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  1. #781
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    What do you guys think of my Demon hunter class concept? I think I achieved what most people think when they think of Demon hunter. But I had little problems with imagination after Glaivemaster spec, but I am kinda satisfied what I achieved.
    it didnt use agi or mail. other than that it looks kind of fine

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ginantonicus View Post
    I'd have to say the trouble is ppl want solid evidence that DH will or won't be introduced and until they get it they will just keep chasing there tails.
    which is a problem
    Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
    Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
    Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
    Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
    Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
    Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor

  2. #782
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    We've already established how they're thematically the same. Again, a Scarlet Crusader, Blood Knight, and Sunwalker are all still Paladins despite having different lore, and motivations. According to your silly argument, we should make classes for all three variations of the same thing.
    No, you haven't established how they're thematically the same. You just presented the case that suborders within a class can follow different methods, while retaining the same theme.

    Demon Hunters and Warlocks do not share the same theme. Evidence is in the fact that Warlocks are frail spellcasters who use demon minions, while Demon Hunters are shadowy warriors. A difference in motivation is on top of the difference in themes.

    Immolation burns surrounding enemies. Immolation Aura burns surrounding enemies. Difference?
    Immolation drains a resource, that being Mana. Immolation also does not pulse damage, while Hellfire does. The range of Hellfire is arguably larger radius as well. Immolation Aura works like Fire Nova Totem.

    Which would still be the same ability, no matter what the source of it is. See how lore means little?
    Which proves what? They share an ability. There is no rule saying two classes can not share a spell.

    Are you suggesting Druids and Priestess of the Moon are the same class for having Starfall?

    They also share the demonic theme, up to the point of even both having demonic minions.
    Demon Hunters do not have demonic minions. If they were to be a playable class, this would be even further the case. There is no lore suggesting that they have minions. The only Demon Hunters who did enslave demons were the Illidari, and they were the bad guys.

    Not even close. A Mage for example wouldn't become a Warrior simply because he could equip a 2H sword.

    Yet, that's all it would take for a Warlock to mirror a Demon Hunter.
    It wouldn't be like a Mage picking up a sword, it would be like a Mage stopping the use of magic and learning to fight like a Warrior. That's what a Warlock needs to do to become a Demon Hunter.

    Dark Apotheosis displays this clearly. Warlocks are able to Tank using this form, and it is effectively known as Warlock Tanking. If this was truly being a Demon Hunter as you describe, then why are Warlocks still never referred to as Demon Hunters? It's obvious that they are not the same class.
    Last edited by Thimagryn; 2014-02-14 at 11:13 PM.

  3. #783
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Its common sense that Blizzard wouldn't release a class called a Demon Hunter into the game, since it would cause confusion with the base Hunter class.

    Its the same reason you won't see an Arch Druid, Arch Mage, or Shadow Hunter class.
    how the hell would it cause confusion?
    Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
    Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
    Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
    Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
    Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
    Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor

  4. #784
    Merely a Setback Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ginantonicus View Post
    I'd have to say the trouble is ppl want solid evidence that DH will or won't be introduced and until they get it they will just keep chasing there tails.
    Except we have solid evidence.

    The problem is that we have people in this thread who simply refuse to accept that evidence because they have a love Jones for Illidan.

  5. #785
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Except we have solid evidence.

    The problem is that we have people in this thread who simply refuse to accept that evidence because they have a love Jones for Illidan.
    no plans does not equal not going to happen ever. get that through your head.
    Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
    Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
    Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
    Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
    Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
    Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor

  6. #786
    Quote Originally Posted by Thimagryn View Post
    Demon Hunters do not have demonic minions. If they were to be a playable class, this would be even further the case. There is no lore suggesting that they have minions. The only Demon Hunters who did enslave demons were the Illidari, and they were the bad guys.
    You just contradicted yourself there.

  7. #787
    My top 3 solutions for demon hunter lovers
    3. Play Diablo 3
    2. Pretend your favorite class is called demon hunter
    1. Shut up... Seriously just shut up about it.

  8. #788
    Quote Originally Posted by kcsaenz View Post
    My top 3 solutions for demon hunter lovers
    3. Play Diablo 3
    2. Pretend your favorite class is called demon hunter
    1. Shut up... Seriously just shut up about it.
    diablo 3 demon hunter is completely different than a warcraft demon hunter. so how about you shut up.
    Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
    Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
    Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
    Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
    Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
    Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor

  9. #789
    Quote Originally Posted by kcsaenz View Post
    My top 3 solutions for demon hunter lovers
    3. Play Diablo 3
    2. Pretend your favorite class is called demon hunter
    1. Shut up... Seriously just shut up about it.
    4. Change the name of your character to Demonhunter.

  10. #790
    Merely a Setback Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thimagryn View Post
    No, you haven't established how they're thematically the same. You just presented the case that suborders within a class can follow different methods, while retaining the same theme.

