Put Immersion BACK Into The Game

[melodramocracy]

Some advice: don't wait until the TLDR line make a vague reference to humor. If you didn't want to upset folks - you need to make sure they know your "list" is for laughs within the first two lines of the post, not after a wall of a text.

If anyone is so inept at reading that they thought that was a 'wall of text', then they deserve to miss the OP's intent to begin with. He's not responsible for somoene else's lack of basic skills.

[Raeln]

Really, cause I read:


This is essentially making a TL;DR. Why would I put the cart before the horse, or the punchline before the farce? That is not good humor.

ON TOPIC: I would not mind at all if these items were returned to WoW. As someone who played in TBC, I actually enjoyed it then, and would do it again. Though, for all practical purposes, the game has improved and removed smaller elements which were more troublesome.

Prefacing a post with a "disclaimer" that is describing the tone of the post is not a TLDR.

Out here in the real world, stringing people along with a long post that conveys a "serious" tone only to append the last line with a "oh, but I'm just joking" tagline can be called something else.

I'll leave you deduce what that something else is.

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If anyone is so inept at reading that they thought that was a 'wall of text', then they deserve to miss the OP's intent to begin with. He's not responsible for somoene else's lack of basic skills.

A list of 25 items can be construed as a "wall of text". We aren't talking about a short list of 5 things here.

Some of those items have been very contentious over the years as well.

[Deleted]

God, I never wanna see ammo and use up a bag slot just for that. To many times did it happen I forgot to fill my bag with ammo and under a boss fight suddenly was out of ammo. :I Was always a pain xD

Honestly dont really miss most of those listed things. Even if like quests for the class mounts was fun, would like to have one such quest for each class.

[-Superman-]

Holy crap i can't believe this thread is still going. This is great!

I loved the mechanics of this post. This just shows that people can get so upset over something as small as their own mistake to not read the whole post before aimlessly shooting down the poster. Well done, Superman. Well done.

Thanks. I've enjoyed discussing items within the thread, but certain folks who feel duped by not enjoying the last line are now attempting to disrupt and derail the original topic.

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If anyone is so inept at reading that they thought that was a 'wall of text', then they deserve to miss the OP's intent to begin with. He's not responsible for somoene else's lack of basic skills.

Very valid point. I also agree my points are hardly a wall of text. A "wall of text" is multiple paragraphs, sometimes no separated, making your eyes strain to focus on what to read next. I thought my list was well assembled.

[Deleted]

Thanks. I've enjoyed discussing items within the thread, but certain folks who feel duped by not enjoying the last line are now attempting to disrupt and derail the original topic.

You can't expect us to read everything, that would be silly!

[-Superman-]

Prefacing a post with a "disclaimer" that is describing the tone of the post is not a TLDR.

Out here in the real world, stringing people along with a long post that conveys a "serious" tone only to append the last line with a "oh, but I'm just joking" tagline can be called something else.

I'll leave you deduce what that something else is.

I will ask nicely once more for you to stay on topic, or I shall be forced to report this as a derailment.

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God, I never wanna see ammo and use up a bag slot just for that. To many times did it happen I forgot to fill my bag with ammo and under a boss fight suddenly was out of ammo. :I Was always a pain xD

Honestly dont really miss most of those listed things. Even if like quests for the class mounts was fun, would like to have one such quest for each class.

I think class quests are an awesome idea. It would re-connect you with your class and provide even a small sense of accomplishment just for you and that character.

[Lovechile]

No. Can we just not? Especially the hunter ones. It sucked being the only class REQUIRED to spend money to raid.

[-Superman-]

No. Can we just not? Especially the hunter ones. It sucked being the only class REQUIRED to spend money to raid.

Don't worry. We will never again endure those items. Though there are those of us who sometimes miss enduring them

[Raeln]

I will ask nicely once more for you to stay on topic, or I shall be forced to report this as a derailment.

Wait, you read my very long bullet point breakdown of your own list - then only responded to the very last item of my post - clung to that like glue rather than respond to any of the other content and then threaten me with derailing YOUR thread?

Why didn't you respond to any of my other comments on your list items and great debate could have ensued?

[-Superman-]

Wait, you read my very long bullet point breakdown of your own list - then only responded to the very last item of my post - clung to that like glue rather than respond to any of the other content and then threaten me with derailing YOUR thread?

Why didn't you respond to any of my other comments on your list items and great debate could have ensued?

I did not take issue with your response to the OP. I took issue with your attempts to derail the thread. Your bulleted responses, much like my OP, is subjective, and you are therefore entitled to your opinion when responding to each of my items. I agreed on some, and not with others. I just want us to stay on topic

[Raeln]

I did not take issue with your response to the OP. I took issue with your attempts to derail the thread. Your bulleted responses, much like my OP, is subjective, and you are therefore entitled to your opinion when responding to each of my items. I agreed on some, and not with others. I just want us to stay on topic

The smiley face is noted.

Just don't throw punches back, then threaten people with reporting them for derailment when you are just as guilty of derailing your own thread.

Have a nice day and a Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays.

[-Superman-]

The smiley face is noted.

Just don't throw punches back, then threaten people with reporting them for derailment when you are just as guilty of derailing your own thread.

Have a nice day and a Merry Christmas or Happy Holidays.

