

[halfawake]

Well hey as a troll moonkin, worgen is better than anything horde has to offer... I would assume its the same for fire mages! The only thing I agree with is that beastslaying is too strong but other than that only orc is very good. Also both sides have pandas which come out to best race for lots of classes I'm sure (at least I know I was told it's best for rogues)

[cyqu]

Right, top 20 US is bleeding edge where a 1% difference can mean a kill or a wipe.

Doesn't apply to 99% of guilds...where stronger individual performances are the result of failure, not 1% racial bonuses.

yes and when you are in low levels of gear progressing hard dps checks with many like 1,2,3% wipes those damage racials will show there worth

[MagicBanana]

Blizzard nerfed Will of the Forsaken into the ground, supposedly for being over-powered in PvP. Then they gave the same ability to humans and nobody seemed to mind. Horde favoritism indeed.

Yeah, AFTER it was nerfed to the ground. Really quite fair indeed.

[Sierra85]

Personally don't find them overpowered. Some are situationally good while others are used for more offensive roles, while the alliance has more defensive racials. It's playing into the theme of horde vs alliance and how they approach things differently.

Overpowered is a bit of a stretch tbh.