Is Trump a good businessman?

[Dragonhawk]

Is he good at business? Yes. Is some great businessman that you should look to for advice on how to run a long lasting company? No. He has made some good real estate decisions and overall has a good record in the construction field, but most of his companies are high risk areas. Things like hotels and casinos are great if you are after a quick return on your investment but generally not good for steady long term growth. They are also highly prone to fail at some point. That allows you to make some good money in a short period of time, but it also means there is a good chance that your business is going to fail.

Trump is very good at branding though and has gotten a number of people to want his name plastered on their building, as it is a good draw to the public. Overall though his experience is in short term businesses and not long term businesses so he could likely offer some good advice on how to make a few million in a fairly short period of time. If though you are looking to make a business that you could pass on down to future generations and it remain steady and profitable, you would be better off talking to someone like people who started Walmart or IBM.

People have a tendency to equate being smart and experienced in a specific are with being smart in the overall broad dept. People also take how smart a person is by how well he talks. Some of the smartest people in history have not been the most articulate speakers and some of the greatest leaders in history have not been the person with 5 PHDs.

[Tocco686]

He's good at making himself rich

[Celista]

Dont encourage ignorance. If you know an answer, provide it to help educate, you know damn well 9 out of 10 people wont bother googling.

I do, but I'm not going to do it for things that are easily Googled. Not enough hours in the day for that nonsense.

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There's no IQ test, lol. And I said everyone who bitches about him, not everyone. Additionally I didn't even mention his wealth as an indicator of anything.

Well I'm not sure what you're basing his intelligence on, IQ is the standard metric. I agree that he's not a complete fucking moron, however.

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He might not be the best, but he isnt the worst businessman the world has seen.

A lot of people who inherited fortunes are now flat broke and a lof of them have degrees from prominent institutions of learning that would make you think that they would fare better. Trump did a lot of business and while he might have fucked over a lot of people, in the overwhelming majority of cases he remained within the legal system, so fucking someone over would mean he was either exceptionally cunning, or smart and creative. There were clearly things were he overstepped legal boundaries, but so far everything of that nature was settled in court and while his businesses practices where found to be wanting, he didnt step into criminal territory. At least he hasnt been convicted of any such thing. That being said, him stepping into the political arena has given scrutiny to his past businesses. But things that didnt justify legal action against him dont retroactively become actionable simply by him becoming POTUS.

I agree that he has the marks of a narcicistic personality to a worrying degree. I think that is on a whole different level compared to wether or not he was a good businessman. I didnt like the claim that you could run a country like a business. Thats horseshit.
However what I dont agree with is your conclusion that his house of cards is about to fall and it has nothing to do with him being great, smart, capable or otherwise of redeeming qualities of any sort.

There have simply been to many instances where the media proclaimed that his candidacy and later his presedency is sure to fall any second now and each and every time there was something inherently dishonest at the core of it. Thats not to say an allegation was entirely made up, but usually the legal repercussions that media said were soon to arrive aaaany miiinuuute now didnt come. Part wishfull thinking, part blowing things out of proportion with the help of dubious sources.

Face it, the media and their experts for hire promised us ten times over that not only would Hillary win, but that Donald Trump would have left office by now one way or the other.

Clinton showed a lot of signs of overconfidence and Trump, despite his many missteps, had some strategic wins (that, from the sound of things, might have been due in at least part to Russian influence).

But the turning point was right before people went to vote. Clinton was leading in the polls right up to the time that Comey reopened the FBI investigation days before the election. At that point, the damage was done.

Democrats and Republicans alike forget the role that Comey played. Not sure what his motivation was, but it was definitely a calculated move (despite his grandstanding about the enforcement of law being above politics).

[Grapemask]

I haven't listened to you talk about policy. How do you sound?

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Maybe in UK, don't use ambiguous words.

Hitting random buttons in your phone auto suggestion box will deliver better and more coherent policy speeches than Trump. The "derp derp I bet you can't do better" argument only works in a situation where there's actually a chance that the person can't do better, and even then, it's still a logically fallacious argument to begin with.

[IIamaKing]

Hitting random buttons in your phone auto suggestion box will deliver better and more coherent policy speeches than Trump.

I saw John Oliver on Sunday too.

[Z-Man]

He's good at convincing banks to loan him money.

My dog could probably get a better return on investing it, though.

[Dead Moose Fandango]

If at a time Trump was sharp, that time has long passed us by. He's already showing severe signs of senility. The same senility his father had when Donald took advantage of the man to get almost everything in the Will.

Trump may have been good at things, but business, at least in the last decade? Not particularly.

[tumppu]

Somebody shit in your cereal today?

He's just being useless. That's what he does. Across 17k posts, too. That's commitment to being useless, I tell ya.

[McFuu]

Do you understand index funds and compound interest? All he would have had to do was invest what his father gave him in the stock market and hold, and he'd be worth three times more than his current worth.

I hear this constantly. But I don't think you understand. Say he inherited exactly $40m. That isn't cash, the estate was worth $200m. So he inherited the value of $40m of that estate.

