Traditional raid tier sets will be removed with BfA

[Corroc]

No, i mean the ZG (original),AQ, ZA, SWP and TotC raids.

ToV shouldn't be excluded either, as it basically is what they are going for as well; items that fit the general look of the place they drop in.

Honestly not even going to argue about this. If you really think that blizzard will stop developing proper looking armor sets thats ok. But there has been nothing said about cuting the art development on armor sets and until they say that all this speculation is just bullshit.

[Deleted]

thats actually good.

[Sammonoske]

Then M+ needs to be nerfed to keep loot from raids ahead.

[Razorice]

Then M+ needs to be nerfed to keep loot from raids ahead.

Hope not. Will be able to ditch my raid team and run Mythic+ to gear whenever I want.

[Deianeira]

So....you *could* get your BIS from the mythic+ then, as it could be equivalent item level to a mythic raid item? What's with people saying mythic raids will be the *only* source of BIS suddenly because of this change/azerite gear? As far as I can see, the overall 'system' remains basically unchanged...except now you will be using non-tier (you'll still have a boss which drops your BIS helm, just like the boss now drops the tier token for a helm)

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And azerite helm/shoulders/chest can only drop in raids? There will be no helms/chests/shoulders in mythic+? That is what people seem to be saying because they're saying 'well, now your BIS will always come from raids', and I'm not seeing how?

No he is saying that ALL helms, chests, and shoulders in the game will be azerite and none of them will be able to WF/TF.

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You really think they are going to make only 4 sets of armor to drop in future raids? If you were developer would you do that? Decide that "hey lets only make 4 sets of armor, one for each armor profiency". Because taking away set bonuses actually makes sense but just making 4 armor sets when there is 12 different classes in the game doesn't.

Especially sine the Allied races will have Heritage armor, so no they will not just make 4 sets of armor

[Deleted]

Especially sine the Allied races will have Heritage armor, so no they will not just make 4 sets of armor

Yes, each of the races gets 1 set of armor, which can be applied to any sort of armor (plate,...,cloth ; much like the SW/orgrimmar armors)... that serves more as evidence for lazyness than the other way around...

[Mlz]

feels good as finally mythic + gear wont be inferior to raid gear due to lack of sets

raids can go f.... themselves now with mythic + being their clear best feature of game.

should have changed it years ago - they wouldnt loose milions of subs due to catering only to raiders.

Aw, but it's easier to carry baddies like you in bigger groups tho?!

[Soon-TM]

The problem with traditional set bonuses has two sides: if the bonuses are strong, then you are stuck with those pieces for a long, LONG time. I still remember wearing the 2pc T5 (back in BC) all the way up to Naxx, because it was THAT good. I had to pass over a lot of Sunwell gear in order to keep the tier bonus, which certainly s blew dinosaur balls.

OTOH, if set bonuses are weak, the entire tier becomes just... meh, even if it comes from an amazing raid. The best example is Ulduar: awesome raid, !@#& tier (at least for Mages). But that's the problem, even if the bonuses are an uninspired, bland PoS, you still have to have it, or your damage/healing/mitigation tanks like a brick. So I am really curious about what Mr. Hazzikostas & company are cooking.

[Tradu]

This is pretty typical of new-blizzard.

-Take a traditional system (tier sets)
-Make a small change to them that people hate (titanforging/2set+4set)
-Instead of reversing new change, scrap the traditional system entirely

Pretty much. Sad to see tier sets go, it was cool to get a little new thing to pay attention to each tier. Hopefully this does mean they'll actually fix specs mid-expansion instead of using tier as a band aid, however. I seriously doubt the Heart of Azeroth will be anything like old tier sets, so far it looks like Netherlight Crucible without the RNG, which is nothing like tier sets.
This also almost certainly means fewer visual sets per tier, which is very unfortunate.

[Deleted]

Myth+ is the future of this game.

Hopefully they consolidate Normal, Heroic and Myth Raid into one and bring out more M+ and 5 man content instead of raid content over the time of an expansion.

[Gadzooks]

Why is it that the tier set mechanic of set bonuses and (hopefully) properly itemized pieces to complete those sets is now outdated? Is it the RNG drops that have them changing their mind? Is it the class-specific art? Is it simply that they want to try something new, that works better? Are set bonuses and tier sets too punishing for a casual player to achieve? Do they undermine the efforts of those who work hard and never get them due to their strength?

Lots of questions to ask. I don't know how to feel about it either, although I'm also unsubbed since Feb, but still find myself wanting to engage with the new expansion talk.

Seems to me like it's another way to keep people with not a lot of time focused on direct improvement of their character. Not getting a 2 or 4 piece can suck week after week. So why not let that person "avoid" the painful RNG of loot drops and let them just pour points into something they already have?