    Demon Hunters and Warlocks do not share the same theme. Evidence is in the fact that Warlocks are frail spellcasters who use demon minions, while Demon Hunters are shadowy warriors. A difference in motivation is on top of the difference in themes.
    Dark Apotheosis disproves that entire post. Sorry.


    Immolation drains a resource, that being Mana. Immolation also does not pulse damage, while Hellfire does. The range of Hellfire is arguably larger radius as well. Immolation Aura works like Fire Nova Totem.
    Isn't that a bit picky? Clearly Immolation Aura comes from Aura of Immolation which in itself came from Illidan via Well of Eternity.

    Which proves what? They share an ability. There is no rule saying two classes can not share a spell.
    They share the defining Demon Hunter ability. It would be like Shaman getting Storm Earth and Fire from the Brewmaster.

    Are you suggesting Druids and Priestess of the Moon are the same class for having Starfall?
    Priestess of the Moon isn't a class, and will never be a class because Druids and Hunters occupy their design space.

    However to answer your question, Priestess of the Moon are combinations of Druids and Hunters. So partially yes.

    Demon Hunters do not have demonic minions. If they were to be a playable class, this would be even further the case. There is no lore suggesting that they have minions. The only Demon Hunters who did enslave demons were the Illidari, and they were the bad guys.
    Nice contradiction there. We have both Demon Hunters AND Illidan using demonic minions in battle during TBC. That's canonical lore.

    Illidari are Demon Hunters. Illidari Demon Hunters enslaving demons indicates that Demon Hunters have and do enslave demons. In other words, its part of their theme.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    no plans does not equal not going to happen ever. get that through your head.
    There's that, GC's tweet, and the pretty blatant Warlock=DH connection that Blizzard has been constructing for the better part of a decade.

  11. #791
    Quote Originally Posted by Ginantonicus View Post
    You just contradicted yourself there.
    Not really, since we're never going to be playing as the Illidari. They're pretty much all dead.

  12. #792
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Dark Apotheosis disproves that entire post. Sorry.




    Isn't that a bit picky? Clearly Immolation Aura comes from Aura of Immolation which in itself came from Illidan via Well of Eternity.



    They share the defining Demon Hunter ability. It would be like Shaman getting Storm Earth and Fire from the Brewmaster.



    Priestess of the Moon isn't a class, and will never be a class because Druids and Hunters occupy their design space.

    However to answer your question, Priestess of the Moon are combinations of Druids and Hunters. So partially yes.



    Nice contradiction there. We have both Demon Hunters AND Illidan using demonic minions in battle during TBC. That's canonical lore.

    Illidari are Demon Hunters. Illidari Demon Hunters enslaving demons indicates that Demon Hunters have and do enslave demons. In other words, its part of their theme.

    - - - Updated - - -



    There's that, GC's tweet, and the pretty blatant Warlock=DH connection that Blizzard has been constructing for the better part of a decade.
    your the only one making a connection THAT DOESNT EXIST. blizzard would never admit to having plans for something because the would be constantly bothered by people asking when its coming and complaining that it isnt showing up soon enough. like character models

    them saying they have no plans means the can keep secret until its time to release it.

    its that bloody simple.
    Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
    Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
    Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
    Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
    Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
    Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor

  13. #793
    Merely a Setback Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    your the only one making a connection THAT DOESNT EXIST. blizzard would never admit to having plans for something because the would be constantly bothered by people asking when its coming and complaining that it isnt showing up soon enough. like character models

    them saying they have no plans means the can keep secret until its time to release it.

    its that bloody simple.
    Are you going to outright ignore the presence of DH abilities in both the Warlock and Rogue classes? What about Illidan becoming a source for Warlock abilities and lore? No other future WoW class had their lore, abilities, and theme purposely siphoned out to existing classes like Demon Hunters did.

    And it sort of makes sense when you consider that even the concept's name bars it from entering the game as a stand alone class.

  14. #794
    Quote Originally Posted by Thimagryn View Post
    Not really, since we're never going to be playing as the Illidari. They're pretty much all dead.
    You just said "Demon Hunters don't have pets. But these Demon Hunters have pets". That is a a contradiction.

  15. #795
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Isn't that a bit picky? Clearly Immolation Aura comes from Aura of Immolation which in itself came from Illidan via Well of Eternity.
    It's no more picky than differing Death Knights from Warlocks having Death Coil in name and spell icon.

    They share the defining Demon Hunter ability. It would be like Shaman getting Storm Earth and Fire from the Brewmaster.
    From a lore standpoint it is a defining ability. And it can be worked around by giving new gameplay mechanics, such as using Metamorphosis as it exists in Heroes of the Storm. The gameplay of that ability would fit in WoW's gameplay much more for a melee-centric fighter such as the Demon Hunter. Lore-wise, it retains obvious similarity to Warlocks, but it would be differentiated by Warlocks only having the ability to take that form in one spec, while Demon Hunters have it for all specs.