Even if he sold off all the assets, he wouldn't even get back $40m.
So the hypothetical is he took all the value of what he inherited and invested it in a market account. He would have $4b now. And what live homeless? So now we are going to get into how much cash did he actually have to invest, which probably wasn't that much compared to the overall value, and really how much of that cash could he afford to invest while maintaining random business ventures, or just his life style.

I know it sounds cute to say "if he just invested it he would have made the same" but that's not how wealth works. I have to imagine that he is better than most at managing his main business or properly delegating that responsibility. Both of which are valuable traits. Using Bill Gates as a comparison is horrendously short-sighted considering the business Bill Gates was in. If the technology to develop computers never took off, Bill Gates would be less successful.

Look back at his interviews from the 80's, at one point Donald Trump was a well spoken, astute businessman. A proper face for a company.

Separating that from the gross caricature that he has become, it's easier to see that he is a successful businessman.

[Celista]

I hear this constantly. But I don't think you understand. Say he inherited exactly $40m. That isn't cash, the estate was worth $200m. So he inherited the value of $40m of that estate.

Even if he sold off all the assets, he wouldn't even get back $40m.
So the hypothetical is he took all the value of what he inherited and invested it in a market account. He would have $4b now. And what live homeless? So now we are going to get into how much cash did he actually have to invest, which probably wasn't that much compared to the overall value, and really how much of that cash could he afford to invest while maintaining random business ventures, or just his life style.

I know it sounds cute to say "if he just invested it he would have made the same" but that's not how wealth works. I have to imagine that he is better than most at managing his main business or properly delegating that responsibility. Both of which are valuable traits. Using Bill Gates as a comparison is horrendously short-sighted considering the business Bill Gates was in. If the technology to develop computers never took off, Bill Gates would be less successful.

Look back at his interviews from the 80's, at one point Donald Trump was a well spoken, astute businessman. A proper face for a company.

Separating that from the gross caricature that he has become, it's easier to see that he is a successful businessman.

I understand the difference between index funds and investing in a market account. The nature of investing is that you seek to get a better return than letting your money sit in a shoebox somewhere (or, nowadays, in a money market account--interest rates are abysmal). This is in fact how wealth works. No one expects Trump to have nonexistent living expenses.

I agree that he was quite articulate in the 80s and is more intelligent (or at least, was) then he lets on.

[Verdugo]

He doesn't need to be anything. He is smarter than all the people who bitch about him on these forums - combined. That's 100% guarantee. Now it's time for some introspection.

Maybe smarter than you, but thats not much of an achievement.

[McFuu]

I understand the difference between index funds and investing in a market account. The nature of investing is that you seek to get a better return than letting your money sit in a shoebox somewhere (or, nowadays, in a money market account--interest rates are abysmal). This is in fact how wealth works. No one expects Trump to have nonexistent living expenses.

I agree that he was quite articulate in the 80s and is more intelligent (or at least, was) then he lets on.

Yes investing is smarter, at least if you have an excess that you can afford to do it. What I'm saying is him being worth 40m doesn't mean he has that as assets he can invest.

[Mormolyce]

I haven't listened to you talk about policy. How do you sound?

His post shows that he is able to construct a complete sentence, so I'd say he has the edge on Trump.

Look, having nuclear — my uncle was a great professor and scientist and engineer, Dr. John Trump at MIT; good genes, very good genes, OK, very smart, the Wharton School of Finance, very good, very smart — you know, if you’re a conservative Republican, if I were a liberal, if, like, OK, if I ran as a liberal Democrat, they would say I’m one of the smartest people anywhere in the world — it’s true! — but when you’re a conservative Republican they try — oh, do they do a number — that’s why I always start off: Went to Wharton, was a good student, went there, went there, did this, built a fortune — you know I have to give my like credentials all the time, because we’re a little disadvantaged — but you look at the nuclear deal, the thing that really bothers me — it would have been so easy, and it’s not as important as these lives are — nuclear is powerful; my uncle explained that to me many, many years ago, the power and that was 35 years ago; he would explain the power of what’s going to happen and he was right, who would have thought? — but when you look at what’s going on with the four prisoners — now it used to be three, now it’s four — but when it was three and even now, I would have said it’s all in the messenger; fellas, and it is fellas because, you know, they don’t, they haven’t figured that the women are smarter right now than the men, so, you know, it’s gonna take them about another 150 years — but the Persians are great negotiators, the Iranians are great negotiators, so, and they, they just killed, they just killed us.

Maybe in UK, don't use ambiguous words.

You sound pissed.

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I hear this constantly. But I don't think you understand. Say he inherited exactly $40m. That isn't cash, the estate was worth $200m. So he inherited the value of $40m of that estate.

Even if he sold off all the assets, he wouldn't even get back $40m.
So the hypothetical is he took all the value of what he inherited and invested it in a market account. He would have $4b now. And what live homeless? So now we are going to get into how much cash did he actually have to invest, which probably wasn't that much compared to the overall value, and really how much of that cash could he afford to invest while maintaining random business ventures, or just his life style.

