[Balance] Slip's Boomkin Theorycrafting (7.2.5+)

[Slippykins]

I don't see why OI is that low on ST. It doesn't make sense in my experience and it doesn't seem that consistent with previous simulations.

Also in regards to Elune, it's easy to make an estimation if you still have the simulation results (just flat out multiply the filler dmg by 8%). In my experience the LS/SW is around ~35% of total damage so the boots would be a 2.8% dps increase and end up at around 675k-ish.

Correct, this is how I estimated Elune as third best for ST.

In his previous sims, ED simmed as 8.1% dps increase, IFE as 5.7% dps increase and OI as 4% dps increase on single target. Now (and even though OI got indirectly buffed from the starfall scaling change), if we assume that the baseline is like, say 650k, ED sims at 10.8%, IFE at 7.5% and OI at 2.8%.

For the record I also have ED, so my experience is definitely skewed (more SS>more procs) and thus, I'm mostly looking at the sims.

The first analysis had a no-legendary base and did not take into account stat changes, wheres this analysis does not have a no-legendary base case and does take into account legendary stat distributions. As such, you can't make direct % comparisons.

[Myztikrice]

Does Wax and Wane affect the ranking of Lady and the Child in any meaningful way?

[Adramelch]

The first analysis had a no-legendary base and did not take into account stat changes, wheres this analysis does not have a no-legendary base case and does take into account legendary stat distributions. As such, you can't make direct % comparisons.

Yeah, that much is obvious (and I arbitrarily defined a base case just to make a point so to speak), but it still doesn't make much sense to me how ED and IFE were 4% and 1.5% better than OI previously and suddenly they are 7.8% and 4.6% better now. Sure T19/trinkets play their role to an extent but OI also got indirectly buffed.

[Slippykins]

Yeah, that much is obvious (and I arbitrarily defined a base case just to make a point so to speak), but it still doesn't make much sense to me how ED and IFE were 4% and 1.5% better than OI previously and suddenly they are 7.8% and 4.6% better now. Sure T19/trinkets play their role to an extent but OI also got indirectly buffed.

I would say it's most likely attributed to the better stat distribution of ED and IFE as compared with OI. ED has a boatload of int, IFE has a boatload of haste. OI has neither of those, and the wrist slot has the worst scaling stats with ilvl. As such, i940 is worth a lot more for ED/IFE. I can review the results for OI when I retabulate to account for the Elune buff. Have to get the SimC guys to implement that first.

[Killuha]

It seems like Circadian Invocation isn't implemented in simc, is there any way to check the debuffs of fluffypillow?

[Xalkir]

Any idea how the legendary belt, Cinidaria, stacks up in ST and AoE fights ?

[MV Kaa]

Any idea how the legendary belt, Cinidaria, stacks up in ST and AoE fights ?

Not well. Especially since AoE fights adds drop below 90% health super quick.

[Slippykins]

It seems like Circadian Invocation isn't implemented in simc, is there any way to check the debuffs of fluffypillow?

It's not implemented currently.

Any idea how the legendary belt, Cinidaria, stacks up in ST and AoE fights ?

As Kaa said, unfortunately it's fairly crap. Probably on the level of KJ trinket. Both legendaries have situational use however.

[Raphan]

2a. A Quick Aside: Starsurge or Starfall?

Let's assume you're running the cheese cleave build, SotF/SS/SD, and you find yourself in a single-target situation during the fight. Do you Starfall or Starsurge as your AP spender?

puu.sh/tsRbC/d748fad295.png

Answer: Starsurge, especially if you have 2pc or 4pc. If you have ED, it's strongly suggested to take Starlord for weaving.

I would love to sim this on my character and see the results; might you still have handy the APL(s) you used to do this analysis? I haven't much of any experience in changing the APL around so I am not sure how to make even this basic of a change.

Did you consider trying an APL that keeps up starfall constantly but otherwise casts starsurge? A plain-english APL of that might be:

1. If Astral Power is 80 or more, cast Starsurge.
2. If the boss is dead in 4 GCDs or less and Astral Power is 40 or more, cast Starsurge.
3. If Astral Power is 40 or more and Starfall is not active, cast Starfall.
4. Otherwise wait.

