Reason Dalaran does not show up is....WAT?!

[Deleted]

They just miss epic moments and response with cheap messages like this. The game could be much better if things really happend as they were excepted and not this dumbed down way. We are not the main heroes, but still heroes. How to make us feel like that? Pour a lot of non elit npc-s there. We will still be heroes chopping down hundreds and only having bigger fights at the bosses or elit packs. It could work. The only problem I see are players with 10 year old computers still thinking its not yet time to upgrade their config... So Blizzard cannot increase the quality.

[Verdugo]

Mages from the mage towers.

That doesnt really sound like an effective bombardment.

[Flutterguy]

That doesnt really sound like an effective bombardment.

Not if you were using traditional artillery, but something about the arcane makes me think it would not matter. Unless of course you think magic follows the laws of physics to a fault.

[Deleted]

I'm pretty sure that violates previously established lore about Shaman, I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that the Shaman got his power from the Elements granting it, and they can take it away if you're being a dick with it.

Dark shaman lore in its infant stages has been around since TBC, with some fel orcs having dark shaman NPCs and Ner'zhul in the Beyond the Dark Portal novel using some odd, dark shaman style spells, claiming he'd 'learned some new skills in the mean time'.

The lore class was revisited in Cata, first in The Shattering, where Thrall is forced to bully the spirit of fire into cooperation, and then as the shaman employed by the Twilight's Hammer.

The next appearance was when Garrosh employed dark shaman to strike against Northwatch in Tides of War, after that we had the dark shaman cult within Ragefire in the pre-MoP patch. Now, we're seeing the Kor'kron dark shaman.

It's an extension of the original lore, where a shaman had to ask the elements at all times. Now, this only applies to proper shaman, who actually understand that dark shamanism is destructive and highly dangerous, especially in a post-Cataclysm Azeroth.

[Deleted]

Cheap excuses!

Only thing that needed to be said.

I'd have a drop more respect for Blizzard if they just came out and said "we honestly could not be bothered" than when they hide behind bullshit excuses like this.

How does "a city ontop of a city" cause performance issues? It doesn't have to be the whole of Dalaran replete with vendors, NPCs and buildings. They literally had to use a paper cut-out of the visible underbelly and outer walls/player facing sides and have low-poly fire and frostballs fly out of it.

People with low draw distance/fog wouldn't see it anyway most likely so it's irrelevant.

The second that "players should feel like they defeated Garrosh" is bullshit aswell. In every boss in history we have had massive assistance from outside forces whether that's dragon aspects, major lore characters (Thrall, Maiev, Kalecgos, the druids in Firelands) or a weakening influence on the enemy. Why the sudden shift? We know in lore that we're not the ones who "get" the killing blow anyway because our characters are merely un-named adventurers and foot-soldier types.

There is a HUGE fucking difference between a single Mary Sue character literally fucking raping the boss and turning him into orange goo (Thrall vs Deathwing), and a flying fortress killing a few un-named Wyvern Riders and blowing up a wall or two. The justification does not hold water.

It comes down to pure laziness and once again trying to put in the Alliance parts last-minute and running out of time. This will never change.

[Nadiru]

Dark shaman lore in its infant stages has been around since TBC, with some fel orcs having dark shaman NPCs and Ner'zhul in the Beyond the Dark Portal novel using some odd, dark shaman style spells, claiming he'd 'learned some new skills in the mean time'.

The lore class was revisited in Cata, first in The Shattering, where Thrall is forced to bully the spirit of fire into cooperation, and then as the shaman employed by the Twilight's Hammer.

The next appearance was when Garrosh employed dark shaman to strike against Northwatch in Tides of War, after that we had the dark shaman cult within Ragefire in the pre-MoP patch. Now, we're seeing the Kor'kron dark shaman.

It's an extension of the original lore, where a shaman had to ask the elements at all times. Now, this only applies to proper shaman, who actually understand that dark shamanism is destructive and highly dangerous, especially in a post-Cataclysm Azeroth.

Huh, cool.

[Togarox]

It's resting on higher ground. Get some boulders up there and just let gravity take its course.

Replace the boulders with mana bombs and you got a pretty effective weapon.

[Deleted]

The second that "players should feel like they defeated Garrosh" is bullshit aswell. In every boss in history we have had massive assistance from outside forces whether that's dragon aspects, major lore characters (Thrall, Maiev, Kalecgos, the druids in Firelands) or a weakening influence on the enemy. Why the sudden shift? We know in lore that we're not the ones who "get" the killing blow anyway because our characters are merely un-named adventurers and foot-soldier types.

