Has the game become harder than TBC?

[Panjier]

Easier? No. Different? Yes.

Heroic dungeons now are a complete joke. As soon as you're max level you que and you might spend an extra 5 mins in them. Back in BC there was a reason that LFG didn't exist. People were still using things like CC. Also you couldn't just be a fresh 70 and hope to get into heroic dungeons because you probably weren't able to put out the numbers you needed.

Raids weren't extremely harder back in TBC, but like SoO there was a lot more put on individual performance so everyone had to be on the top of their game. There was no LFR hero type person back then.

[Bigbazz]

Honestly as someone in TBC I don't think that "individual responsibility" was a big part of TBC raiding.

Kael Thas as a Fury Warrior

Phase 1 - no threat of dying

- Kite to P1 while ranged kill, no effort
Kite to P2 use berserker rage against fear and kill
Stay to the side while ranged kite to P3
Kill engineer where he spawns.

Phase 2

AOE nuke weapon adds down within time frame, grab sword + dagger. risk of death from overagro but healable

Phase 3

Melee on fear boss dps race and then run to engineer, kite if you get focussed, ranged deal with others. No risk of death for me here.

Phase 4 - dps race + interupts. dps 100k shield and interrupt pyro or tank dies on 2nd cast (legend shield absorbs 1).
Move from 1 massive easy to see fire mechanic
Don't attack MC people for risk of killing them, rogues deal with it using shiv.
Don't dps the phoenix, tank will kite it until it kills itself. Nuke down the egg.

Phase 5 - fly around, avoid healing debuff, interupt and dps.



So basically my personal responsibility was limited. The fight was long and complex and required the raid to take care of a lot of things at once, but to be honest unlike MOP raiding there wasn't a great deal of things for me to worry about that were going to kill me. Yes the fight was very difficult and beating it was by todays standards comparable to heroic modes, but in terms of surviving the fight it was easy compared to MOP. In MOP you have things you constantly have to avoid in order to survive, it is less about these massive team efforts doing completely seperate tasks (because of shared 10/25 man) and more about individual avoid fire efforts.

[Tekkommo]

Raids are harder, everything else is easier.

[Dirdie]

Let's see...

Attunments....gone
Requiring CC....gone
Tanks worrying about threat....gone
Resist gear....gone

Just to name a few reasons why things are easier

those things don't make the game harder, they just make it more time consuming.

[Deleted]

I dunno.. I cant imagine a LFR group being able to down Kael or leotharis the blind

Same can be said for Thok if they haven't nerfed his stacking buff in LFR.

[Brakthir]

Making things more time consuming doesn't make things easier. Getting resist sets wasn't harder. It was time consuming. Attunements weren't harder. They were time consuming.

Heroic raiding today is the most complex and difficult raiding this game has ever seen. BC raiding is like an abacus in a world of modern computers.

[Deleted]

I can blood boil spam tank any heroic now
I had to plan for every single pack in Heroic Shatter Halls

Clearly no

[Durandro]

I can blood boil spam tank any heroic now
I had to plan for every single pack in Heroic Shatter Halls

Clearly no

You're cherry picking.

[lunchbox2042]

Classes have gotten much more balanced gameplay wise. Raids have become more complex mechanic wise but there are more tools available as opposed to BC. You have video guides, more addons, and more overall strategies plus ptr testing which helps guilds learn bosses before they're officially available.

[Raidboss]

As a tank back in the days i never ever worried about threat, except for healers maybe.

As a Warlock in BC I had to soul shatter as much as possible to keep from going over tanks!

[Deleted]

@People complaining about hero dungeon
the current heroic dungeon is challenge mode. Those are actually more damanding and fun as a group to play.
Todays heroic dungeon is tbc normal mode.

Some things however got undeniable easy, i.E. stancedance removal for warrior, playing war perfect was more challenging before.

[Alvito]

People have just gotten better, in a nutshell.

I do enjoy the rants from people that have been playing for 7 years crying the game is too easy. Now some things are easier now then before that is bound to happen. Some of the PVE stuff the fights for the most part are way more complex and if we had a magical time machine to pull people out of BT and dump them in something like HoF they would have all quit because of the huge ramp up in things going on and over all complexity.

[Durandro]

those things don't make the game harder, they just make it more time consuming.

Exactly.

Things were only 'hard' in TBC if you didn't do them the 'correct' way.

Speed run 5 mans without a Prot Paladin? Lololololol

DPS Shaman/Warrior/Paladin in a 5 man? Lolololololol

Not bringing loads of Resto Shaman to a raid? Lololololol

It was all about preparation back then. Things are more streamlined now, with more viable options. But things have gotten exceedingly more difficult in other respects.

[Raidboss]

those things don't make the game harder, they just make it more time consuming.

Coordinating proper CC could be quite hard....Doing all the steps in attunments or finding people to help you was also quite hard when it came to getting into BT...warlock tanking illidan during demon phase required resist gear and throwing a dps into a tanking role was also hard...

[Haywire5714]

Heroic dungeons are way easier, and extremely boring. That's one of the places where they failed miserably this expansion. The raiding however is way harder, and everything else wasn't even hard to begin with; just more grindy.

[Raidboss]

Exactly.

Things were only 'hard' in TBC if you didn't do them the 'correct' way.

Speed run 5 mans without a Prot Paladin? Lololololol

DPS Shaman/Warrior/Paladin in a 5 man? Lolololololol

Not bringing loads of Resto Shaman to a raid? Lololololol

It was all about preparation back then. Things are more streamlined now, with more viable options. But things have gotten exceedingly more difficult in other respects.

Prot paladin's were few & far between on my server. Most tanks were bears and warriors. I don't even remember ret being raid viable in BC.

[Sal the Shieldhog]

Players have become better, but raids have gotten harder.

Compare a BC boss with a MoP boss. A BC boss will have 2, maybe 3 mechanics to watch out for. A MoP boss will have 2-3 mechanics that everyone needs to watch for, on top of personal responsibilities for each raider (specific tank, DPS, and healer mechanics).

Other aspects of the game have gotten easier, both actually and seemingly, but that's also because of all the information we can share now. We didn't have as many ways to share things like class strategies and boss fights back then.

Take for instance, another part of the game: Guild recruitment. It's easy to find a new guild these days, much moreso than it used to be, because of things like WoWProgress. Joining certain guilds may be harder than others though.

All-in-all, I'd say the way the game is played has become much more difficult in some aspects than in others.

[Fluttershy]

How to play a mage/warlock/hunter in BC

1111111111111111111111111 (well ok you had to press 2 to apply hunter's mark and curse of shadows/elements).

BC was bretty hard and skill based! The difference between a top end hunter/warlock from an average one was definitely obvious!

[Raidboss]

Compare a BC boss with a MoP boss. A BC boss will have 2, maybe 3 mechanics to watch out for. A MoP boss will have 2-3 mechanics that everyone needs to watch for, on top of personal responsibilities for each raider (specific tank, DPS, and healer mechanics).

Kael'Thas says hi!

A four phase boss with 4 adds in one phase with different abilities...
a 7 add phase needing healers, dps, and tanks to perform a role...
then another 4 add phase but stronger than the first...
and then if you live you get the fight the boss who also has a couple personal phases

All in total a 5 phase fight if I remember correctly

[Snorkles]

We had three Paladins in our guild in TBC and it was a logistical nightmare trying to get all three to cooperate when buffing. That's at least one thing which is easier nowadays.