Merry Christmas to you as well! And as I will not be around for a couple weeks, Haopy New Year too

[Olrox]

"Immersion" is one of those buzz words that everyone is tossing around right now, and most people never really make the effort to really reflect on what the word actually means.

WoW is way more immersive than it has ever been, and the whole idea that "convenience destroys immersion" is a fallacious assumption in itself. "Loss of immersion" obviously largely gets confused with "quality of life". Further, people seem to assume that there can be no such thing as too much immersion in a game, which is also fallacious in itself. The whole point of video games is that it's a reactive, and increasingly interactive medium that builds on the principles of game and problem-solving behavior. The more you get truly immersed, the more the experience takes you away from the mindset of functionally and constructively interacting with the game's systems and interfaces. Gaming will never be the leading immersive medium, books and films will be ahead no matter what and it lies in the nature of the medium. There's also nothing wrong about it.

I agree completely about "immersion" and its status as a new buzz-word; people I don't think realize what immersion actually is and that there are almost no games that actually immerse you in their world - mostly because a lot of that comes from constructing some of the fictional world's properties in your own head (i.e. reading books and having to picture locales and faces of major places and characters on your own since the medium isn't visual) and games just aren't made for that.

Little things like having to carry a quiver and use ammunition aren't immersive..they're annoying and silly - why should someone be punished for playing a hunter? If hunters should need ammunition again, then I guess every single class with spells should need components to cast them and everyone's armor should need flat-out replaced after it's been repaired so many times.

Also, why in the hell would anyone want to have the "dead zone" for hunter weapons again? I'm sure you've heard of being shot "point blank" which essentially means that the gun's barrel was VERY close to the thing shot, such that missing was extremely improbable. If that's true, why should a hunter just magically not be able to fire his gun when he's close? Not very immersive if you ask me.

I again just think you want to cash in some nostalgia dollars and make the game go technologically backwards again; most of the things you want were removed or changed for very good reasons.

[Paarthurnax]

Bring back the scourge event. I'll show people immersion!

The game needs to recapture the sense of a journey. Back in TBC you had to put forth allot of work to get to the top of whatever you were doing, raids/instances/pvp were all difficult to a degree and nothing was ever handed to you so you can "see the content". You had to work for all of it and in the end you appreciated all the bumps along the way and you came out of the process a better player and more appreciative of it.

[melodramocracy]

why should someone be punished for playing a hunter?

The better question is why do you think you're being 'punished' via this relatively simple mechanism? Do you play FPS games and bitch about not having infinite ammo?

On second thought, don't answer that.

[Redpanda]

id rather not go back to the hunter dark ages. nostalgia isnt always a good thing. You waste for time "prepping" than actually raiding

[OzoAndIndi]

So, after some recent discussion, it would seem convenience is destroying immersion.

IMO I think Blizz and players are both equally at fault here. Growing laziness of players who want instant gratification drives convenience and simplicity from a company that seeks to keep players as a source of revenue by making it easier for players to get what they want sooner... :\

Although I started late enough that I missed out on the days where Rogues had to make their own poison. Maybe some might think that's too much of a hassle, but I think it would be awesome. Where I play I still have to level up the lock picking when I make a new Rogue... I like doing it, it's hardly difficult to go get those few more points each level and I don't understand why Blizz removed the need to work on it...I mean it's part of the flavor of the class. It also separates you from the Rogues who don't bother and are left just standing there unable to unlock something when asked/needed. I'd love to include creating poisons. I'd ALSO love it if Alchemy also gave Rogues a couple/few extra poisons to create!

[draykorinee]

The better question is why do you think you're being 'punished' via this relatively simple mechanism? Do you play FPS games and bitch about not having infinite ammo?

On second thought, don't answer that.

It was a bag space lost IIRC, cost a lot of gold and often gimped dps if you weren't able to get the best ammo, hunter was my main until end of wrath, although the term punished is a bit ott, it certainly felt like playing a hunter had an unneccassary drawback, but it wasn't the only class to have such things. (the infinite ammo analogy doesnt work though :P)

[Illdian]

This list proves how much Cata and MoP improved the game.

hehe so much this

[Deleted]

Only thing I could agree on is bringing back attunaments and Class/mount specific quests.

Rest is an absolute NO-NO:

Dark Age of Hunters. And min. firing range? I'm sorry, but you can't put a gun directly at a person's head and fire it in real life?

And don't get me started on forced use of bag space. Played warlock through Vanilla to TBC... I'm so glad they're gone. Having to carry 50 shards aground, while having only 20 free space slots wasn't fun.

Group quests? Yes the ones that nobody will ever do again, once new content comes out (despite giving great reward and exp for its lvl but is impossible to get a 5man group). Mind you they do still exist, aka the Ring of Blood quests.

Centering AH, mail, etc. to a single part of city and leaving the rest empty and lifeless?

Old talent trees.... do you really want an illusion of choice, where the end result for a specific type of gameplay will always be the same?

Skill training. Now while I do agree you should visit a trainer for learn a skill you didn't know before, the rest is something that automatically grows when you grow stronger.

I don't even know where the idea came for failing to pick up a flower PROPERLY. See how silly this sounds?

And the shaman/pally argument. Sorry, but as the story of WoW progresses, more lore gets added. So I'm failing to see the issue, unless you're a "purist".