I know it sounds cute to say "if he just invested it he would have made the same" but that's not how wealth works. I have to imagine that he is better than most at managing his main business or properly delegating that responsibility. Both of which are valuable traits. Using Bill Gates as a comparison is horrendously short-sighted considering the business Bill Gates was in. If the technology to develop computers never took off, Bill Gates would be less successful.

Look back at his interviews from the 80's, at one point Donald Trump was a well spoken, astute businessman. A proper face for a company.

Separating that from the gross caricature that he has become, it's easier to see that he is a successful businessman.

This is a daft comparison, the point is not that he could LITERALLY liquidate all his assets and put them in an index fund. It's that the long term value of his investments underperformed the market, which by definition makes you a poor businessman.

And your Bill Gates comment is hilarious, no shit if computers hadn't taken off Bill Gates would be less rich, that would mean he was putting his money into a lower performing industry. THAT IS THE MEASURE OF A "GOOD BUSINESSMAN".

[Deleted]

No fan of Trump ideologically, but yes he's a good businessman.

He doesn't seem to be very good at running businesses. In fact, he's quite bad at it. Any one who has difficulty making money in property and gambling obviously sucks at it. However, he is very good at writing contracts which screw over his partners and creditors. That's what makes him a good businessman.

Some people might say that makes him a fraud rather a good businessman. I disagree. Your ability to betray your allies and do whatever is necessary is how you succeed as a capitalist. You try and stay out of jail, no more, no less. It is about exploitation, extra-legal methods, dishonesty, deception.

Does this make him fit as president? Probably not. It is kind of like saying can a really good three card monte hustler be a good president? Possibly, but you really need more than that.

[Silver Forte]

He managed to sell a massive load of horseshit to almost the majority of the American voting public, so... I guess?

Most people are stupid and desperate.

[Stormspark]

He's really good at taking other people's money, then filing bankruptcy.

[Deleted]

And 1 Trump is worth than 300x of you or me.

That doesn't mean anything when you start with 300x you or me because of Daddy.

[Daelak]

I hear this constantly. But I don't think you understand. Say he inherited exactly $40m. That isn't cash, the estate was worth $200m. So he inherited the value of $40m of that estate.

Even if he sold off all the assets, he wouldn't even get back $40m.
So the hypothetical is he took all the value of what he inherited and invested it in a market account. He would have $4b now. And what live homeless? So now we are going to get into how much cash did he actually have to invest, which probably wasn't that much compared to the overall value, and really how much of that cash could he afford to invest while maintaining random business ventures, or just his life style.

I know it sounds cute to say "if he just invested it he would have made the same" but that's not how wealth works. I have to imagine that he is better than most at managing his main business or properly delegating that responsibility. Both of which are valuable traits. Using Bill Gates as a comparison is horrendously short-sighted considering the business Bill Gates was in. If the technology to develop computers never took off, Bill Gates would be less successful.

Look back at his interviews from the 80's, at one point Donald Trump was a well spoken, astute businessman. A proper face for a company.

Separating that from the gross caricature that he has become, it's easier to see that he is a successful businessman.

In real estate development, especially in places like NYC, London, Singapore, the developers/owners of a building will extract their equity and re-finance every 3-10 years to get cash out without paying a capital gain, and they rinse, repeat. Trump Sr's fortune was probably valued in the 140 million, and Trump had immediate access to at least 70% of that once it was passed to him. So in terms of playing a investment strategy, Trump being Trump, probably believed he could've beaten the market, which you can in the short term (5-15 years), but over that long a period of time, even if he invested just 10-15% of the initial capital he had, he would be incredibly more wealthier.

[Zoldor]

He's barely a passable manager to his father estate.

Beside the vaste amount of failures and lawsuits he lost... His net worth is down 1b (from 4 to 3) just because of a slack in the manathan real estate last year).

There is a reason he dropped the LLC tax rate to 15%, you might get it once you grow up =D.

The LLC tax rate can be 15% if you take a sub-S election taxwise. He wanted it 15% across the board for all pass-through style businesses. This so far has not come to pass and he's changed the plan to most recently either 20 or 25% for pass-throughs like sole-proprietors and partnerships etc. We'll see if that happens, but even GOP players are out and against it already as his plan is likely to cause a massive loss and debt for the entire country.

Is he a good business man, no. Is he good at PR to certain demographics, yes. I honestly don't think he knows much at all about business itself. He has surrounded himself with decent businessmen. I say decent because if they were great, with the wealth he had, the loans he could get and the reputation of his father they could have done a lot more. If you look at the things Trump himself was a big fan of most of them were utter failures. I like what someone else said, he's a great performance artist and insane Narcissist. Basically the 80s personified in one person.

[Radaney]

Does a good business go bankrupt four times? He / some of his business' went 1.8billion in debt at one point.

Sure going bankrupt can be a sound business decision but I don't think applies when you go down to 1.8billion in debt.