Traditional raid tier sets will be removed with BfA

[Zelk]

That isn't why they are removing them. Set bonuses essentially locked those slots for you. In Legion, we have 4 tier pieces and 2 legendary slots that basically can't be replaced. So they are trying to address that problem by removing as many dead slots as possible.

And yet they add a new piece we will have for the entire expansion, as well as 3 other pieces tied to it which we won't change much either. Why not just stick to tier instead?

[corebit]

set bonuses should be better then. Why remove them instead?

Easier said than done, especially when you have 36 set bonuses to balance each tier. That's what Blizzard has done in the past, either by nerfing the previous tier set, or buffing or reworking the new one. But all it does is piss off a large portion of the raider community each time.

What do you find exciting about tier set bonuses exactly? There is no choice involved. You just wear them to get the mandatory passive bonuses, and with Legiondaries they make equipping tier sets even less fun. My two BIS legiondaries take two tier slots, so I have to sacrifice one of them just so I can still have 4-piece bonus.

[shaunika123]

dont know what class you are playing and if you live in a „itemlevel > all“ heaven. dont know if you ever have really tried to min/max a bit in this xpac at all.

however, i play shaman.

- you can go to https://www.stormearthandlava.com/ele/artifact and look at the graphs.
- then you can look at Legendary item combos and tell me, i.e. as ENH, what is better: aikanus combo or ...
- after that you can go to AMR (without premium) and tell me: 4pc, 2pc, or all my high WF/TF items?
- after that, you sim all that stuff, to validate/test.

if you can give me accurate proofable answers, in 3 minutes, you are really my hero.

good luck.

a: nowhere in my post have I said "ilvl>all", then again I play a rogue and that generally is the situation, outside of haste drops.

b: If after the new patch being out for like 5-6 months it's still not clear what legendary combos are best in what situation, then either it doesnt matter, or noone cares about enha shamans(which I'd doubt)

c: raidbots.com needs no premium, and it's a fantastic tool, you cna compare talents, legendaries, gear, trinkets, relics everything. and it only takes a couple minutes.

d: and there are logs which tell you clear as day what the best options are.

yes, we also have tons of graphs, legendary combos, and what have you, but ultimately it all boils down to what YOU have. which at a time wont be more than 2-3 different options.

I dont even really get what your issue is. like having to decide whether a new drop is better or not is making the game bad cos you cnat just look at a bis list and decide based on that?

I seriously for the life of me don't understand what your issue is. what gear to equip and in which combinations to equip them SHOULD be a meaningful choice, not some pre determined BS. so how exactly is it a bad thing?


seriously, I got 5 alts on 110, none of them have I had any issues deciding what items to wear, because I do my research and occasionally not afraid to ask people I know who are good with the class, then eventually I learn and can decide from myself. it's a part of learning a class. not everything should be easy.

[Twilight Cultist]

which haven't locked you for more than a decade suddenly is a problem now, they are simply taking the lazy route after the shitstorm of balancing this expansion. and fanboies are out defending them, what a surprise.

Because WoW has changed over the years. There are new ways of acquiring gear aside from raids. The biggest problem I have had with the Mythic+ weekly chest is that I have gotten a lot of pieces that would normally be an upgrade, but it would replace something in my legendary slot or my tier slot. That really sucks when you only get a chest once per week.

[huehuehue]

And yet they add a new piece we will have for the entire expansion, as well as 3 other pieces tied to it which we won't change much either. Why not just stick to tier instead?

Its just the new 1 xpac long gimmick. Tier sets are getting the Legion weapon treatment. Turning an existing thing into a new feature with some improvements.

[Zelk]

Easier said than done, especially when you have 36 set bonuses to balance each tier. That's what Blizzard has done in the past, either by nerfing the previous tier set, or buffing or reworking the new one. But all it does is piss off a large portion of the raider community each time.

What do you find exciting about tier set bonuses exactly? There is no choice involved. You just wear them to get the mandatory passive bonuses, and with Legiondaries they make equipping tier sets even less fun. My two BIS legiondaries take two tier slots, so I have to sacrifice one of them just so I can still have 4-piece bonus.

Tier set bonuses add flavour to a tier. When they are well designed you might think back to a raid and remember part of it. They are meant to be a unique little thing for that raid. It's true Blizzard haven't done that very well, but if they've seen that as an issue they should try to solve it instead of just removing them.
Also I'm sure you're aware there are 6 set pieces so even with two bis legendaries in those 6 slots you can have your 4 set? Which is another point, set bonuses are something you work towards other a month or so rather than straight away, slowing down the power rise you get from a new tier and extending it's challenge.

[Sevarin]

they could just be less moronic and remove titanforge.

