How long would you continue to raid without getting a gear upgrade?

[clevin]

Untill the end of time. If you raid for loot you're doing it very wrong.

says the 577 geared raider.

[Racthoh]

^ maybe that's because he's doing it right?

[clevin]

dont really care, gear is just a means to an end. i'd keep raiding until content is cleared.

we just roll on loot with members > trials and mainspec > offspec. no one really cares too much about loot in my guild (pretty mature people around) so it works well.

OP's guild was 14/14H 4 months ago. Clearing the content isn't the issue.

TOT: the issue is why OP is being passed over. Everyone pretends LC is awesome, but sometimes people aren't fair. I'd never raid without drops for 3 months unless I'd gotten a fair amount of loot early on and so was above the norm. But while the purpose of gear might be to make the raid as a whole more successful one motivating factor, ESPECIALLY after content is long cleared, is getting rewards. That's basic psychology.

[Herecius]

says the 577 geared raider.

Gear is a means to the end. Getting gear is merely a means to clearing content, which is the only thing that actually matters to me. So saying 'I don't care about gear' is technically incorrect, because I have to care about gear in order to clear content, but I most certainly do not clear content because I want gear, not at all.

That said, it is hard for a loot council to be infallible. And this thread reminds me that we need to add some kind of failsafe to ours that keeps somebody from going an extremely long time without an upgrade.

[clevin]

^ maybe that's because he's doing it right?

Possibly, but it's amusing to hear someone who's fully geared claiming gear isn't at all important to him.

[The Kao]

I haven't basically received a real upgrade since week 15 or so and look where we are now. Still raiding and not planning to quit at all so things keep flowing for my guild & friends.

Possibly, but it's amusing to hear someone who's fully geared claiming gear isn't at all important to him.

Yes, see when gear comes in naturally and quick you simply don't have to care about it that much. If gear gets you all worked up then you're probably not in a very good spot and miss some of the enjoyment others feel.

[clevin]

Gear is a means to the end. Getting gear is merely a means to clearing content, which is the only thing that actually matters to me. So saying 'I don't care about gear' is technically incorrect, because I have to care about gear in order to clear content, but I most certainly do not clear content because I want gear, not at all.

I understand. Part of that was just snark. Part of it is that that person has gotten their gear already.

Again, clearing content isn't the issue if OP is being straight - that was done 4 months ago. Honestly, I'm wondering why they're still clearing weekly on mains.

[zephid]

How long would you continue to raid without getting a gear upgrade? I'm talking about normal/heroic raids where gear is distributed by a loot council.

I would continue to raid as long as the guild continues to raid.

- - - Updated - - -

says the 577 geared raider.

Just because you have gear does not mean that you raid for gear. Even if the sole reason for you raiding is to have fun with your friend you'll eventually end up with a full set of gear.

[Herecius]

I understand. Part of that was just snark. Part of it is that that person has gotten their gear already.

Again, clearing content isn't the issue if OP is being straight - that was done 4 months ago. Honestly, I'm wondering why they're still clearing weekly on mains.

OP seems to be primarily upset that items that are small upgrades for him (heroic to warforged) are going to others with lower ilvls that the upgrades would be more powerful for. Honestly that seems like a reasonable thing to do, to send upgrades where they can provide the most power to return, so I don't particularly think OP is in the right here to be really upset over it.

[Granyala]

Gear is only the means to an end for me - progression. As long as my raid keeps progressing and the reason why I'm not getting loot isn't because the loot distribution is unfair, getting gear is only a path to what I really want. Killing heroic bosses.

Pretty much my opinion.
Running 1-2 months w/o gear is no rare occurence, but is dampened by the fact that you see the rest of your raid getting stronger and making progress.
As soon as that progress is over with, my tolerance sinks drastically. I hate farming content, esp content that offers me no more upgrades.

[Sliske]

Not long. I find it fun pushing WoL ranks after progress. If there was no loot / upgrades then after progress i'd quit raiding for sure

[Kalorna]

As of right now? 8 weeks and counting.

Casual :P

If I was being passed over for gear repeatedly without reason, probably a few weeks then I'd say something to make sure I wasn't missing something about why I was being passed over. If stuff just isn't dropping or other people need it more (or during progress when certain classes/roles need more gear) then I'm happy just raiding without getting stuff pretty much till the end of the tier. It is nice to get upgrades though, especially when its stuff like tier/trinkets that play a big role in how your class plays.