    Priestess of the Moon isn't a class, and will never be a class because Druids and Hunters occupy their design space.
    Tyrande is a Priestess of the Moon, and if you are to assert all those who use Starfall are Druids, then you are are labeling Tyrande as a Druid. Priestess of the Moon may not be a playable class, but it is referred to autonomously by their own titles.

    Nice contradiction there. We have both Demon Hunters AND Illidan using demonic minions in battle during TBC. That's canonical lore.

    Illidari are Demon Hunters. Illidari Demon Hunters enslaving demons indicates that Demon Hunters have and do enslave demons. In other words, its part of their theme.
    No contradiction at all. Zeliek is a Death Knight able to use Holy magic, by all means you are asserting that because he is able to use Holy magic that the entire theme of Death Knights is now Holy magic. Logical fallacy.

    Using exceptions as examples does not bring the Demon Hunter class any closer to Warlocks. If you want to RP your Warlock as an Illidari Demon Hunter who learned his Metamorphosis from Illidan, then you can do so. It doesn't make the exceptions to the rule any more applicable to the Night Elf Demon Hunters, whom a DH Player Class would be based off of.
    Last edited by Thimagryn; 2014-02-14 at 11:54 PM.

  16. #796
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Are you going to outright ignore the presence of DH abilities in both the Warlock and Rogue classes? What about Illidan becoming a source for Warlock abilities and lore? No other future WoW class had their lore, abilities, and theme purposely siphoned out to existing classes like Demon Hunters did.

    And it sort of makes sense when you consider that even the concept's name bars it from entering the game as a stand alone class.
    illidan BECAME A DEMON. anything related to demon hunters and him gets throw out the window. rogues have 1 spell and warlocks have 1 maybe 2 spells. there is no overlap. you only see overlap BECAUSE YOU WANT TO SEE IT. you want to destroy what people love and insult the demon hunter fans.
    Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
    Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
    Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
    Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
    Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
    Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor

  17. #797
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post
    illidan BECAME A DEMON. anything related to demon hunters and him gets throw out the window. rogues have 1 spell and warlocks have 1 maybe 2 spells. there is no overlap. you only see overlap BECAUSE YOU WANT TO SEE IT. you want to destroy what people love and insult the demon hunter fans.
    Going with that argument, one could say you can't see the overlap because you don't want to see it. I can see overlap in abilities, theme and lore.

  18. #798
    Quote Originally Posted by Ginantonicus View Post
    Going with that argument, one could say you can't see the overlap because you don't want to see it. I can see overlap in abilities, theme and lore.
    you see overlap because you want to see it. i dont see over lap because i have the imagination to see it as its own class without overlapping with existing classes.

    "Demon hunters also possess a plethora of magical abilities, most notably the ability to metamorphose. Many abilities also tend to vary from demon hunter to demon hunter, possibly derived from the type of demon that they originally partially absorbed."

    meta can easily be worked around or made into something that doesnt overlap with the warlocks one(that the stole from illidan)
    meta could also be different from each demon hunter depending on the demon the take their powers from.
    Anemo: traveler, Sucrose
    Pyro: Yanfei, Amber, diluc, xiangling, thoma, Xinyan, Bennett
    Geo: Noelle, Ningguang, Yun Jin, Gorou
    Hydro: Barbara, Zingqiu, Ayato
    Cyro: Shenhe, Kaeya, Chongyun, Diona, Ayaka, Rosaria
    Electro: Fischl, Lisa, Miko, Kujou, Raiden, Razor

  19. #799
    Quote Originally Posted by Ginantonicus View Post
    You just said "Demon Hunters don't have pets. But these Demon Hunters have pets". That is a a contradiction.
    They are more appropriately 'the Illidari'. They are not conventional Demon Hunters by any means, and they are Demon Hunters by relation of class. The motivations of the Illidari are malevolent in nature, which explains the use of demonic enslavement.

    Just the same, the Druids of the Flame are still "Druids", as they can still change their forms and command natural elements. However, they no longer have any reverence for nature, and they have become an exception for following a different creed. The only lasting relationship is that they share the same Class.

  20. #800
    Quote Originally Posted by Darkvoltinx View Post

    "Demon hunters also possess a plethora of magical abilities, most notably the ability to metamorphose. Many abilities also tend to vary from demon hunter to demon hunter, possibly derived from the type of demon that they originally partially absorbed."
    Dosen't that just prove why Demon Hunters can't be a class. In order to be a playable class don't DH have to be the same abilities?

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