Thanks Blizzard for the Censer of Eternal Agony

[Normie]

Any new 90 pretty much has to go there if they want to gear up so yes, you are forced. It's one of the reasons why I quit again after trying MoP out for a couple of months.

If you are new to the game on a PvP realm, you have read all the disclaimers et cetera and you know what you are getting into.

If you are someone's 4th alt on a PvP realm and you are having trouble getting 535 gear because of continual gankage then you are just a fail player who is unable to distinguish between the letters "P" and "E."

Re-roll on a PvE realm, spend 1-4 weeks leveling, and your problem is solved.

[Gray_Matter]

I think that in general most people, and by most people I mean 100% of people, believe that when you roll on a PvP realm you are subject to combat with other players.

Many people rolled on 50-50 PvP servers which inevitably became 99-1 PvP servers, which is actually a thing we call a "PvE server." They complained, because there was no "world PvP" (fair or otherwise).

Meanwhile, after those servers became 99-1 PvP servers, people rolled on them because it was the trendy thing to do, because all the sexy top 100 guilds roll PvP without actually having to ever do a single second of PvP.

And then suddenly PvP becomes available on these 99-1 PvP servers that have become fake PvE servers.

You really think there is a legitimate audience for your complaints?

World PvP is good. What is bad is the way these idiots go about things. They will kill you regardless of whether you have the debuff or not, they will target the new level 90's, they will target players when they know it's not a fair fight (3 frogs vs 1 already), they will attack players when they are trying to kill a rare and make them actually miss the rare, they will even call out and fake rares to gank people. World PvP was always about a battle with your mortal enemy, not killing low level quest givers. Now it's about finding a way to piss off the other players. How much can we annoy people today. Since when did the game get so bad that we started "farming" other players?

[Anzaman]

Instead of being ganked by censer players, you could have been ganked by horde/ally. There's really no difference, save for that censer players can verbally troll you a bit more easily. Which, of course, you can actually report.

For me, it's problematic when your own Faction member kills you, instead of enemy.

I like the idea of Alliance vs Horde, but I can't stand the idea of FFA.

[Normie]

World PvP is good. What is bad is the way these idiots go about things. They will kill you regardless of whether you have the debuff or not, they will target the new level 90's, they will target players when they know it's not a fair fight (3 frogs vs 1 already), they will attack players when they are trying to kill a rare and make them actually miss the rare, they will even call out and fake rares to gank people. World PvP was always about a battle with your mortal enemy, not killing low level quest givers. Now it's about finding a way to piss off the other players. How much can we annoy people today. Since when did the game get so bad that we started "farming" other players?

Oh bullshit dude. It's fun to kill people. If you have the advantage, it doesn't matter who it is or why or anything, it's just fun.

Anyone that pulls more than one frog while flagged without a vanish on CD is a retard who deserves to be a statistic on the way to someone's mount.

Grow up, step back, strategize, and come back a winner. Or roll on a PvE realm.

[Gray_Matter]

If you are new to the game on a PvP realm, you have read all the disclaimers et cetera and you know what you are getting into.

If you are someone's 4th alt on a PvP realm and you are having trouble getting 535 gear because of continual gankage then you are just a fail player who is unable to distinguish between the letters "P" and "E."

Re-roll on a PvE realm, spend 1-4 weeks leveling, and your problem is solved.

Censer is not world PvP. World PvP is about spotting an enemy in the distance and sizing up your opponent. It's about going into battle with your mortal enemy. It's not about being farmed by 5 censers.

[Normie]

For me, it's problematic when your own Faction member kills you, instead of enemy.

I like the idea of Alliance vs Horde, but I can't stand the idea of FFA.

Hot Tip: A person under the influence of the Censer is not YOUR OWN FACTION.

Okay, suppose, in your 99-1 Pv"P" world, you were crossrealmed tomorrow so that every zone was filled with just as many of the other faction.

Would that bother you? Would that be unfair? If your answer is "yes," then I think you are a weakling, and a hypocrite.

[Kaleredar]

For me, it's problematic when your own Faction member kills you, instead of enemy.

I like the idea of Alliance vs Horde, but I can't stand the idea of FFA.

You're being attacked by people that are hostile to you. What's the difference?

Is there some inherent difference between a rogue waiting to gank you versus a rogue waiting to gank you who's little tag happens to say "ally" or "horde?"

You either fight and kill em or you die. Same result.

[Normie]

Censer is not world PvP. World PvP is about spotting an enemy in the distance and sizing up your opponent. It's about going into battle with your mortal enemy. It's not about being farmed by 5 censers.

BULL SHIT.

PvP is about spotting a weak adversary and killing it before someone else does.

You are just in some black mental vortex hole filled with samurai and Arthurian bullshit.

[Darksoldierr]

Probably the best thing Blizzard did in a while in the outdoor world.

[Kaleredar]

Censer is not world PvP. World PvP is about spotting an enemy in the distance and sizing up your opponent. It's about going into battle with your mortal enemy. It's not about being farmed by 5 censers.

What prevents you from doing that? You can see someone under the effects of a censer. It just sounds to me like, instead of killing a hostile flagged person, like you apparently would do to the opposite faction without pause, you just hope and pray the censer people leave you alone.

"My mortal enemy" is anything in PvP that's flagged as red to me.

