[BREWMASTER] 7.X Discussion Thread

[Deleted]

The current bonus is strong and a real quality of life thing, when you do stuff without healers. In raid fights, the 2 set is not that impactful, because you spawn quite a few orbs anyway, but the 4 set is just really good. For non-raid stuff, the 2 set is pretty nice, so I think it is overall a great bonus.

T21 on the other hand is a clusterfuck. The 2p is just nonexistant and I will only equip 2p if the non Haste set pieces happen to have high ilvl. I still hope and pray that they fix this shitty thing. The 4p is more difficult. At 100% it will degenerate our gameplay and be too powerful. At 25% it was a nice aoe dps thing, without any defensive utility (so a set for m+ maybe).

If they wanted to fix this set, they should change the 2p from BoF to BoS, that way you always get the benefit without massively overcapping. It might be too strong, due to the higher frequency of use but I think giving us an additional stack of EB on BoS would be fine. If this is too strong, make a different buff with half the efficiency of an EB stack and make it apply that.

For the 4 set.... Without the 2p being what it is, at 100% it would still be alright. You can't use BoF to force dodges on single target anymore, but you guarantee a reset while actively tanking, so it could be fine. This would still make it necessary to rework the leg chest, because there is no reason to wear both. I would still prefer them fully replacing both bonuses. Lets wait for the results from raidtesting with those bonuses to come back and see what blizz makes of these.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

The current bonus is strong and a real quality of life thing, when you do stuff without healers. In raid fights, the 2 set is not that impactful, because you spawn quite a few orbs anyway, but the 4 set is just really good. For non-raid stuff, the 2 set is pretty nice, so I think it is overall a great bonus.

T21 on the other hand is a clusterfuck. The 2p is just nonexistant and I will only equip 2p if the non Haste set pieces happen to have high ilvl. I still hope and pray that they fix this shitty thing. The 4p is more difficult. At 100% it will degenerate our gameplay and be too powerful. At 25% it was a nice aoe dps thing, without any defensive utility (so a set for m+ maybe).

If they wanted to fix this set, they should change the 2p from BoF to BoS, that way you always get the benefit without massively overcapping. It might be too strong, due to the higher frequency of use but I think giving us an additional stack of EB on BoS would be fine. If this is too strong, make a different buff with half the efficiency of an EB stack and make it apply that.

For the 4 set.... Without the 2p being what it is, at 100% it would still be alright. You can't use BoF to force dodges on single target anymore, but you guarantee a reset while actively tanking, so it could be fine. This would still make it necessary to rework the leg chest, because there is no reason to wear both. I would still prefer them fully replacing both bonuses. Lets wait for the results from raidtesting with those bonuses to come back and see what blizz makes of these.

I'm curious whether even ONE raiding BrM has given Blizz positive feedback on the current iteration of T21. Even one. Just looking at it I'm scratching my head and wondering "Who thought this was a good idea?" and "Do you even brew?"

[Deleted]

Coming up with 36 meaningful and interesting set boni every tier can't be easy. Let's just hope they see the light and give us something that isn't as shit.

[ReD-EyeD]

Coming up with 36 meaningful and interesting set boni every tier can't be easy. Let's just hope they see the light and give us something that isn't as shit.

There is a difference between meaningful/interesting and not absolutely horrible.

[Deleted]

There is a difference between meaningful/interesting and not absolutely horrible.

We are talking about the people that designed the Brewmaster leg boots and failed to notice that they put 2 legendarys in the belt slot. Manage your expectations^^

[ReD-EyeD]

We are talking about the people that designed the Brewmaster leg boots and failed to notice that they put 2 legendarys in the belt slot. Manage your expectations^^

Boots are horrible, yes, but a lot of classes have double waist (or other slot) legendaries too.

Edit: Actually I just checked it and there are only monks that have shared legendary in ONE spec. I didn't even realized it.

Surprisingly, both belts are the only legendaries on BRM I still don't have.

[Marrilaife]

Edit: Actually I just checked it and there are only monks that have shared legendary in ONE spec. I didn't even realized it.