Pssssst, every single fight where we had help has caused masses of bitching.

[Deleted]

Pssssst, every single fight where we had help has caused masses of bitching.

Sorry, see my edit.

There's a difference between Thrall beating the shit out of Deathwing almost single-handedly with a super-weapon before we just go in with the mop and clean up the orange goop, and a massive flying fortress providing some aerial support against un-named Wyvern Riders.

We (the player) are still the entire ground-assault and slayer of Garrosh unless Jaina pilots the fortress into his throne room.

[Deleted]

I don't understand why though. Our characters are moving through the story, lore figures are the story.

I don't understand it meself, but hey, we've seen in Cata just how much impact bitching loudly enough can have.

Sorry, see my edit.

There's a difference between Thrall beating the shit out of Deathwing almost single-handedly before we just go in with the mop and clean up the orange goop, and a massive flying fortress providing some aerial support against un-named Wyvern Riders.

We (the player) are still the entire ground-assault and slayer of Garrosh unless Jaina pilots the fortress into his throne room.

Agreed, but I reckon it can hardly be waved away as a non-issue. You and me both know there would be bitching either way.

[Deleted]

But wait a second...These story decisions are made well in advance and cannot be changed because it would undo too much of the work of the other development teams creating assets for said story points.

Not necessarily. I mean apparently before they realised the technical difficulties involved their plan was just to plonk the in-game city of Dalaran above SoO so that really doesn't require much new work.

Also my impression from recent interviews was that while the major plot points must be fixed, there is room to change things. And keep in mind that they haven't reworked what Dalaran's doing during the siege, they've just dropped it. Abandoning plot points completely is easier than creating new ones to replace them. At worst a few assets are left unused.

[Deleted]

Im still convinced the majority of groaning about Dragon Soul had to do with the fact that is lasted nearly a year and was nerfed into oblivion even on the hardmodes while it was active. nitpicking reaches fever pitch in that situation.

TBH, I'm more concerned about the obviously cut content, just because people cried OMGREHASH FFS. I mean, there's concept art. There's actual datamined stuff that was obviously to be used at some stage of development. But oh no, just because it would have been set in bleeding Silithus, it had to be cut.

There's good player feedback, and there's bad player feedback. Sadly, both can influence the development of the game.

[Wyrt]

At least Dalaran has a reason for not being there.

[Deleted]

They should have it just bomb the city itself, but not do any other to help the players, don't see how it would feel like dalaran was the reason we "won".

[Shyzhi]

If Dalaran is there droping bombs on Orgrimmar then it feels like " we are here just to clean up" then accturly be the ones storming it from the ground. Ofc it could of been nice to see dalaran there but.. im kinda happy it aint :P

[Coolascancer]

the part about it being laggy is more to the point. they could get creative with the fight meaning the other excuse about player participation level is moot. 3 seconds of thinking and you have a phase which emphasizes dalaran's/jaina's deathstar capabilities, killing adds, knocking off pieces of terrain that garrosh would use, direct damage to garrosh or whatever machinations he has. another phase of the fight where dalaran has been cut off from you and you have to kill garrosh through normal means of "NUKE NUKE NUKE"... so... point being that lag is probably more of an issue, and it would add time to the project.

i would think it way better if you got garrosh to 10 percent and jaina piloted dalaran into the throne room for an independence day like explosion. (someone mentioned her doing that)

[Eazy]

I think the real reason was that Blizzard didn't have enough time.

[Polybius]

WE GET TO SACK ORGRIMMAR.

It's the bloody daft bigots like you who give us Alliance a bad name, all because you want EVERYTHING to be catered to your every whim (I'm looking at you, Mr. "Let's destroy half the Horde's starting zones, because it used to be an Alliance kingdom" - it it wasn't even the current Alliance's kingdom).

/rant.

Omg lol. I wish I could use this as my sig. It's very true that they give us Alliance a bad name, which is why I don't give out candy anymore. For the True Alliance!

[Asotcha]

If anyone really wants to know more about this choice, go listen to wowcrendors recent interview with cory stockton on youtube. he talks about this a little bit.

[Rizendragon]

The reason Dalaran doesn't show up is because it's exclusively an Alliance city now, and if they used Dalaran to fuck up Orgrimmar, Blizzard would have to acknowledge that Dalaran is an Alliance city and they have shown no desire to do that.

So? Replace destroyed Theramore with Dalaran 2.0 and make that the Alliance staging area. Have the Horde Staging area be in Razor Hill. I'm not going to be a happy player if they never bring back Dalaran as an exclusive Alliance City.