[Normie]

Is there some inherent difference between a rogue waiting to gank you versus a rogue waiting to gank you who's little tag happens to say "ally" or "horde?"

These whiners who bitch that their 99-1 Pv"P" realms have suddenly become 99-99 PvP realms are just ... I mean ... seriously. How can you even step up to a toilet and piss through your own dick if you complain about things like that.

Infracted.

[Anzaman]

Hot Tip: A person under the influence of the Censer is not YOUR OWN FACTION.

They are still recognized as members of Alliance/Horde after the effect is over, without any penalties of slaughtering your fellow heroes.

If I go and get myself drunk and harm somebody with knife during it, am I able to get away without penalties because I was drunk?

[DingDongKing]

For me, it's problematic when your own Faction member kills you, instead of enemy.

I like the idea of Alliance vs Horde, but I can't stand the idea of FFA.

Pretty much. People who consider it 'fun', well honestly they've got some issues as to what entertainment entails. Entertainment through PVP is when you take joy in defeating another player due to having more skill. Entertainment through PVP when you've basically gotten someone angry is just a base level of sadism. Sure, I've run around in SWTOR with an orb and blown up a gang of PVErs in the Ilum FFA zone, but I'd never go chasing one dude at a time. It's just cowardice.

[Kaleredar]

They are still recognized as members of Alliance/Horde after the effect is over, without any penalties of slaughtering your fellow heroes.

If I go and get myself drunk and harm somebody with knife during it, am I able to get away without penalties because I was drunk?

Well you're also able to just go around and casually murder things in WoW, which you really can't do in the real world either. You also can't fit dragons in mailboxes.


You get an honorable kill off of someone for killing them if they're under the effects of a censer. Just like you'd get for killing someone of the opposite faction who tries to gank you.

[Gray_Matter]

Oh bullshit dude. It's fun to kill people. If you have the advantage, it doesn't matter who it is or why or anything, it's just fun.

Anyone that pulls more than one frog while flagged without a vanish on CD is a retard who deserves to be a statistic on the way to someone's mount.

Grow up, step back, strategize, and come back a winner. Or roll on a PvE realm.

So for you, world PvP is actually about killing another player. No strategy needed, the quicker the better. That's not PvP, if you want that, why not just go to an enemy starting area and just kill low levels?

My point is that it's not about "grow up, step back, .....". There are thousands of games out there and probably more than a hundred MMO's. If I don't enjoy something or I find something stupid then I will just move on and play something else. I remember having some epic PvP battles in the past both while leveling and at max level. I even had a couple of good ones while leveling to 90 this time. Censer is not the same thing. It's a pathetic excuse for PvP.

[Kaleredar]

Pretty much. People who consider it 'fun', well honestly they've got some issues as to what entertainment entails. Entertainment through PVP is when you take joy in defeating another player due to having more skill. Entertainment through PVP when you've basically gotten someone angry is just a base level of sadism. Sure, I've run around in SWTOR with an orb and blown up a gang of PVErs in the Ilum FFA zone, but I'd never go chasing one dude at a time. It's just cowardice.

All of those things also describe rogues ganking noobs in STV, and yet that's a mainstay of PvP realms and has been since WoW began.

You can argue "well it SHOULD be X Y and Z" but frankly, at the end of the day, it's still PvP, which is what PvP realms are for.

[Gray_Matter]

These whiners who bitch that their 99-1 Pv"P" realms have suddenly become 99-99 PvP realms are just ... I mean ... seriously. How can you even step up to a toilet and piss through your own dick if you complain about things like that.

If at first you don't succeed, attack the person with whom you are debating. That's will definitely make you a winner every day of the week.

[Kaleredar]

So for you, world PvP is actually about killing another player.

Yeah that's actually quite literally what it means.

No strategy needed, the quicker the better.

When you're trying to get 500 kills? Yes, the quicker the better.

That's not PvP,

Yes, it is... It's a player, versus another player. In what way shape or form does that depart from "PvP?"

if you want that, why not just go to an enemy starting area and just kill low levels?

They don't give you nice currency to buy fancy mounts.

But more specifically, nothing is preventing you from getting better gear or FIGHTING BACK against people with the censer buff. Like, nothing. At all. This isn't a situation of a "level 6 versus a level 90." This is level 90 versus level 90. Just like battlegrounds, and just like world PvP on balanced PvP servers.

My point is that it's not about "grow up, step back, .....". There are thousands of games out there and probably more than a hundred MMO's. If I don't enjoy something or I find something stupid then I will just move on and play something else. I remember having some epic PvP battles in the past both while leveling and at max level. I even had a couple of good ones while leveling to 90 this time. Censer is not the same thing. It's a pathetic excuse for PvP.

There's literally no difference between one red flagged person versus another.

Hell, it actually favors people who DON'T have the effects of the censer buff, because you can stack the three timeless isle item buffs with the shrine buffs and food buff if you're just running around normally. Censer people can only get the effect of the food buff.

[Gray_Matter]

You get an honorable kill off of someone for killing them if they're under the effects of a censer. Just like you'd get for killing someone of the opposite faction who tries to gank you.

There is a serious imbalance in gear between censers and gearing up players. If I kill an enemy faction player while leveling or out in the world, that's the end of it. I don't "farm" them for honor.

[Algore]

Censer of Eternal Agony summarized: Heroic PvE-geared people killing newly dinged 90s for some pet and mount.