Resto druids have a belt too, but I guess that means they can't get Cinidaria, contrary to other shared legendaries like Aggramar's Stride or Norgannon's that don't exclude healers and drop for any spec of that armor type. Crafted legendaries can overlap too. Ok, they're not a drop but it still sucks to buy these for an alt at 101 only to get legendary for the same slot when you ding 110. One reason why I waited for example on my DK to see if I won't get the belt first before buying the crafted one.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

Warriors have the crafted plate belt and Thunder belt.

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I'd have no problem with them recycling old set bonuses, or tweaking them slightly, as long as they were appealing. I don't need them to be OP or anything; I'd just like them to be an incentive for collecting tier rather than a disincentive.

[keqe]

Warriors have the crafted plate belt and Thunder belt.

The point is that there were 2 legendaries for one slot on one spec at launch of the legendary system. This was very much unintended and blizzard addressed this as a "accident". At that time you were supposed to use any combo of 2 legendaries you wanted.

And with legendaries being much more rare being unlucky to have 2 belts as your first 2 legendaries was really bad.

Of course now when there have been added more legendaries there is (intended and/or inevitable) overlap. Like when antorus opens there are up to 4 rings for one spec.

[Evilmoo]

Patch has been confirmed for tommorow.
Shitty BRM set bonus goes live.
gg

[Gorsameth]

Patch has been confirmed for tommorow.
Shitty BRM set bonus goes live.
gg

easy to changes set bonuses before raid opens up.
Not that I expect they will but now is hardly the definitive cutoff

[Evilmoo]

easy to changes set bonuses before raid opens up.
Not that I expect they will but now is hardly the definitive cutoff

no way, they will never change anything because blizz does not listen to players.
And they will not change in before tokens can be acquired - before opening raid, and will not change after raid is opened unless it proves to be very powerful, then they will nerf it.

[vsb]

Is it just me? Or is T21 a significant step backwards from T20 for Brewmaster?

If you dodge something, you don't need to heal it. I think that in raids T21 will be good and you always have an option to use 2xT20, especially because 4xT20 is pretty weak IMO. You will miss set legendaries, but only head is defensive and quite situational, so not a big deal.

But with mythic+ dodge is dangerous, because the more you rely on it, the weaker you will be with any stun or mobs from behind.

[Deleted]

I don't think many brewmasters will run 4p +2p regularly. You will probably still want to have shoulders. Also specifically for raiding I think T20 4p is the stronger part of the set. A lot better than 2 pc which is more a dungeon/open world kind of thing, but maybe I just underestimate that. Since T21 2p is meaningless you won't play T20 4p + T21 2p for the boni.

[dcc626]

I don't think many brewmasters will run 4p +2p regularly. You will probably still want to have shoulders. Also specifically for raiding I think T20 4p is the stronger part of the set. A lot better than 2 pc which is more a dungeon/open world kind of thing, but maybe I just underestimate that. Since T21 2p is meaningless you won't play T20 4p + T21 2p for the boni.

im likely to use offset pieces for raiding and 4pc t21 for m+ if it stays as it is. its not going to make or break my ability to be a good tank.

[Deleted]

im likely to use offset pieces for raiding and 4pc t21 for m+ if it stays as it is. its not going to make or break my ability to be a good tank.

This, at least if the expected nerf for the 4p is coming. Question is, what 100 talent will you run for M+ with this? Elusive Dance could actually work well with this.

[Xequecal]

I don't think many brewmasters will run 4p +2p regularly. You will probably still want to have shoulders. Also specifically for raiding I think T20 4p is the stronger part of the set. A lot better than 2 pc which is more a dungeon/open world kind of thing, but maybe I just underestimate that. Since T21 2p is meaningless you won't play T20 4p + T21 2p for the boni.

You have this totally backwards. T20 4p is very weak, T20 2p is incredibly strong. People will absolutely run 2pc + 4pc for raiding. 25% more damage on Keg Smash is not worth a tier bonus.