[Roccatex]

Tier set bonuses add flavour to a tier. When they are well designed you might think back to a raid and remember part of it. They are meant to be a unique little thing for that raid. It's true Blizzard haven't done that very well, but if they've seen that as an issue they should try to solve it instead of just removing them.
Also I'm sure you're aware there are 6 set pieces so even with two bis legendaries in those 6 slots you can have your 4 set? Which is another point, set bonuses are something you work towards other a month or so rather than straight away, slowing down the power rise you get from a new tier and extending it's challenge.

Whats the difference between having a certain spell enhancement on the azerite items or as set?

[huehuehue]

they could just be less moronic and remove titanforge.

blasphemy. then the treadmill can end for players.

[Aaronioslo]

I’m not defending blizz. It’ll look that way to you of course because you like to throw out random numbers without any basis at all.

I asked you to show me how the gear will only be a 1% increase. What did you do to get that #? You still haven’t shown me how you got that number.

So not only are you pulling random numbers out of your ass, your throwing out insults because you have no idea where you got that number from and insulting me is easier.

Way to go dude.

because that's common sense, let's say some trait increase the damage of one of your skill by 5%, how do you imagine a 15ilvl increase will make that trait do? to 10%? its akin to how ilvl changes the trinkets damage now, it's very marginal

let alone if they are utility based, it will most likely be unrelated to ilvl

[Twilight Cultist]

And yet they add a new piece we will have for the entire expansion, as well as 3 other pieces tied to it which we won't change much either. Why not just stick to tier instead?

The neck is similar to the artifact weapon. They haven't talked about it, but there will likely be things like Relics to increase the power of the neck. On the topic of the 3 empowered slots. Those don't work like tier. According to what we have seen so far, all pieces in the game in those slots (Helm, Shoulders, Chest) are empowered by the Heart of Azeroth. So you will replace them like you would any other of gear aside from the fact that you have to take the certain traits they have into account when seeing what is better. Also, all empowered pieces with the same name have the exact same traits. So if you get that piece in LFR and then get it again on Heroic, they will have the same traits, so there is no RNG involved.

[huehuehue]

I understand that this must happen as a result of having Azerite gear in those slots, but I do hope those traits or whatever change each tier. I liked that aspect of sets. Different feel/playstyle(if done right) for each tier.

[Twilight Cultist]

they could just be less moronic and remove titanforge.

Titanforging isn't the issue.

[Sundreamer]

thank god...now i don't have to wonder whether i should be replacing my 930/935 items for some 915/920 gear just for the set bonus

[Wolfie of Medivh]

I have no issue with M+ being lucrative, don't get me wrong. But they need to give raiding higher incentive then M+, and this WAS gear sets, or people will take the easy way out and that hurts everyone.

Basically if the trash M+ to save raiding you kill M+, but if they don't dangle something over raiding people will just spam M+.

Raiding is just much harder logistically to manage then M+.

Why? Why should people get more just because they have some organizational skills? I'd rather have 5 friends I know I can rely on to have fun then 15 people where I dislike dealing with half of them.

[Twilight Cultist]

I understand that this must happen as a result of having Azerite gear in those slots, but I do hope those traits or whatever change each tier. I liked that aspect of sets. Different feel/playstyle(if done right) for each tier.

I believe they said at Blizzcon that they intent to add new traits as the expansion progresses. So I would assume that Helm/Chests/Shoulders that drop in a new raid tier will have unique traits that function like tier sets bonuses.

[Aaronioslo]

Because WoW has changed over the years. There are new ways of acquiring gear aside from raids. The biggest problem I have had with the Mythic+ weekly chest is that I have gotten a lot of pieces that would normally be an upgrade, but it would replace something in my legendary slot or my tier slot. That really sucks when you only get a chest once per week.

legendaries are gone, you will still only have 4 pieces locked for sets like always

[Zelk]

thank god...now i don't have to wonder whether i should be replacing my 930/935 items for some 915/920 gear just for the set bonus

Yeah it's really bad having to actually compare gear and make a decision in an rpg.

[shaunika123]

Why? Why should people get more just because they have some organizational skills? I'd rather have 5 friends I know I can rely on to have fun then 15 people where I dislike dealing with half of them.

well, that's basically why, it's less accessible, so it should be more rewarding, otherwise why do it?

of course gear isnt the only thing they can use to reward you, but it's probably the easiest choice.

i'd settle for mounts/titles/cooler transmogs tho which we kinda already have.

IF high level mythic+ can coexist with raiding, then I'M all for it, I just dont want raiding to die because more people choose the path of least resistance. It's already hard enough to recruit people.

[huehuehue]

Why? Why should people get more just because they have some organizational skills? I'd rather have 5 friends I know I can rely on to have fun then 15 people where I dislike dealing with half of them.

larger scale activity should be more lucrative, be glad its only 15 now