I don't think I'd care much about the mechanics of extra spell effects/modifiers moved to a new system. I just had that with Legendaries, and while the RNg sucked, I was a fan of equipping different things and getting new, changed abilities, moreso like Diablo. I would definitely lament a lack of class-specific armor though.

I have a feeling it's more about the art department struggling to get sets out several times an expansion, and are running out of ideas. Hard to stay fresh with the age of the game.

[Tradu]

Since I've stopped organized raiding I just pug raid or LFR I can understand why people that do m+/WQs want to not feel forced to get those tier sets. On the other hand it kills the motivation to even raid at all now besides trinkets but meh all together. Cool looking tier sets has been iconic and part of wow since the beginning with MC . Does this mean they will be able to avoid making custom armor for all classes per tier raid and just have all the plate armor from the troll raid look the same? Paladin/warrior/DK will be wearing the same troll plate armor? It is a step backwards from some of the cool sets we got this expansion for each class.

If they are just disabling tier set bonuses but we still get unique class armor then I'm fine with that. If i notice only 4 different sets of shoulders that will be sad.

I'm expecting to see 2 visual sets per armor type, because usually there are ~2 pieces per slot per armor type, so having those have different models would make sense. That's obviously still worse than 2-4, depending on armor class, different sets, but I guess at least every class will be able to get the full transmog, rather than missing pieces that only exist as tier. That said, if they do only make 1 set per armor class, that'd be extremely disappointing, because their artists are clearly capable of doing more.

[Deleted]

I have a feeling it's more about the art department struggling to get sets out several times an expansion, and are running out of ideas. Hard to stay fresh with the age of the game.

You are kidding right?

They could add so many more things to the sets ... especially now with belts, boots, gloves being bigger part of the whole set. I mean, have you maybe seen some Asian games and their sets? WoW is just as cartoony and goofy as those, but creativity is immensely lacking compared.

[Deleted]

They can always come back in a future expansion don't see anything wrong with trying something different for an expansion

[shaunika123]

Heroic/normal guilds will clear the raid in 1-2 weeks? wtf are you on lol, your AVERAGE heroic guild clears out heroic in about the same time as your average mythic guild. It's progression for them, its not 1-2 weeks and then farm... that's generally what your average mythic guild does. and 2-3 hours a week? For most of progression you're looking at 6, once it's cleared then maybe 3-4 hrs.

and M+ is closer to Normal/Heroic time investment then Mythic, 3-4 hrs a week and you can be set.

that's just false.

i mean sure there might be guilds that clear it in 6-7 months.

but even pugs clear normal after a few weeks and heroic after like a month. so an actual guild should have no problem with it.


as I said, if 4 measily item pieces are what keep raiding alive, then it's already dead, but I firmly believe that's not the case.

[Deleted]

I don't mind Tier sets being removed gameplay wise, as in the set bonuses. But I do not like the unique design of them being removed though. So if regular gear pieces could have more high quality design I don't see this as a big loss.

But somehow I have a feeling that's not the case and we're stuck with just regular boring gear pieces and no unique high quality design gear sets.

[Tradu]

that's just false.

i mean sure there might be guilds that clear it in 6-7 months.

but even pugs clear normal after a few weeks and heroic after like a month. so an actual guild should have no problem with it.

There's plenty of guilds with bad enough players/communication that clearing normal/heroic is actual progression that takes months.

[Maudib]

Hope not. Will be able to ditch my raid team and run Mythic+ to gear whenever I want.

Will be able to ditch my raid team...

ditch my raid team...

At every turn... Blizzard is opting for features and design choices that harbor this mentality. The game has not been WoW for several years. It's been a solo play game with the option of forcing others to play with you until you want something for yourself.

I have at least bought the expansions and played a couple months each... but BfA will be where I draw the line. Just not interested in this garbage. How in the HELL did they run such a fine, beautiful game into the ground?

[shaunika123]

There's plenty of guilds with bad enough players/communication that clearing normal/heroic is actual progression that takes months.

then clearing high mythic+ efficiently will be just as much of a struggle for them.

generally speaking you need a 15+ for the highest chest reward/week

doing a +15 currently I'd wager is harder than just about every HC boss, maybe barring KJ, especially when it's shitty mods.

[Hebb]

You kidding me? lol Some set bonuses are so powerful they practically define the class.

Which means some classes feel awful to play before completing a tier set, and also when needing to break a set for the next tier if it has a stronger set bonus.

Tier set bonuses were nice before class design started to use them as a crutch.

Just to be clear I'm talking about how classes feel to play, not the dps numbers.