I have a suspicion that that would be a bit more competitive than Starfall-only.

[Slippykins]

I would love to sim this on my character and see the results; might you still have handy the APL(s) you used to do this analysis? I haven't much of any experience in changing the APL around so I am not sure how to make even this basic of a change.

Did you consider trying an APL that keeps up starfall constantly but otherwise casts starsurge? A plain-english APL of that might be:

1. If Astral Power is 80 or more, cast Starsurge.
2. If the boss is dead in 4 GCDs or less and Astral Power is 40 or more, cast Starsurge.
3. If Astral Power is 40 or more and Starfall is not active, cast Starfall.
4. Otherwise wait.

I have a suspicion that that would be a bit more competitive than Starfall-only.

Hey!

I don't have the APL anymore unfortunately, but what I did was just comment out the relevant spell for the test (ie. comment out starsurge and make starfall the AP spender for all targets).

Starfall + starsurge filler would only be better in a scenario where you have excess AP, ie. you generate more than 5 AP/sec. This is possible with current gear, but not by much (Wrath is about 8 AP/sec and is better than Starfire for most haste levels). So the difference will be marginal at best. Additionally, this needs to boost the Starfall APL up and above the Starsurge APL, which is unlikely due to the gap.

However, I'm happy to see your results if you do end up trying it out!

[Raphan]

I made a post where I quoted your 2A section about Starsurge v. Starfall with full AOE build, but it got deleted somehow. Second and final (briefer) try in case of a bug:

Do you still have the APL from that sim? I would love to sim it for myself with my gear but I don't know what to change exactly.

Did you try a hybrid sim of, for example, "Cast Starsurge if above 80 Astral Power, Otherwise Cast Starfall if above 40 Astral Power and Starfall not active, Otherwise do nothing?"

[Slippykins]

I made a post where I quoted your 2A section about Starsurge v. Starfall with full AOE build, but it got deleted somehow. Second and final (briefer) try in case of a bug:

Do you still have the APL from that sim? I would love to sim it for myself with my gear but I don't know what to change exactly.

Did you try a hybrid sim of, for example, "Cast Starsurge if above 80 Astral Power, Otherwise Cast Starfall if above 40 Astral Power and Starfall not active, Otherwise do nothing?"

See post above yours, it seems they were automoderated.

[Killuha]

It's not implemented currently.

Are the simc devs aware? I don't see an open issue concerning it.

[Slippykins]

Are the simc devs aware? I don't see an open issue concerning it.

Yep, it's a common theme for most specs right now. I put up a ticket for Elune specifically, though.

[wewe]

So i just simmed my character with the latest simc build, used default setting and patchwerk. All looks ok exept for the fact that im simming higher numbers with 25% HASTE ED then with 31% HASTE ED. Isn't the ED haste cap supose to be worth it even if losing couple of ilvls for it?
snag.gy / Un61vH.jpg

gear used:
pastebin.com / QS8qbBrQ

[Slippykins]

So i just simmed my character with the latest simc build, used default setting and patchwerk. All looks ok exept for the fact that im simming higher numbers with 25% HASTE ED then with 31% HASTE ED. Isn't the ED haste cap supose to be worth it even if losing couple of ilvls for it?
snag.gy / Un61vH.jpg

gear used:
pastebin.com / QS8qbBrQ

Sometimes it's not. It depends on how many haste modifiers you have (Inc, Hero, Metronome, Whispers, Mark of the Claw).

[Deleted]

I'm here just to say how cool this post is!
Also, how does the rotation change with WnW?

[Slippykins]

I'm here just to say how cool this post is!
Also, how does the rotation change with WnW?

I've seen some really cool things with WnW, like 2m+ DPS on Krosus just spamming Moonfire!

[Deleted]

I've seen some really cool things with WnW, like 2m+ DPS on Krosus just spamming Moonfire!

Woow, I'll make sure I try that next time on mm Krosus!

[Slippykins]

Woow, I'll make sure I try that next time on mm Krosus!

If we keep this up, people might start believing us.