[Deleted]

You have this totally backwards. T20 4p is very weak, T20 2p is incredibly strong. People will absolutely run 2pc + 4pc for raiding. 25% more damage on Keg Smash is not worth a tier bonus.

Let's analyze the 2p for raiding. On my last Mistress kill, I spawned 78 orbs and used 49 brews. With a 40% chance on every brew about 20 of those should come from the set bonus. That is roughly 25%. From all of my healing taken, I did 26.5% myself and of my selfhealing orbs make up slightly less than 50%. There probably is some component within Celestial Fortune, but I have no way to account for that at this point.

Taking all these percentages together means, 2p provided roughly 25%*26.5*50=3.3125% of my healing taken. Even if we want to account for the additional celestial Fortune heals, we might get to 3.5% as I'm currently running on very low crit. But even if it is 4%, I wouldn't exactly consider it "incredibly strong".

On the same fight, my dtps from stagger was always more or less somewhere around 400k. That means every orb reduced damage taken by roughly 200k damage (5% reduction of dtps over a 10 sec period). That means the 78 orbs removed 15.6m stagger damage. That is somewhere in the region of 4%. Which is not particularly great either. So all in all our bonus was more of "feel good" bonus (which is a good thing) and not as mandatory as many of us thought it was.

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25% more damage on Keg Smash is not worth a tier bonus.

That depends, is 3% more healing on you and thus 0.5% more healing overall (still looking at the same log, if you have wildly different results please let me know, it is a small sample size) worth 0.3% more damage overall? That doesn't take into account, that the rotation gets a lot more fluid and efficient with the shoulders. I'd say this seems like a fine trade.

[A-sayo]

Hello again, fellow Alcoholics !

Last night was our 2nd night of progress on Mythic Avatar. So far we managed to put the boss ~40% after the 3rd shield. Here are the logs . I'd like your point of view on which talents/gear worked out best for you.

During our pulls, I felt like most my healing received were from HoTs/Beacon. In our last attempts, I tried a more defensive approach going HT/LB and equipping the Wrist legendaries so that I could try to pump out more Purifies and to avoid dropping the DGD HoT. Yet...I still feel like I'm doing something wrong. Do you see anything ?

Thank you in advance and happy brewing !

EDIT :
I do not have the Head/Waist/Boots legendaries.
Trinkets available are : 920 Arcano, 935 Reliquary, 900 Immortality, 915 WHoD, AHR.

[Caprix]

Let's analyze the 2p for raiding. On my last Mistress kill, I spawned 78 orbs and used 49 brews. With a 40% chance on every brew about 20 of those should come from the set bonus. That is roughly 25%. From all of my healing taken, I did 26.5% myself and of my selfhealing orbs make up slightly less than 50%. There probably is some component within Celestial Fortune, but I have no way to account for that at this point.

Taking all these percentages together means, 2p provided roughly 25%*26.5*50=3.3125% of my healing taken. Even if we want to account for the additional celestial Fortune heals, we might get to 3.5% as I'm currently running on very low crit. But even if it is 4%, I wouldn't exactly consider it "incredibly strong".

On the same fight, my dtps from stagger was always more or less somewhere around 400k. That means every orb reduced damage taken by roughly 200k damage (5% reduction of dtps over a 10 sec period). That means the 78 orbs removed 15.6m stagger damage. That is somewhere in the region of 4%. Which is not particularly great either. So all in all our bonus was more of "feel good" bonus (which is a good thing) and not as mandatory as many of us thought it was.

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That depends, is 3% more healing on you and thus 0.5% more healing overall (still looking at the same log, if you have wildly different results please let me know, it is a small sample size) worth 0.3% more damage overall? That doesn't take into account, that the rotation gets a lot more fluid and efficient with the shoulders. I'd say this seems like a fine trade.

Thanks for the nice write up with numbers. Both 2P and 4P don't look so mandatory indeed. However, I think the "feel good" bonus is highly related to the fact that you can stack the orbs and only "use them if needed". So both 2P and 4P don't change the fact that BRMs needs "quite a lot" of "very smooth" external healing, but give them a nice option to top their life/survive on their own for a limited time when needed.