[clevin]

OP seems to be primarily upset that items that are small upgrades for him (heroic to warforged) are going to others with lower ilvls that the upgrades would be more powerful for. Honestly that seems like a reasonable thing to do, to send upgrades where they can provide the most power to return, so I don't particularly think OP is in the right here to be really upset over it.

Agreed. On the other hand, I've been the raider who helps clear the fights the first time, dealing with all of the wipes and learning... then someone decides that they want to raid and comes in when things are on farm for easy loot. One the one hand, you give them loot because it's a bigger upgrade for them. On the other, you're funneling the rewards for dealing with all the wipes (H WF stuff) to the person who sat out the hard progression. it's a balance - not a black and white line.

- - - Updated - - -

Pretty much my opinion.
Running 1-2 months w/o gear is no rare occurence, but is dampened by the fact that you see the rest of your raid getting stronger and making progress.
As soon as that progress is over with, my tolerance sinks drastically. I hate farming content, esp content that offers me no more upgrades.

OP's raid cleared 4 months ago. Progress isn't the issue here.

[purplekayak]

I raid 6 hours a week. We clear 14/14H each week. After we finish raiding on Tuesday night I log off till next Tuesday. Raiding and gearing up is about the only thing left that enjoyable in this game. Im paying $15 a month to play 4 days a month. If im not getting gear from the raids, I feel like my money is wasted.

- - - Updated - - -

OP seems to be primarily upset that items that are small upgrades for him (heroic to warforged) are going to others with lower ilvls that the upgrades would be more powerful for. Honestly that seems like a reasonable thing to do, to send upgrades where they can provide the most power to return, so I don't particularly think OP is in the right here to be really upset over it.

The players that these items are usually going to are not only lower geared but also they have been in the guild a shorter time and tend to stand in fire.

[Deleted]

How long would you continue to raid without getting a gear upgrade? I'm talking about normal/heroic raids where gear is distributed by a loot council.

For months. I would not raid for months without any noticable progress though.

[wow2011]

Possibly, but it's amusing to hear someone who's fully geared claiming gear isn't at all important to him.

Why? My char is geared and I don't care about gear at all. I always pass on loot if others want the same loot as I am. Case in point, a tank pally said sp trinket from Immerseus is his bis and I passed to him willingly. I only care about loot distribution when I believe it negatively impacts our chance to success (aka someone getting pvp offspec loot over someone who needs it for main, or someone getting side grade when that item is someone else's bis).

But yeah, people who don't care about gear exist and if they happen to be in a heroic progression guild then they will naturally be geared. There is no conflict at all.

[Skroe]

Indefinitely. In fact I'd prefer it. I wish gear in this game was entirely cosmetic and power increases came through playing.

Raiding for gear was stupid in 2005. It was stupid in 2009. It's stupid in 2014. It's a means to an end to do harder content.

Besides, I lived Sunwell / Warlock Tier 6 4 Piece / the Most Efficient DPS this game has ever had / The Golden age of Demonic Sacrifice. Warlocks reached "peak gear power" in 2008.

[Deleted]

Possibly, but it's amusing to hear someone who's fully geared claiming gear isn't at all important to him.

It still isn't. Gear is just a biproduct of actually clearing content at a steady pace. I could care less about the gear that will be replaced next tier or expansion. The achievements and fos:s are fun though.

[Louis CK]

How long would you continue to raid without getting a gear upgrade? I'm talking about normal/heroic raids where gear is distributed by a loot council.

Assuming you're talking about being passed by on loot distribution rather than items just not dropping, correct?

I've honestly given away more gear in my raid time than I've probably taken for myself (I remember when I first downed H Madness I was still in RF gloves lol). I don't mind supporting the raid as a whole, and if a piece of loot benefits someone else more (and they know how to use it), I'd mainly just want to make progression.

However, if the guild is bleeding raiders and recruiting new people all the time, being passed up constantly for people that won't be sticking around anyway would be pretty shitty. But that's really a guild problem rather than a loot problem. I probably wouldn't stay in that situation very long.

The flip side of my first example, however, is if we're feeding gear to someone who clearly doesn't know how to use it, that's not okay. Feeding a poor player more gear is just like disenchanting it IMO. Put it to use and replace the poor raider.

So, for me... It's hard to say. There's too many dynamics to really say what I'd do without having a more specific scenario.

[Sosuke Aizen]

If I had a raid team that used Loot Council and I was regularly passed up for upgrades I needed to give them as marginal upgrades or sidegrades to favored raiders, not long.

This exactly. Maybe you should talk to the Council to see what's going on...